Re children in restaurant

[Arbesque]

Four of us booked a table in an expensive restaurant last night for 7.30.
About 10 minutes after we'd sat down a couple came in pushing a buggy and with 2 other children in tow. They were seated at the table beside us.
One child kept bashing his spoon off the table, another kept crawling along the wide windowsill so that he was right behind my head, and the baby was kept amused by the father playing peek a boo while she screamed excitedly. This went on and on.

We asked to be moved to another table. There were none available.Then the baby started crying loudly and the toddler got tired and cranky and joined the wailing.

We left without dessert and complained on the way out. They knocked the price of a bottle of wine off our bill.

AIBU to think expensive restaurants, charging a fortune, should have a policy for dealing with situations like this?

We paid a lot of money for a meal we couldn't enjoy.

TheBlackSheepandMe Is there such thing as a well-behaved toddler? I think all toddlers have their moments if they're tired or bored and that's normal behaviour at that age. It would be a very atypical toddler who could be in a restaurant past their normal bedtime and not behave, well, like a normal toddler. Their attention span is so short at that age that it would be highly unusual. Surely it's better to go to a restaurant that's geared towards families. That restaurant didn't even have a kids menu, so unless your toddler eats 30€ plates of food, it would seem that the restaurant isn't catering for them. It's clearly catering to adult diners who are looking for high quality food and wine and a grown up ambience. Same as I wouldn't go to Pizza Hut for a romantic date with DP, the same works for where it's appropriate to take very young children.

You don't have to go to shitty restaurants if your child can behave themselves. Did you read the thread?

Although I can't really picture a toddler being able to sit there quietly for an extended period of time. Children usually build up to this.

I’m also a bit skeptical. Most people I’ve met with well-behaved toddlers think that not running around is what makes them so, and they excuse all kinds of noise. If you’ve got a reasonably quiet toddler who can sit for a long period of time whilst still being quiet then fair enough but I’ve not met one of those!

I’ve 2 kids, the first was marvellous, I used to bring her to restaurants, she used to eat from the adult menu, hated chips etc

the next two 🤣 only wanted beige food and the eldest was extremely sensitive to smell so got overwhelmed by all the new smells in restaurants - that one took a while to figure out so we didn’t go to many restaurants, some some he was fine in. I left restaurants with if he wasn’t okay after about 5 m

Can’t you just, you know, teach her to behave?

rainbowmilk
I’m also a bit skeptical. Most people I’ve met with well-behaved toddlers think that not running around is what makes them so, and they excuse all kinds of noise. If you’ve got a reasonably quiet toddler who can sit for a long period of time whilst still being quiet then fair enough but I’ve not met one of those!

I'm a bit sceptical that parents are incapable of bringing up toddlers that can sit at a table and not make loud noises.

@limitededitionbarbie
I absolutely hate any type of technology at the table. How do we develop their social skills while they stare at a screen? I did bring crayons and colouring sheets and that kept her happy.

@Freedomfighters
Telling parents that kids don't belong in high end restaurants is contradictory though isn't it? And yes I have read all of the thread.

Noisy kids don't belong in high end restaurants. Not many people care if kids who can talk quietly and behave themselves are there. That takes work from the parents to make that happen. I doubt a toddler would sit there without disturbing other people for an extended period of time though.

But it's not really any of your business how this child is parented so long as they're not bothering you.

Children with screens are generally quieter than even well-behaved children without screens - the latter chatter, drop their pencils and toys and make noise (albeit at reasonable levels). If I'm on a plane or train or eating out, I'd rather sit next to a child on a screen with headphones any day rather than an actively parented child. Generally you don't hear a murmur.

People absolutely have the right not to be bothered by my DC but they don't have the right to expect my DC to conform to some idealised vision of a beautific, smiling child sitting angelically, conversing in a low voice between colouring in flowers and butterflies. In reality, the crayons tends to end up snapped, up noses, in the flower vase or on the floor anyway. Not every meal out is a teaching opportunity for us... sometimes we eat out because we need to eat. We're not interested in putting on a happy family show for anyone... you mind your business and we'll mind ours!

You look after your own children and leave other people to look after theirs. It's none of your business if my child is on a screen so long as they're quiet and not bothering anyone.

