August babies shouldn't be allowed to move down a year

[SapphosRock]

My DD has a late August birthday, she is 6 nearly 7 and about to go into Year 3.

A friend in her class (let's call her Lucy) has an early August birthday but was allowed to move down a year. She is already 8.

No special needs, her mum just decided she would prefer her DD to be the oldest in the class rather than one of the youngest.

This has impacted my DD in a few ways. She is good at sports but being the youngest means she doesn't often win. On Sports Day Lucy came first in the year 2 running race. My DD came 4th so missed out on a medal.

Lucy had a sleepover for her 8th birthday and invited the girls in DD's class. Most went but I didn't think DD was ready for a sleepover as she's still only 6 so she missed out on a fun party.

Lucy got the biggest speaking part in the Christmas play as she is the most confident and articulate.

AIBU and precious to think Lucy should have been kept in the correct year group?

Ours was £41 a day BEFORE funded hours came off. After funded hours, we were about £70 a month for nursery. It's the cost of holiday clubs in particular that make school more expensive for us.

I am a teacher and I have said for years the system needs to change. All children are different and it needs to cater for all.
In France the children go to Nursery ( usually attached to a school and do three years. ( usually between 3 and 6). They then start year one. Each year the teachers and the parents decide if they can go up a year. If they are ready they do if they need to repeat a year they do. The kids do not care at all if someone redoubles a year. Most kids at some stage may need to. It works as the child needs come first.

maybe UK should look at that system. ?

Yes, fully agree. Pushing children through 11 years of compulsory "age" based education system where age decides what you do and when, may be easier for admin etc but not good for the children. Far more flexibility is need to move children between classes according to ability NOT age.

Personally, I'd love to see a "modular", term based system where you move between modules each term with a lot more freedom and much less dependence on age, where you work "up" the modules in each subject according to level of achievement, and you stay in lower modules if you're simply not capable of higher ones, retaking or moving sideways until you reach the level required to move up. That will help stop pupils getting left behind and never being able to catch up.

Obviously, for some things, like games/sports, it makes more sense to keep it age-related, but only in competitive situations where that matters, not "fun" or "exercise" where age doesn't matter.

As an august born who wasn't kept back it has done me no harm and the august borns in DSs class seem to be on even footing aswell. It's very much depends on the child I was always confident and tall so never really shrunk back a quitter younger child might have suffered.

Even if Lucy wasn't in you daughters class what's to say the person who got her space wouldn't be equally as confident.

As an august born who wasn't kept back it has done me no harm and the august borns in DSs class seem to be on even footing aswell. It's very much depends on the child I was always confident and tall so never really shrunk back a quitter younger child might have suffered.

Even if Lucy wasn't in you daughters class what's to say the person who got her space wouldn't be equally as confident.

This sounds like an excellent system.

Where do you draw the line with this though? There's some 6 year olds working at the same level as some 12 year olds. Many will never catch up to the same level however often they repeat years. Lessons are tailored anyway to meet individual needs. And if anything this system would make most of the things OP is griping about even worse. Being in an age-defined yeargroup is surely the best socially?

the Year group is determined by the year they are born. So the year they turn 6 is when they start year 1.
I can’t imagine many children are the same at 6 and 12. If so then the child has probably additional needs and would go to a different school to suit their needs. When a child reaches around 13/14 they will go down a route that suits them to get a Brevet. So example a child struggling for whatever reason will do a different brevet to one not. So everyone will leave with a qualification. A child can redouble a couple of times ( or more in some cases ) no stigma and it’s accepted that everyone learns at their own pace.

You think it’s an excellent system for children to be in the class they can deal with even though your entire thread is about Lucy and her parents doing exactly that?

@JustLyra if you read my posts you will see that Lucy would be absolutely fine in the year above, it's obvious to anyone who has met her.

Her mum is very open about moving her down a year so she would be the oldest rather than the youngest. No other reason.

