To ask what people have against Labour?

[TheSmallestOneWasMadeline]

I have come across lots of people who, even while admitting that the Conservatives are far from ideal, seem to scrunch their nose up and say 'but, ew, Labour' when talking about politics.

I have to admit I dont understand what it is that people think is so terrible about them and nobody ever cares to elaborate! I always vote for them as I think their principles align pretty closely with my own even if I don't agree with absolutely e everything they stand for.

Could someone please explain what people think is so terrible about them that they would do a worse job at running the country than the Conservatives have done?

They are the nasty party masquerading as being on the side of the people .

Racists towards Jewish people
Miriam Margolyes wishing Boris Johnson dead
Angela Raynor Tory Scum
Jeez even BAME on BAME last week
Jeremy Corbin complete nutter

No matter how much you disagree with someone's politics these personal attacks are horrible .They are unelectable.

For me that's unacceptable. It's not about Labour but about the fact I trust their leader has morals, honesty and integrity.

I don't think someone who refuses to acknowledge that women do not have a penis is someone who has morals, honestly and integrity. Maybe if he fucked off and someone else with those attributes stepped into his place, (and got rid of the majority of the shadow cabinet) then labour might stand a chance. Perhaps.

That one's been tried several times on this thread and it's just a cheap shot. Gender ideology hit Europe and the developed countries of the rest of the world simultaneously. The Tories were quite quick to pick up how unpopular and dangerous it is, held public consultations and took note of all the people pointing out its misogyny and homophobia. Truss has promised to strengthen women's rights as a result and we've seen the GI lackeys removed from various government positions to be replaced with people with rational views — like lawyer Akua Reindorf at the EHRC. If Labour had been in power for the last decade we'd all now be be sharing mixed sex loos, trying to remember everyone's pronouns and living in fear of being denounced as a transphobe. Ireland, Australia, New Zealand — all completely taken in by GI. US TRAs are furious that the UK hasn't fallen like all the rest. They blame Mumsnet, but they don't factor in the Conservative party which has for years been better at reading the room than Labour, which is wedded to ideology come what may.

Your comment is along the lines of those saying that the 2008 crash, which was a global phenomenon, was the fault of Gordon Brown. It wasn't, he just happened to be in office when the tsunami hit.

Just here to say as many pp have , not voting labour til they state that a woman is an adult human female. Yes, this is the hill I choose to die on.

This thread is depressing. It's incredible how many people are actively defending the Tories after the absolute shitshow they've inflicted on the country.

Thank fuck it's not replicated in the real world, with the Tories now languishing at around 20% in the polls.

As bad as, if not worse than, Labour.

So that's the Conservatives, Labour and the Lib dems out if TWAW is the main thing you are going to vote on ? Who is left in England ? The Green party ?

Except of course when Johnson said “Let the bodies pile high” during Covid.

They will not get my x until they respect my sex.

Humans cannot change sex and I will not vote for a party that is so ideologically captured that they cannot tell the truth. How can you make robust, fair effective laws if they are too shit scared to tell the truth.

Labour need to return to their roots and forget about the crazy shit that has sidetracked them in the last couple of decades. If they concentrate on what working people earning less than the UK average salary want, and they would win every election fairly easily. When they start trying to divide people into minority groups, LGTBQ/Straight, BAME/White, Disabled/able-bodied, etc etc, they lose support.

The identity politics is poor politically from a ruthless pov. The Tories would not do that. There just aren't that many out there personally affected by trans issues so it can't sway an election. Really, they could all be thrown under a bus. The Tories do that with care home relatives, as appalling as what went on during Covid, the dead can't vote and if all the affected care home families voted Labour in protest - not a given - it just wouldn't sway an election under the first past the post system. Supporting trans issues winds up many and Labour falls foul of the whole anti-woke brigade, perhaps a bit needlessly.

