To think skin colour matters WAY more than people like to admit

[daysayso]

I am involved in marketing campaigns - I won't say what because it's outing but let's say I recently worked on a campaign where the service being provided had absolutely nothing to do with race (so it wasn't makeup or hair for example).

Yet the vast majority that responded were people of colour (Same as the person featured in the ad) and it made me think how much your life chances are still dictated by your skin colour.

People like to consider race more than they like to admit even in spaces where it has nothing to do with anything, people just seem to feel more 'comfortable' with their own.

I felt for the first time in a long time my success will in part depend on my skin colour because for whatever reason the majority of white people that saw this ad decided it wasn't for them on the basis I'm someone of colour.

Please no arguments I'm looking for a mature conversation and if you find the topic sensitive you need not respond

Just looking for others experiences really

I don't think white privilege is as prevalent as it maybe used to be because Britain isn't wholly white and in some places white people are the minority population. I think colour privilege exists wherever one colour dominates.

A pp criticised early feminists for not campaigning for the rights of black women along with white women - I think this is unfair because those early feminists were still products of their time and influence by their own cultural norms. And it's not wrong for a group to campaign for their own advancement. But they helped pave the way for change and their achievements could be built on.

I just find it really sad that everyone can't just accept that we're all the damn same apart from the wrapping. :-(

That's nice and I mean that genuinely but sadly there are still enough people around that make it a big issue that my 'wrapping' is different.

I still get completely random abuse just walking down the street. Mostly from people in white vans but it ranges from kids to adults. I've been racially abused by a kid in centerparcs while his dad was stood right next to him. In this day and age it's depressing. I have a favourite holiday spot in the USA but have held off going back as COIVID sparked a big surge in verbal and physical abuse towards East Asians. I was even wary of where I went during COVID and was lucky but many weren't.

Some examples of white privilege right there, which have nothing to do with poor vs rich. I'm probably much better off than those chavs at centerparcs but that's really irrelevant when you're being racially abused and made to feel like scum. Purely because I've a different wrapping.

i think it’s taking too long to change.

its not as bad as the 70s where you’d have to steel yourself to go outside ready for the onslaught. But there’s still inequalities and systemic racism.

But at least BLM has started something. I’ve never seen a white person call out racism. I see it lots now thankfully. It felt lonely before.

@mamabear715 on one particular occasion we had met up to shop for another family members wedding. DSIL came straight from work & I'd been to the gym.
So she is in corporate work clothes and I'm in gym gear with a backpack, yet SHE was followed and I wasn't. It's just so fucking obvious that she had been racially profiled by the store detective.
My nephew was on a school thing ( assembly I think ) at a church near my work so I'd arranged to have him to tea . Told him to wait by my car in my works car park if I wasnt already in the car. Have done this with my own kids and their friends many times, no problem. Yup, he was challenged and accused of tampering with my car ??

Sadly, as a white woman I'd fully agree with the thread title. I (subjectively) feel it is better now than at any time in the past where I live in Northern Ireland.

Of course here, with the divisive sectarian politics we'd also add religion, name, school, nationality, etc to that list with skin color. Living in England for many years I never felt those things mattered much there.

Up until about ten years ago, the number of non white people in adverts was very low. How they make up a very large proportion. Prior to the increase in black actors appearing, did black people not feel the products advertised there “ for them”?

Uk demographics from census results put Pakistani/Indian/Bangladeshi as the largest non white racial group in the uk, but they are massively underrepresented in adverts. Why is this?

Ethnicity proportions very massively around the uk, urban and rurally.

Also there is no such thing as bad publicity. I recall the “united colours of Benetton” creating discussion in the 1990s. More recently non white families and supermarket Christmas food .

Interestingly enough the non white people I see in adverts all appear successful, two parent professional or middle class.

Interesting Donna.

Would you have preferred that people in England acknowledged and paid attention to what religion/cultural background you were (as they do in NI) or ignored it?

I think I'll ask my lovely neighbours what their experiences have been.. one is very 'I know my rights', giggle (not to do with wrappings, she just doesn't let ANYONE walk all over her) the other is more timid & her husband tells me that he gets better deals away from 'white peoples' shops' - didn't know how to feel about that one. :-(

I think your neighbour that knows her rights probably is used to fighting for her rights so it becomes part of her.

When I speak to parents of disabled children they are also ready to fight for their children because they have had to. It shouldn’t be this way.
The opportunities should be available and visible. Often you have to know the system.

Someone said further up that studies showed babies as young as 3 months preferred persons of their own colour.
I believe this is because they feel more secure and may not have seen many other colours close up.
I worked in a clinic with mainly Bengali and Somali mothers and babies, some of the babies would be terrified of me at first meet (white and ginger) and veer towards the interpreters of same colour and language. A child is going to feel comfortable with what they are used to.
Must admit I was quite a favourite with the toddlers, Lol.

