To think a lot of women are worse off than 50 years ago?

[Tsort]

A certain type of person is nostalgic for the old days when ‘men were men, and women were women’. I am not. However, it must be noted that at the time when women were expected to be docile acquiescent homemakers, men were expected to foot the bill. They paid for dinner, sorted the mortgage and brought home the bacon. Not for me, but a fair division of labour.

Now, we have a generation of women who ‘pay their way’, go Dutch and refuse to let men pay for them as they don’t want to be indebted. Grand.

But, these same women also do the lion’s share of housework, because ‘men don’t see it’ and shoulder the emotional labour because ‘that’s just the way men are’.

So, women are now shouldering some of the traditionally male burdens while the traditional female burdens have remained firmly in place. How is this an improvement for women? And why do so many tolerate it? This is a profound misunderstanding of feminism and it hurts so many of us.

@keepmywifesnameoutchagoddammouth

Sorry, I didnt see your list

What are the biological roles of the mother? Giving birth. Yup. After that?

Not all mothers give birth. And all mothers parent differently.

So what characteristics are inherently different between the sexes?

Evolution sees a large proportion of animals kill or abandon their young. Evolution would have women pregnant every couple of years until they die in their mid 40s

There's also research to show that evolutionary speaking, female humans also hunted and male humans nurtured.

The idea of a female pcg, entirely focused on a very small number of children (1 or 2) is a completely modern invention. Made up by, wait for it, sexist, religious men.

Oh and I also take it that beta male is supposed to be an insult?

The horror of an who actually wants to spend time with and parent his kids eh?

What you’ve observed is the effects of patriarchal socialisation.
Both men and women enjoy being providers.
Hormones (when at normal levels) barely influence behaviours.

The more direct parenting men do, the more 'nurturing' hormones they produce so it's not like behaviour doesn't influence hormones and vice versa anyway

They're tired, stressed, and are detached parents.

The horror of an who actually wants to spend time with and parent his kids eh?

What did she say "imagine having to spend time with your children, the horror" or something to that effect, but oh wait no that doesn't apply to men. They are emotionless, money earning automatons, can't think why there is a mental health crisis amongst men.

And how many were on anti-depressants/anti-anxiety medication then compared to now? SSRI's weren't much of a thing in the 1950s.

Ultimately life is hard for most people (men and women). Always has been.

Jesus, another “all men are useless wankers” thread. Yawn 🥱

No, it's not about spending time with kids, that's a good thing.
And again as I've said, me taking responsibilities away from him enables him to have the energy to do that too. Our children are very close with their dad because when he's home he spends all his time with them because I do everything else whereas I spend all my time with them once they finish school while he's working.

@keepmywifesnameoutchagoddammouth

Surely his inherently different sex means he doesn't want to spend time with them?

He doesn't have the right characteristics

I do think it's so funny on here how certain adult women can only conceive of any difference in roles between the sexes as "SEXIST!" Imagine only being able to understand marriage and equality in terms of "is he home in time to load the dishwasher? Why not, why not?"

I wonder if these same women go and stand by building sites and shout "Sexist!" because there will rarely be a female builder to be seen. Do they jump up and down outside nurseries and shout "Oooh Sexist!" because 99% of staff will be female? I'm surprised they didn't appear on the Ukraine border, insisting that it had to be 50/50 men and women allowed to evacuate or it would be "Sexist!"

No, you've misunderstood me. My husband works many hours but is not an automaton, he just doesn't have to do any housework and his free time is spent as quality time with the children because of that.

My comment was sarcastic in response to the idea that a woman forced into SAHMotherhood is being forced to be around her kids all day. I spent two years of both our children's lives with them the entire time and they benefited from that and so did I.

I've seen the older members of our family remain surrounded by their children for that same reason instead of feeling alone because their children have no ties to them.

@keepmywifesnameoutchagoddammouth am I?

I'm a bit worried about all these men who couldn't possibly cope with working and doing a bit of housework and seeing their kids without being utterly exhausted

Same with all these women that couldn't cope with working

Maybe they need to get their vit b12 levels checked.

Nope, that's a specious oversimplification but I think you know that.

@keepmywifesnameoutchagoddammouth

Can you expand then?

@Discovereads

Thisnis absolute nonsense. Hormones hugely influence behaviours.

@runwalk

Yes.

Weirdly enough I do think enforcing rigid gender stereotypes is sexist.

Regardless of the role.

You've not seen any of the threads on here from women who work saying 'I don't know how long I can go on like this" ?

I have.

I'm could probably do it but why would I want to? I like looking and feeling great and not stressed or rundown ever.

I wonder how old Op is?
Ive noticed an awful lot of women in their late 60s and 70s who are really bitter about the " freedom" that women have now.

So do I. But I wouldn't do that. I live them, I wouldn't enforce them, not that I could if I wanted to.

@Sisisisi

Are they really bitter or do they just think there time was better and you write that off as them being jealous of you?

MN poster - "I like dogs"

Topgub - "So you're saying all cats should be shot then....?"

I can't even respond to that nonsense. Menopause must be a breeze then and all that pregnancy marlarky was nothing to do with hormones, oh no. Desperate to prove me wrong but I do hope some younger ones take on board the idea of choosing a partner that's right for them.

It's sad to see all the marriage breakdowns that are because of not discussing such vital things beforehand.

Accurate.