French (and German) children don’t throw food

[Summersummersun]

I have heard of this book and think I need to read it.

Just got back from a foreign holiday where the majority of families were German.

All I saw around me were well behaved,
placid children. I lost count of the number of couples I saw on sun loungers at the pool whilst their (young) children played nearby, nicely, in the shallow pools. I also saw so many parents on their phones or reading, ignoring the children completely, whilst the children either sat and played at their feet, or just sat on the sun beds not really doing anything. Just…sitting. Quietly.

My children are not like this. They’re 6 and 3, and whilst the eldest is a decent swimmer he still needed a lot of interaction in the pool. And they would never just SIT THERE whilst DH and I ignored them. Ever. We were staying in a caravan and granted had limited stuff to entertain them there and then (mainly just stickers/books, no real toys) they rush around the house at home anyway and never sit and play with toys nicely (unless eldest is doing a Lego set).

I’ve never been so conscious of my inadequate parenting and children before, and we have been on plenty of Center Parcs/UK holidays. In fact one of the things I like about CP is the fact that you can relax with DC as there is always another one having a meltdown in the vicinity.

AIBU to think this? Are European children just better behaved?

re My son dicking around behind the car, I guess I could have held his hand but at nearly 8 I expect him not to be so dim and I also had two cats in their carriers and a 4 yr old plus luggage to watch out for. So when he didn’t listen to me for the third time I flipping well did shout at him to stop being so stupid. We can’t always forecast and pre-empt what kids are going to do! I rarely hear children being sharply ticked off in public for misbehaving but I am more than willing to do it and I’m mild compared to how my mum would have reacted!

I think that's a cultural difference, adult french and other Europeans probably are less likely to queue nicely or apologise all the time. On the other hand they are more likely to greet everyone present, introduce others, and less likely to complain about you behind your back.
I haven't found UK teenagers much good at queuing so maybe those cultural differences are less marked in young people.

Not this rubbish again 🙄

Fair enough I assumed he was much younger. It sounds like the situation was unusual for him and just one of those awkward parenting moments!

When I lived abroad I found Italian children to be much worse behaved than mine.

well my uk grand children just moved to france, maybe there is hope for them yet...

I work in childcare in America and their behavior is exactly the same as UK children.

That's really rude behaviour towards their father.
Someone said to me that there's no point in telling off a child unless you make them cry and although that is a bit extreme I do get the point that they have to feel uncomfortable when told off. If they think they can completely ignore or respond by blowing a raspberry, clearly the telling off doesn't mean anything and you may as well keep your mouth shut and let them carry on doing what they're doing

I have found in Spain, Italy, North Africa and ME children are babied longer and they are not expected to be like little adults but when they are told off it’s harsher

in America similar to us but as a culture they are less reserved

not so sure about Germany of children behave better by they are far more independent from a young age what I have noticed (visited a number of times as best friend lives there) is there is very little interaction with young children from strangers i know some on here dislike adults they don’t know interacting with their children but when always found this interaction lovely

South asian well in my experience always treated like little princes and princesses for boys this often doesn’t change 🙄

When my DDs were about 3 and 1 we were in holiday in France and a woman came up and complimented me on how well behaved my children were.
So I'm not convinced children in France and Germany are better behaved. We always think other people's children behave better than our own. I'm not sure it's always true.

And in southern Europe/North Africa and ME strangers will pull up children for bad behaviour and will also fuss over them

This discussion reminds me of a holiday at a small farm converted to a hotel with pool which we often stayed in whilst in Tuscany.
On one occasion an English family of three generations arrived. As soon as one of her primary-aged grandchildren complained/put a foot wrong by the pool the grandmother (in her 50s, probably) instantly and, without being quiet, commanded the child to return to the hotel room. No one in her family challenged her. Obedience was quietly accepted and instant.
Each time she did this our eyes opened as wide as dinner plates, thinking her domineering and excessive. She was someone we’d never seen before or have since. Life carried without the child and the atmosphere round the pool immediately reverted to harmony.
At the time we thought her draconian. Now we think she had very firm boundaries, was very considerate to other hotel guests and, as parents and grandparents with decades of embarrassing moments and meltdowns, we often recall her. She was a one-off.

@Fluffruff i had assumed your DS was much younger too, don’t blame you for bollocking an 8 year old for that!

@SnackSizeRaisin any insight into what that telling off could be I’m all ears! The only way to make my DS cry from a telling off is to really shout, I mean REALLY, or take something he really loves.

