Entitled attitude: grandparents must provide childcare

[Hope54321]

I’m seeing a lot more of this attitude quite recently. Why do people have children if they can’t look after them or pay for their childcare? Why is it that grandparents are expected to do the childcare so the parents can work? I think it’s acceptable if the grandparents are offering to help out, but to feel like grandparents should be obliged to offer childcare is simply taking the biscuit.

[Arbesque]

@JudgeJ

It makes me laugh when people are all ‘oh my parents didn’t splash out money on iPhones/gym memberships back in their day’
no because they didn’t fucking exist 😂 they weren’t valiantly going without.

Wow, a social scientist in the making! Of course those examples of technology didn't exist but there has always been 'the latest' in every generation! My parents were the first in our avenue to get a fridge, I was talking to my grandchildren the other day about watching the '53 Coronation on a tiny 9 or 12 inch black and whote TV, a lot of the neighbours in there and the curtains drawn! We'd actually bought/rented it for the Cup Final the month before. People bought/rented what they could afford, a lot of second hand furniture changed hands when young people were setting up home.
I know it's the MN mode to sneer at such 'anecdotes', that doesn't distract from their veracity.

We always had a rented TV when I was a child. And there was no question of having more than one for the whole family to watch. Just as there was no question of having more than one bathroom and one car. My mother's holidays were cooking for us in a different location. If somebought a new couch or a new coat it was an occasion.

I hate this narrative that older people had it cushy and now their kids are paying the price.

[Faciadipasta]

@Arbesque but that's not exactly unusual. We live like that now! OK we own our telly but only 1, 1 (old, crap) car, 1 bathroom, hiring a flat in a different location for a holiday, just saved up for a loooongg time to buy our sofa, get most furniture second hand off gumtree or similar. And we earn a decent wage each. Things really aren't that different now. I'm not sure why the older generation thinks everyone younger than them is flash!
And no I don't expect regular childcare. I don't know anyone who does. I think everyone on this thread seems to be getting annoyed about a theoretical expectation rather than the reality!!

[TheSummerPalace]

I always thought them v selfish that they never gave me a break considering their future expectations

Have they been looking after your sister all her life? Do they get a break? Maybe they are exhausted and don’t have any headspace to look after your DC too?

As for your sister, you start a conversation with them about her future!

[rockyg]

Things really aren't that different now. I'm not sure why the older generation thinks everyone younger than them is flash!

I'm pretty sure the younger generations have less disposable income then previous ones did at that age. Despite coffee & phones 😆

[WhatNoRaisins]

Has anyone mention avocados yet?

[TheHoover]

I’m pretty sure they didn’t.
As pp have said, one tv, one car, one holiday in uk only was standard. I had new clothes twice a year - one coat/ pair of shoes for summer, one for winter. We didn’t consider ourselves badly off. If my parents had disposable income I have no idea where it went.
What is going on here is that people are seeing the older generation (and their financial positions) now, mortgage and debt free rather than when they were struggling same as everyone is now.

[Bluestream]

It is very reasonable of them to expect that ! Why have children otherwise? Also the world left behind for your grandchildren this is the least you can do !

[5128gap]

@Bluestream

It is very reasonable of them to expect that ! Why have children otherwise? Also the world left behind for your grandchildren this is the least you can do !

Why have children otherwise? Well maybe because you want to have children and raise them. Once. Not on repeat every time one of your children goes on to decide to have a child.
I'm very surprised there's so many women out there who seem to believe that by choosing to have a child you're committing yourself to a lifetime of childcare, ending only when you're too frail to manage it, or your youngest grandchild is too old to need it.

[Namenic]

@Faciadipasta - I guess being able to search the internet for a good price on gumtree is better than they had in the past. Ditto for searching for a good deal on a used car or flat rental. Not everyone may have had a dishwasher, central heating or sometimes washing machine, hoover (my parents grew up abroad) - these are time saving things and improve comfort. Difficult to travel abroad. Difficult to get certain types of food. Harder to get in touch with loved ones far away. Less opportunities for girls. House prices were lower but some components of standard of living were worse.

