To think the bar is set low on parenting for men?

Yes, woman mostly make the comments about how 'lucky' I am to have my husband. And it's usually because their own husbands are shit.

But, if I were to answer them honestly: "Well it's your own fault for choosing and settling for a shit husband." then I'll be seen as smug and condescending.

You can't win. How do you then change society?

Perhaps its regional or social. Where OH was raised it was just normal for men to look after the kids nobody gave it a second thought. When we were up there visiting I used to go to the bingo with his SiL and her friends. Didn't seem to be any problems with mums having nights out leaving dad in charge. No one fawning, no one gushing.

This is spot on!

@TurtleCavalryIsSeriousShit My point exactly and you said it way better than I did.

I almost posted about a fb (I know, I know 🙄) spat I had yesterday, when I corrected a post about ‘Dads who read to their babies’ followed by lots of ❤️❤️❤️❤️, and ‘good job!’

All I did was point out that anyone who reads to a child is doing a good job, and that it’s a little patronising to give dads a gold star for something that is just basically parenting.

The pile on (by women) was laughable. Some of the comments were about how men respond to praise, so let’s encourage them 🤦‍♀️. Others just berated me for ‘souring what was just a sweet post’.

I gave up, deleted my comment and stopped following the page (it was one to do with children’s literature).

Yes. Yes, it really is low. I disagree about women setting the bar low though... in many cases, men set a low bar for themselves and it's too much hassle to fight daily to raise it.

I'm heavily pregnant and due to go into hospital next week due to minor complications. Coincidentally, our DC also starts school this week so not great timing. DH will therefore have to do everything for DC and fit his work around DC, which is proving a bit of a shock to him. Despite receiving exactly the same communications as me from the school on drop-off times, pick-up times, what the children need to bring, uniforms, lunchbox contents, snacks etc., I'm still receiving frequent queries about "What should I put in DC's lunchbox?", "What does DC have to wear again?", "Are you sure pick-up is at X time?"

I asked him sarcastically if I should write him a little summary of all the important information with detailed guidance and he thought I was being serious and said yes 😡.

I AM NOT HIS BLOODY SECRETARY!!!

Rant over.

THIS!

Although I caught myself doing it at the pool this week, with a Dad and his baby who was probably about 6 months and I found myself cooing at how nice it was to see a Dad taking baby swimming. Could have kicked myself!

Weirdly there are more dads with older DC at the pool that I didnt think twice about - my own Dad always took us swimming - but there was something about a Dad and a baby at a pool that stood out. Same way with Dads at baby groups I guess?

Don’t even get me started.
Me and my ExH do get on really well, and I’ll never bad mouth him as a dad, because he does do his fair share with our DCs. It’s how other people view him that gets on my tits 🤨
Apparently, him doing the same, every day shit that I do with the DCs makes him some sort of superhuman, worthy of a gold medal. Just the other week, he was telling me how a random woman in Asda told him what a great job he was doing. Where’s my praise for simply walking around a supermarket with 3 DCs?!

Yes and proves the point about women enabling it. Why doesn't he know pick up and drop off times? Why doesn't he know what goes in a lunchbox?? Because you probably do it all thats why!

He doesn't know it because he seems to think it is someone else's job (mine 😡!) to read the communications from the school and make sure he is aware of the important stuff. It is not. Tbf, we haven't had to do packed lunches before (nursery was easier in so many ways!) so this is new for us, but the degree of bafflement being exhibited by a grown adult over what should be a fairly simple task is bewildering to me.

Why be so nasty though? Would you like anyone to say it's your own fault about anything you did that didn't turn out well. Not every man starts out as a sexist pig, sometimes it happens after children come along.

Why not say, it's not fair that you have to put up with it, he should step up rather than actually being smug and condescending. It's hardly supporting the sisterhood, is it?

Well of course it's subjective. All opinions are. That's hardly a slam dunk, is it?

If you don't think either method works then why are you trying to push yours so hard?

Again it's your opinion that it's not slamming and belittling and obviously isn't a fact. You really sound like you're projecting as it's you that can't cope with being disagreed with so have to resort to being patronising .

Depends on the man, depends on the circumstances.

I went back after 12 weeks , working 12-hour shifts, weekends, nights and Christmas. Yes, we had a nanny but she knocked off at 6.

My husband works in civil aviation and holds a full commercial pilot's licence so looking after a small child isn't much of a stretch.

Totally. I loathe the term ‘babysitting’ when it’s their own children. How dare mum have a night off??!! Dad’s who pay maintenance are seen as saints by many but (to be fair) that’s really because of all the shits who don’t pay. The women who actually do get maintenance are probably just so amazed that they’re getting anything that Dad achieves Saint status. I’m currently owed £4k BTW 😡 Then all the dads I read about on here who work full time (fair enough) but expect to flop on the sofa whilst their wife does 100% of the kid/house chores whether she works or not. If he even runs the duster around once every 6 months then he’s God’s gift. Not cool.

@Goosygandy

Huh.

Maybe you should take some of your own advice?

You're being very critical and belittling of me right now. (For no objective reason that I can fathom from this thread)

Seems you only want to support the sister hood when it suits you.

I cope fine with being disagreed with, I actively enjoy it. Its called debate. I dont care if people agree or don't or even if they listen to my opinion.