A very sweeping statement!

Agree totally.
So much insipid wet parenting around.
As if parents think that their hellions won’t “ Like them” if they are firm and no nonsense.

Parents wheedling and pleading at children in a weak voice.
We had a great teacher at school, “ Foxy”
He could walk into a class and everyone would fall silent.
He had natural authority.
Some people exude it- No punishment needed.

One sees it with dogs, too.
Running rings around a wet owner, while someone with quiet authority manages very well.

😂😂😂

I agree OP, I do feel like parenting styles are different in Europe which (on the whole) leads to better behaved children. They are left to get in with it/entertain themselves a lot more, so aren’t so demanding of their parents for attention.

I’m always amazed at the differences when at the beach in a European country, for instance, compared with a beach in the UK, in terms of kids behaviour.

Sorry but that's bollux! Two of my kids ARE Canadian and we lived there 12 years. I've four kids and lots of experience of kids soft play in both countries. I don't think there is a difference. There are good kids and bratty kids in both countries.

Please tell us more

It’s not necessarily a continental thing. I would also ignore my children to a degree on holiday knowing they could entertain themselves and behave well. They weren’t scarred - they were perfectly happy and loved and are now resilient, independent young adults. It never ceases to amaze me what a huge rod for their own back some parents make with the constant entertaining and cajoling and pandering.

This is so funny 😆

There are badly behaved and well-behaved children in every country, and great and useless parents everywhere. And what is considered polite and rude varies from country to country.
There are differences though. In general, British parents are more risk averse and there is less encouragement of independence. There is a lot of focus on making children's childhoods special and memorable, which translates into lots of children's activities and entertaining children.
There is very little focus on eating together as a family around a table, unlike in some countries and the idea of children's food is different from adults' food. There is also not that much concern about poor diets amongst children. A lot of British children seem to have very poor diets. Much fewer children go every week to church in comparison to some countries, so most children have not learned how to behave in church e.g. at a wedding.
In some countries, if your parenting is weak, others, including strangers will intervene and tell your child off. That is a big taboo in the UK.
Some cultures/countries have a stronger valuing of education than British culture does. And alongside this a strong respect for teachers.
British culture is quite anti-authoritarian in small ways, but not in large ways. This seems to translate into things like parents saying their children do not have to respect an adult unless they earn their respect. This idea is totally alien in some countries. There is a concern that children should not be robots and should think for themselves. I think this can lead to behaviour that appears poorer as children are expected to figure out more for themselves.
There is a strong focus on children's mental health in the culture and children being able to express their feelings. So fairly old children will cry in the classroom, for example if they are told they can not do something, something that was a bit of a shock to me.
The big difference though us that the UK is an individualist culture where the focus is on individuals getting what they want out of life, and that follows through in the parenting. In the UK the parents "own" the child. In some cultures the focus is on the community and the extended family "own" the child.
The UK is very good at safeguarding and takes it more seriously than a lot of countries.

Interesting what’s been said about meal times in the UK as we try and make a big effort to eat with the DC. It’s not every single night due to work or other commitments, but definitely more than 50% of the week’s evening meals. A lot of my friends are the same once their children are past weaning stage, so I wasn’t aware of the separate eating culture.

@antelopevalley interesting and I agree I think. There’s also such a difference in the way children are viewed - I feel in many other cultures they are valued a lot more than in the UK. At the airport in the European country, everyone with small children was given priority to the front of the passport check queue. I can’t imagine that ever happening in the UK! I had neighbours from Hong Kong until very recently, and not only were their own teenage children polite and beautifully behaved, the parents doted on my DC immediately.

I think we live in silos a lot more in this country? But that can’t always be helped, not everyone has family nearby.

There’s definitely a more communal thought of bringing up child here. Many families live in multi generational houses.

We have no family here, but all neighbours and friends here will equally tell Ds not to do something as well as equally shower him with hugs and affection.

Theres also less closed off houses near us. Ie most houses have open gardens with no high fences, so the children can just wander in and out of neighbours. This is encouraged and allowed. Our two neighbours 3 year olds just appear in our garden to play with our 2 year old. No parent in sight, and they both live 6-8 hours along.

I loved american children most on my travels 😁 confident, chatty and incredibly polite. Any bad behaviour was swiftly stopped by parents and apologies given immediately by the offending child.

Most Americans don't travel abroad. You are meeting a very self selecting bunch of kids.