[Faciadipasta]

Right well we don't have a dishwasher either, a washing machine and hoover yes and central heating that we can't really afford to run. And I can promise you my parents who were working class (van driver and bar maid who gave up work when kids were born) also had these things. And we are not poor at all! Probably slightly above the median earnings. But the commute costs us over 4 5k each a year and breakfast and after school clubs (I couldn't afford to work before the kids were in school - I have twins and their nursery fees were quite a bit higher than my salary)
As well as huge mortgage (which we were very lucky to finally have saved up a deposit for at age 34) and no I'd didn't do a travel gap year, worked from 18 dh is paying back student loan too.
But I'm not even unusual, this is the norm in my peer group. Oh and no gym membership either before you ask although we do pay £10 a month for online exercise classes!

[Faciadipasta]

Also full disclosure we do eat avocados (but I don't buy coffees out unless I'm with MIL who does every time and will often kindly offer to buy me one too)

[Standrews]

When my son and daughter in law had their first child, they made a point of asking us if we wanted to be involved with any kind of childcare and we agreed on various ways of assisting. We also agreed as events changed, i.e., toddler, nursery, before and after school care, etc. that we would always be there for any kind of crisis or need. Both parents worked and as our second grandchild came 5 years later, we were able to follow the same pattern. Our eldest is now at university and we still pick up our younger granddaughter from High School for dental appointments or collect as and when needed. We look back now we are well into our eighties on the time spent (turned out to be many hours) with our grandchildren with joy. We were fortunate to have each other, I could not have managed without grandpa, changing nappies in the early days was a two-person job! We could not offer the same quality time for our other son and daughter in law as they lived 200 miles away. The overall blessing has been that we are part of a close and loving family unit, all birthdays, etc. are celebrated together where possible. We trump boyfriends and girlfriends at times like these.

[ancientgran]

@Wouldloveanother

It makes me laugh when people are all ‘oh my parents didn’t splash out money on iPhones/gym memberships back in their day’

no because they didn’t fucking exist 😂 they weren’t valiantly going without.

Gyms definitely did exist, I had a membership to one in the 70s. It wasn't the dark ages you know.

[Faciadipasta]

@Standrews you sound lovely. I'm so happy your family are so close

[whumpthereitis]

@Iseestupidpeople

Actually you are entitled if you think grandparents shouldn’t help out. They have done so for thousands of years. You know it takes a village and all. But the last generation where mum stayed at home with kids pretty much ended with the baby boomers. And yes they paid a lot less tax in comparison and had better benefits from the NHS being entirely free to going to Uni for free as well as ending their kids to Uni for free and not to mention being able to by a nice suburban 3-bed with garden for £3,000 and still paying a mortgage for this in 2000 20-30 years after buying it, when you couldn’t rent a bed sit for the tiny amounts they pay. Yes they were and are still a lot wealthier.

There’s a significant difference between actually being entitled to decide how to run your own life, and believing yourself to be entitled to the time and labor of other people.

It doesn’t take a village, it takes a village that is willing to help. The bottom line is that if you choose to have children, you are the one responsible for them until they reach adulthood. You can expect what you like, but that doesn’t mean anyone else is obliged to provide it.

[ancientgran]

I know we all prioritise different things but an automatic washing machine is my line in the sand.

I don't have a dishwasher, I have a tumble dryer but can't afford to use it much but if my washing machine breaks down and is unrepairable this morning I will be online ordering a new one this afternoon. It is the one thing I'd go into debt for.