If the ad feathered black people, it is natural that most who respond witll be black I think
you are targeting that market

"Is this racist? I use person of Colour a lot and had no idea this was racist? Not an argument. Hoping to be educated as I wouldn’t want to offend Personally I (a black woman) hate it. It's lumping everyone into "white" and "other" and for me I feel many white people like to use it as it is almost like saying "coloured". Many people put an emphasis on "colour" again though that's just me personally"

Anything anyone says is certain to offend someone somewhere somehow

I do not bother as far as I am concerned I know I do not deliberately offend anyone and that is all I can do

I think her point was not just that people of colour responded to the campaign but also that white people didn't.

In the nineties people in our office we’re openly racist against ethnic staff, and openly said racist names, there was nothing you could do. Now it’s covert racism, where it’s done subtly.

I detest the BS term that is 'people of colour'. Is white not a colour then? Is it just non-white people who come in a variety of shades?! Sort your terminology out please OP.

As for your question; of course it bloody does! You clearly don't belong to one of the many minority groups in this country to have to ask this question.

You seem to think that you've posed some sort of trick question to catch the op out but you really haven't. It's fairly straightforward and I assumed it's commonly accepted that being white is at the top of the hierarchy.

I dont tend to describe people ever in terms of skin colour or race, I will usually just say the guy over the red jacket etc or the woman in the grey skit, but if I did have to use some term or another and had no choice. What would be the most acceptable dotty?
Assuming I wouldn't necessarily know country of origin or heritage of the person at the time.
What is completely acceptable or is nothing acceptable and it should never be used?

I think this stuff is very helpful to know.

It is dependent on what you were marketing though, was it something that has a cultural bias? I for instance use shampoo which is heavily marketed to Afro Caribbean women (never even had heard of it until a black friend recommended it) because I have curly hair.

Whereas if I saw a car advert with an Asian woman driving it I wouldn't think that car isn't for me!

I really couldn't care about the colour of someone's skin but product choice or events etc are more subtle because it's what we enjoy, our taste, and yes upbringing. I've experienced reverse racism and been made to feel uncomfortable at reggae concerts, why can't I enjoy this music? But I was was made unwelcome

It's really not that hard. Treat everyone well irrespective of their skin colour. Accept and acknowledge that some people are not always treated well or might have different experiences because of the colour of their skin.

Most importantly stop complaining how hard it is for you when people who are often mistreated because of the colour of their skin try to advocate for themselves or ask for better treatment.

Thank you for this. I didn't have the energy to respond but you've hit the nail on the head.

The current trend is for advertisers to have a family with one white parent and one black parent, with a mixture of white, mixed race, and black children. I think this is seen as the "appropriate" modern family dynamic. My personal guess as to why people from the Asian countries you mention don't feature heavily is that (in my personal experience) people from those regions tend to (on average) form relationships with people from the same culture.

My own personal experience is that I know several couples where there is one white person and one black person, but no couples where there is a white person and an Asian person or a black person and an Asian person. (I don't know what the actual statistics for these types of mixed race relationships are, this is just my own experience which may not be universally true.)

Advertisers like to have mixed race families because they tick the right diversity boxes and they feel that they will appear to a wider range of people. But they have to be believable.

There’s a govt report with acceptable terms.
Not BAME. it suggests being specific where possible. But if referring to groups they suggest ‘other than white ‘ or ethnic minorities.

Sometimes it’s useful to have a wider term but ideally to refer to specifics.

I work in marketing and we choose images that matches our target audience. It stops the scroll, they can see themselves. It resonates.

So why do adverts for products aimed at the elderly and disabled almost exclusively feature young/middle-aged able-bodied people? Even the many daytime adverts for over 50s plans rarely show anybody over 60 - although I suppose they prefer younger people in the age bracket with more years of life (and thus payments) ahead of them?!

I've heard shocking things about AI getting out of control, but I never knew that it was actually programmed to be racist. I'm white, so ads for caring for Afro hair are of no interest to me, in the same way that ads for SPF50 sun cream are probably more relevant to me than somebody with naturally very dark skin - profiling in that way makes sense; but if I'm looking for content on a certain topic on YouTube or wherever, why on earth would I care what colour the person presenting it is? If they're engaging and knowledgeable, it makes no more difference to me than what date their birthday falls on.

Well it's a universal truth that people like what's familiar, be that race, culture, background. My sister got her first job in a very competitive industry because she went to the same uni as the interviewer - therefore she automatically knew what she would have studied and quality of skills etc and they bonded over talking about teachers etc.
I'm not sure why this is of any particular note - surely in marketing in particular this is very obvious?