It really fucks me off when colouring pencils and crayons are dropped on the floor or thrown around and chairs are repeatedly scraped back to pick them up, but I'm not an arse so I'd never dream of saying anything or looking disapprovingly at your parenting choices.

@LaDamaDeElche
Ok so my toddler wasn't normal because she was well behaved. Of course she had her moments but a word in the toilets with her sorted it out. We absolutely love our high end restaurants and long haul travel etc. It was our job as parents to bring up a civilised individual that wasn't bothering people in order for us to still be able to do these things.

@Goldbar
I can assure you none of what you described happened. Anyway it is very evident from the thread that the majority of toddlers are badly behaved and if they are well behaved that they're not normal. I'm out now as I find it offensive that because my toddler was well behaved that she is seen as some kind of nodding, smiling, obedient freek.

No, the opposite - her having her moments is what makes her a toddler, and unsuitable for a high end restaurant where you need to be able to sit quietly for extended periods and not have “moments”.

(I entirely appreciate that often adults at such restaurants can’t do this either, but that doesn’t mean that the standard doesn’t exist, it just means they’re also not complying with it.)

I don't believe anyone called your child a freak. 😄

Freak

@Freedomfighters
Stop acting like a toddler and run along. Don't you have normal badly behaved children to bring to McDonald's?

Yeah, nobody is calling your child a freak, we’re just disputing that she can sit for an extended period of time without making loud noises that require her to be taken elsewhere until she’s quiet again. That’d be incredibly unusual for the toddlers I’ve met (I used to teach that age, albeit abroad). It doesn’t sound that your child can do that, which makes her a normal toddler.

I would never judge your child whether she was colouring, reading the FT or watching repeats of Peppa on the ipad. Or even sitting quietly on the floor under the table. Why would I judge your child for doing something which doesn't impinge upon me at all? Some children do have easy personalities and you can take them anywhere and that's great. If yours is one of those and doesn't chatter too loudly and can colour in for ages without causing any commotion, then lucky you. But you must occasionally look around you and see that most young children aren't like that (and it can't all be attributed to 'bad parenting').

I'm sorry, you lost me at civilised individual when you're talking about a toddler. Toddlers are not naughty, they're toddlers. Their behaviour is age appropriate. They don't have long attention spans, are still learning about behaviour and consequences, have difficulty regulating their emotions, are still learning their own language etc etc. This is where they're at developmentally. To pretend otherwise, or that your parenting is so superior to others and that their children are badly behaved and yours is a civilised individual is just nonsense. You are attributing non age appropriate personality traits to very young children.

No one is saying yours isn't normal, but yes, it's unusual for a toddler to sit quietly for hours and behave in keeping with the ambience in "those" kind of restaurants. It's also unusual for toddlers to eat the kind of food served there, although granted, many kids do have a more diverse palate these days, especially if they've been exposed to a wide range of food from a very young age. That's why many Michelin star restaurants don't allow children. Not running around and behaving to fit the ambience of these types of restaurants are two different things. Taking them off to the loo to "have a word" for them behaving in a completely age appropriate way because you have taken them to an unsuitable environment for their age is hardly "good parenting" as you put it. You just feel entitled to go to those places whether they are appropriate for you toddler or not because you want to. Plenty of children grow up to behave well in restaurants and be "civilised" as you call it, without being dragged round high end restaurants in their early years. So take the stick out of your arse and stop labelling other toddlers as badly behaved and yours as well behaved, because a toddler can't be held to those standards. They don't have the emotional intelligence, impulse control or attention span yet, and developmentally that's completely normal. Unless you're bringing up the future Mozart, yours will be much the same as the rest, no matter what you may claim.

FYI, I spent years as a single mum with no help, so am the most child-friendly person you can imagine when it comes to taking kids out as DD basically went everywhere with me. I also live in a country where it's very normal to see kids in restaurants very late at night and we mostly socialise as a family unit. I also understand that there are restaurants aimed at adults and restaurants aimed at families.

I don't have toddlers any more. Thank god. My children are old enough to take themselves out to dinner without a responsible adult.

It was our job as parents to bring up a civilised individual that wasn't bothering people in order for us to still be able to do these things

Is your child grown up now? Or still a toddler?

@Freedomfighters
A teenager now.

Good job then. Your well behaved child would be welcome in my restaurant!