As a French school she would have been put in year 1 when she reached the age. You can’t defer a child until they have been there, makes sense really as then the school have an opinion on your child too. Then after the first year if the sch were concerned they would advise she stayed and re did the year, then the parents give their opinion. Usually they agree with each other. At least under this system children are not kept down for the wrong reasons.

it’s interesting that you steadfastly refuse to accept that it’s highly unlikely that’s the only reason. Parents aren’t likely to tell other parents that their child wasn’t ready for school. Especially ones who blatantly resent their child .

under the system you think sounds “excellent” your Dd would likely have more children of different ages in her class - as any system like that would place more emphasis on academic balance than sporting prowess so your DD would end up being further from the medal slots in sports… which is the point of your complaint

The posters who keep saying there are DC in their DC’s school without any additional needs who deferred starting school, how do you know the DC have no additional needs? I haven’t told all the parents in my DC’s class about his diagnosis, why would I?

To be fair though she might just not want to give you an in-depth report as to why Lucy was kept behind. My dd is adopted ans as such has priority choice over where I send her. She's going to a school with a very tight catchment area. When people find out she's from the catchment area most people don't care and recognise that it's none of their business. The ones who raise their eyebrows at it or question how she's managed to get in are exactly the kindof judgemental, resentful busybodies I don't want knowing so I don't tell them. They don't have a right to know my dd's private information just as you have no right to know Lucy's

*When people find out she's from way out of the catchment area sorry

Should be remembered that until fairly recently (and still in some places) there were many rural primary schools that had only one or two rooms, and where it was quite common for children of very different ages to be in the same room. And in some places in Europe and North America, children may be accelerated or kept back according to how they are progressing. This can have its problems especially if the class assignments are made on the basis of test performance rather than children's or parents' preferences; but is arguably better for children than streaming and selective schooling.

Those statements by the schools goes against the Schools Admissions Code. They are not allowed to impose blanket policies like that.

This document www.gov.uk/government/publications/summer-born-children-school-admission/admission-of-summer-born-children-advice-for-local-authorities-and-school-admission-authorities sets out responsibilities for LAs and Academy Trusts as to how they should handle such requests from parents.

dear god... when I was 13, all I was worried about was when my next football match was !!

I have seen this puberty argument a number of times. Even some schools try to use it!
Utter bobbins, sorry.

Puberty sets in at such a range of ages that a delayed child starting puberty is just lost in the general noise of normal variation.

As for sports, most sports have a dispensation for children being taught out of cohort. The FA, for example issues a dispensation on confirmation that the child is being taught out of normal age group as long as it is no more than a year different.

It wasn't possible to do that back then. The Schools Admissions Code amendment allowing that change was in 2014.

I delayed my own daughter who was 5 in mid July - she starts in Reception in September.

With hindsight, it was absolutely the right thing to do. Often with young children that struggle in school, social and emotional maturity is a bigger problem than academic ability.

My daughter was lagging well behind emotionally - no way would she have been ready for school last Sept at 4 years and a few weeks.

She will be leaving nursery next month with a first class honours degree in Screaming The Place Down, but the last three months she has been so much better. Nursery staff agreed that we have done the right thing for her.

She will fit in with her adopted peer group just fine, some of her nursery mates will be joining her. And having seen the rest of the children at a recent event at her new school... she is still the smallest!!

So many in this thread speak about parents delaying their children because "they dont want DC to be the youngest" - but it's not about being the youngest or eldest, it's about readiness for school.

Perhaps the schools you teach in had better be aware of the changes in the Schools Admissions Code with regard to summer born children.

Too many headteachers/schools/academy trusts are clueless in this regard, and it shows when parents make requests and these schools come back with "oh, we don't do that here" or "we only do that for SEND" etc... both statements are unlawful.

I agree OP! And I'm an Oct baby with Dec, Feb and March babies so no skin in the game. It just pushes the July babies to the youngest in the year status and where does it end? I think the French system above sounds more sensible.

Why do you attribute Lucy's achievements only to her age? Maybe the child is simply better and more talented than others (regardless of how old she is)

There will be many 'Lucys' in your DD's life. Perhaps it's time you learnt how to deal with it?

What an odd thread

What on earth do you expect teachers to do abkut this? Tell Lucy she can't have a sleepover? Give her a 5 second handicap in any sports races? A good teacher will individualise a child's teaching regardless of their age/ability. The rest is none of their business really

Don’t be ridiculous - it’s about understanding and recognising the patterns a summer child is more likely on average to fall into (not as good due to age, becomes less keen to try, and so on). There are a load of different factors that decide whether a summer born will fall into this. As you say, individualised where possible.

French system sounds good because kids start later so parents are less likely to have the dilemma about whether their children are ready to start.