If you grew up in a Labour-led local authority you may find out how corrupt it all is, esp in Rotherham, Rochdale, Greater Manchester, Oxford where grooming gangs ran rampant, ignored at best, instigated at worst by corrupt Labour-led local authorities and police. You would most likely vote anything else after that and I wouldn't blame them.
I live in Surrey and would never vote Conservative again given how the Tory-led Surrey County Council declared war on me after I shopped a dodgy care home to the local press, which also revealed they were hiring illegal immigrants at a time when Theresa May as Home Secretary was trying to deport them. Or after how Chris Grayling MP dealt with our complaint. But again, it's just one vote and I can be thrown under a bus, so to speak. Probably literally too, given whether the police would investigate!

Lastly, I think Labour have had the whiff of failure about them and some just like to side with the winners, like some football fans. I do think their identity is a bit strained and that Starmer doesn't seem too relaxed or natural. The Tories do seem like that largely because the strategy is, we're very happy and keen to make millions for us and our mates and we are doing it, it exudes success really. May failed to do that because she was a Remainer trying to sell Brexit.

I’m with you here. The Tories have normalised food banks. Can you imagine going back to the 90s and explaining food banks.

For now. But there's still some time to go. It's by no means a done deal that labour will be in next time.

I doubt I will ever vote labour again. I just don’t think they are the party that represent me anymore. I hate identity politics as I think it is divisive and regressive and I also think Starmer gets a lot of big decisions wrong. I also don’t rate his back bench or many of his MP’s and would not like to see them in charge.
I think the country may be ready for a labour government however and accept that may be the case ( although I personally don’t think so)

Indeed, but apparently Labour are the failures. 🙄

The public should be fucking furious.

Labour normalised benefits. Can you imagine going back to the 20s and telling people that people who didn't work would be about as well-off as people who did work? Labour used to stand for the Right to Work. They used to organise marches and protests for it, for people's rights to have jobs so they could support themselves and their families. What happened to that?

Are you actually serious?

Tanking the economy and threatening pensions and mortgages isn't exactly a vote winner. Labour have had a double digit lead in the polls for months now, the disastrous mini budget just shot it into the stratosphere.

A question:

How many £ per week extra do you think benefit claimants would get under a Labour Government.

I say this because I doubt the average increase would be more than £20- £25 per week.

Christ, no. Also captured.

I'm politically homeless; it's awful.

I like the bus analogy of who to vote for.

If you’re getting a bus, you get the bus that gets closest to your destination. No bus is going to stop exactly where you want. And you might have to walk in the rain for a bit.

Vote for the party that is closest to your ideals and values.

I’m a freelancer that wants to make money and have a comfortable life. But I don’t begrudge paying taxes to help other people or support the NHS.

Because they have no idea what a woman is.

(An ex party member)
I left after Starmer said that stating that only women have a cervix is offensive

They can fuck right off

I'm fucking furious with both the Tories for how they're wrecking the country, AND with Labour for failing to give me a viable option to vote for, all because of their ridiculous TWAW stance. I want to vote Labour, but can't. And I won't vote Tory (or LD, or Green).

People who don’t work do not get the same money as people who work. But food banks are ok then? Reduced tax for the super rich is ok then? Removing the cap on bankers bonuses is ok then? Because they had so much wealth, they gambled with the housing market and caused the housing crash. All is forgiven. You’ve done your time, here have stupid amounts of cash.

See my bus analogy

I live in Wales. We've had a Labour government here for more than 20 years. Here our First Minister and his government have proposed various initiatives to support 'the most marginalised in our community' (ie transpeople). The Welsh government has, for years, outsourced anything to do with LGB or TQ+ issue to Stonewall. Drakeford has refused, for years, to meet representatives of any women's organisation that doesn't support TWAW. Wales government has traditionally been fairly easy to approach a minister and arrange a meeting, but feminist groups and women's groups that with to question gender ideology have been denied any access.

A few weeks ago, at a public event, Drakeford said that one of his ministers would welcome contact from a coalition of women's rights groups. A polite letter, promising discretion, was sent. There has been no response several weeks down the line.

This isn't the Tories, this is Labour — Labour refusing to listen, let alone discuss what its people think.

It's not a vote winner for some. But it was never going to be. And it depends on what the outcome of that is further down the road. Double digits for labour at the moment doesn't actually mean anything.