None of that is actually relevant to the op.

I suggest you stick to it rather than personally attacking me.

It should be acceptable to be a SAHP but not to treat that person like a servant.

it should be acceptable to be a SAHP sure. But i will never stop asking if they are financially secure, have discretionary spending, pension funds etc etc. Personally i loathed it and couldn't wait to stop. But - i made sure for the time i was a SAHP that there were ground rules, and that i had my pension contributions paid.

When my DC were small i sometimes had to work on a weekend. (office job) and because DH worked shifts sometimes that meant taking the DC. They played with the trucks in our logistics office, and when we all got takeaway they had some too, and it was generally fine. But my fucker of a boss complained more than once that i was obviously useless and unorganised for having to do that.

One day one of the sales managers turned up, unannounced, on a Tuesday with his 2 year old daughter. Suddenly what a great dad he was stepping in when wife unavailable (on a shopping trip to fucking Paris with friends). And then he tried to palm her off on me, and following my blunt (rude) refusal tried to fob her off on any of the other women, usually without children. And then went home. Fucker. Still, they talked about that amazing dad for months and months.

Yes I only have two but somehow either we had one each on weekends if doing separate things or I had both. (He did take them both swimming though). And I remember on those non assigned seats flights I always ended up between the two kids while hubby got to sleep on his own...

Went to Sainsbury’s with my ds and dgs recently. I wandered off somewhere, when I came back he said one woman had offered to do the shopping for him! ‘Just give me your list and I’ll run round’
Unbelievable. He swears he wasn’t tempted.

It's always been low. I'm from an asian background where its so low outside ridiculous. We went to go visit my dh's family in London and they remarked how great a dad my husband is because he is so hands on and implied I don't appreciate it. I replied probably on the defensive that he is a good dad as I'm a good mum, he isn't doing me a favour by changing nappies in the same way I'm not doing him one by being a working mother and paying the bills. We are a team and that is the way our family works. We talked about this before we became partners and had dh not been on the same page I'd have ditched him and moved on. It was women that said this to me, they set the bar so low for their own partners it almost becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

Some people have had shit or absent dads so don't expect much of men, it's a shame. My dad was and is great so for me the bar was always set high. Also if I would be doing all the parenting alone I'd rather not have a dh or partner and would ditch the deadweight but I'm confident in myself.

It should be acceptable to be a SAHP sure. But i will never stop asking if they are financially secure, have discretionary spending, pension funds etc etc. Personally i loathed it and couldn't wait to stop. But - i made sure for the time i was a SAHP that there were ground rules, and that i had my pension contributions paid.

But those are perfectly reasonable points to make. I don't think we should stop asking these questions. It's just the posts that are dismissive and insulting that I don't like, or that harangue rather than encourage and inform.

DH and I have always done everything 50:50.

I was made redundant when DS was 3 and made a career move that meant I worked away a few days during the week for around 5 years.

DH did all the nursery (and then school) drop offs/pick ups when I was away - I did them when I was home and I worked from home during school holidays.

But OMG the comments about what an amazing husband I had, wasn't I lucky that he was so hands on enabling my career, not many men would do what he does BLAH FUCKIN BLAH

Yeah mate, he does what millions of MUMS all over the world do and I don't see anyone putting them on a pedestal

“It's something I keep noticing. If a man does even the bare minimum for his child people think he's incredible. I saw one deadbeat dad referred to as a 'legend' on Facebook today for 'taking on' his daughter for 12 months whilst her mother was unable to meet her needs, he was also told that 'not many men would do what you did'”

this appalling, matronising kind of sentiment almost always comes from women.
Many women like to keep men belittled and patronised with regard to childcare for some reason.

The language used is also very telling.

How many times do we hear of a man described as being a "hands on dad" because he changes nappies or dresses his child? Yet when was the last time anyone described a woman as being a "hands on mum"?

It's not a term that's used because we automatically assume that being a mother includes actually taking care of a child's needs. No such expectation in society for fathers.

Totally agree but it’s entirely female driven. Why they do it, I do not know.

The double standards are ridiculous.
Our children are more or less grown up now and I'm retired so the dynamic has changed a lot for us recently but for most of our marriage I have been the higher earner and worked longer hours and DH has done more of the domestic/child related stuff than me, though he's also worked. To many people, sadly particularly women, that makes him some kind of super hero and me, at best, nothing, and at worst a complete villain.
His Mum once described him, in my hearing, as "having to be both Father and Mother to those children". Okaay...he takes on a few traditionally female roles and gains mother status does he? However I apparently am not worthy of the title since I don't do the school run, but I get no kudos for doing that traditionally male breadwinner thing? I was lucky that he looked after the children "for me" but nobody ever told him he was lucky to have a wife who paid the mortgage "for him" .
A few years ago I was seriously ill in hospital and the fuss that was made of DH by again largely female friends and family was quite ridiculous - bringing meals, doing laundry and ironing etc - all very kind, but stuff that he and our teenage sons were perfectly capable of doing. The minute I was home, when we actually could have done with some help as I was still needing a lot of care it stopped. "You'll be glad Avo is home, it's been tough for you having to run the house without her" said one of our neighbours as she collected her casserole dishes. Strangely nobody brought me any casseroles when DH was in hospital this year. Funny that.