So many years hand washing or trailing to a launderette (we didn't have a car) and arthritis in my hands means I'm not backing down on that one

[ancientgran]

@Iseestupidpeople

Actually you are entitled if you think grandparents shouldn’t help out. They have done so for thousands of years. You know it takes a village and all. But the last generation where mum stayed at home with kids pretty much ended with the baby boomers. And yes they paid a lot less tax in comparison and had better benefits from the NHS being entirely free to going to Uni for free as well as ending their kids to Uni for free and not to mention being able to by a nice suburban 3-bed with garden for £3,000 and still paying a mortgage for this in 2000 20-30 years after buying it, when you couldn’t rent a bed sit for the tiny amounts they pay. Yes they were and are still a lot wealthier.

How did we pay less tax? Basic rate was 35% in the 70s wasn't it.

[Blossomtoes]

33% when I started work. My first wage was £10 a week - oh, how that dates me!

[seetzeros]

I feel very old reading this - so many posters who have no recollection of what life was actually like in the 70’s/80’s. Very selective in what ‘history’ they have picked up on. PP have pointed most of this out but I fear they are whistling in the wind. This attitude that pits one generation against another is very odd.

For what it’s worth, I am 50 with a 10 year old - I paid for all my childcare due to preference and due to parental health/distance. Over the last 8 years I have fallen in to being a carer too as well as working FT. A bit of me envies parents who have family childcare, a bit of me is grateful to have avoided all the obligations and expectations that go with that.

[MarieIVanArkleStinks]

@AnnieSnap

WTF! Jesus self entitlement personified 🙄

Nah. That's just straightforward trolling (in the traditional rather than the MN 'creative writing' definition of that word).

It's intended to irritate and offend.

[MarieIVanArkleStinks]

NB. All this 'I pay more tax than you pay' is tantamount to 'my mum's better than your mum'.

[5128gap]

@MarieIVanArkleStinks

NB. All this 'I pay more tax than you pay' is tantamount to 'my mum's better than your mum'.

Rather apt really given the whole thread is about some mums not being considered good enough.

[TimBoothseyes]

@Reveriesreverie

Yes. You voted a succession of @#£&)+)- into parliament. Your house prices were peanuts. You earnt enough to have the luxury to stay at home looking after your kids whilst your husband went to work a job that covered all the expenses. You chose to have children that are now suffering the consequences of your voting actions.

Roll up your sleeves and help them. Cause we're all struggling.

Everyone votes a succession of (whatever that insult is), into parliament as different political views are always there (Labour are awful according to those who don't vote for them, Tories are awful according to those who don't vote for them, etc). I never had the luxury to stay at home with the kids as my exH's job didn't pay enough to cover all the bills. As for houses costing "peanuts", well compared to todays prices it may seem that way, but we didn't have today's wages to buy them with. My full-time job paid me £105pw....no such thing as minimum wage back then remember so for us, buying a house was impossible on our wages.

[Romansolider2014]

All the posters on here waxing lyrical about how Gp don't need/shouldn't feel any obligation to help out at all/take an interest in their GC.

Can only assume such posters are not in situation with both parents working FT to make ends meet and zero help at all. Haven't given birth alone as DH with older child at home. Haven't passed out due to exhaustion.

come on trolls, I know you've been waiting....... 👹

[OnceAgainWithFeeling]

@Romansolider2014

All the posters on here waxing lyrical about how Gp don't need/shouldn't feel any obligation to help out at all/take an interest in their GC.

Can only assume such posters are not in situation with both parents working FT to make ends meet and zero help at all. Haven't given birth alone as DH with older child at home. Haven't passed out due to exhaustion.

come on trolls, I know you've been waiting....... 👹

Only had 1 child partly because there was no help (plus DH away for 5.5 days a week).

We knew when having DD that with grandparents being 250 and 4,500 miles away that we weren’t going to be getting help. And planned/managed accordingly. We both need to work full time in demanding jobs.

My own grandparents lived hundreds of miles away when I was a child so my parents had no help either.

Not sure how that makes me a troll 🤷🏻‍♀️