To think that very few people can manage £4200 energy bills

[Butterflyfluff]

news.sky.com/story/energy-bills-forecast-to-rise-even-higher-than-previously-thought-12668906

This simply isn’t manageable for the majority of people.

Where’s this going to end?

I'm not going to withhold payment, but there seems no reason to allow them the benefit of my money in advance.

People will probably regret cancelling their direct debits on the 1st of October when they get a quarterly bill early next year that's well over £1k for the highest use winter months.

Direct debit spreads the cost evenly throughout the year, I don't have a problem with it.

I have sufficient saving's that it's not a problem and would encourage family and friends if they join to think it through. I'm sure Emily Pankhurst in an Edwardian version on MN would have come under attack for both her actions and for encouraging others to do similar up to the point of imprisonment and death and for what votes for women. We stand on the shoulders of giants.

They are often over inflated now though. Even ofgem is/was investigating it.

Frankly, if low use household gets 6k annual quote, it's bs EVEN with rises ahead and winter coming. I am low use household and the quotes I was getting until this week were 5k (if I went on DD). Fuck that, frankly. This week it calmed down but I wonder if that's because suddenly I can't see quotes by the big ones for some reason.

That's where lots of that anger about DDs come from.

Depends entirely on whether they've put the money aside or not. I think most people are going to find energy bills painful full stop over the next few months though.

But 'low use households aren't going to be getting £6k annual quotes unless they're looking at expensive fixes that are above the current and future price caps or they're not actually as low use as they think.

The current price cap is around £2k. It's predicted to rise to around £4k. If your energy is costing £6k pa, then you will pay that amount, whether you pay quarterly or by direct debit and the only way to change that is to use less, or stay on the price cap rather than fix, which is currently likely to be more expensive even when the October and January price rises are taken into account.

I never had DD. Always used to put money aside, as I don't trust energy provider will do the calculations right 😬

I avoid direct debit for council tax, because I've got into trouble in the past when the council didn't take the payments or the bank paid them twice. I have a DD for gas & electricity but I'm with Octopus, where I can set the amount myself. I'm currently increasing it by a bit each month to get well into credit before winter. However, I don't want to go as much into credit as they would like me to because I don't believe credit balances will continue to be honoured if any more suppliers go bust. Bulb just cost the government so much, I don't think they'll take on something like that again.

Good point they don't have deposit guarantees like the banks. Just in time could replace just in case.

Warning from Martin Lewis

Not sure if this has already been posted, but this dude is not one for scaremongering.

Look. I put my usage in, click on fix and that's what it churns out. Well churned out.
Yes, the unit prices are abysmal at 60p on Coop for example, but even with that, the annual usage I put in should not create that quote.

What it feels like is like car insurance. You know, ehen they quote you 10k because they don't eant to insure you.

I think Truss in particular is really two faced like Boris, she will create/change policy on the hoof depending on the needs of the electorate she is gunning for.

So for now, its all about tax cuts, helping the rich save more of their money and helping businesses, etc.

Once she is elected than her main concern will be coaxing the middle class. So she will go into handout mode, despite telling the party members she won't do that.

I don't think she wants to do it, but the situation is going to be so dire to her electoral chances down the line she will HAVE to do something else.

Labour needs to announce something massive on Monday. Today's timid 'sightly lower bills for pre-paid customers' doesn't cut it, even as a build-up.

Yeah, they're not in government but they can alter the argument, and so far Truss' "energy profits aren't evil" schtick is handing it to them on a plate. If Starmer is timid about this he's redundant.

No-one lost any money due to all the companies that went bust in the last couple of years, and the remaining companies are a lot more stable and better run than the ones that failed.

Credit balances were transferred over to new suppliers and is one reason why the standing charge increased so much.

All suppliers pay a levy that would be used to cover the balances should there be any further failures.

Everyone is free to pay on receipt of quarterly bills if that suits them better but that's a separate issue to the high price of energy, which is nothing to do with the retail companies that we pay our bills to. They actually make a very small annual profit per customer, about £10 per year per account.

Is Starmer coming to do a speech now Brown had done all his homework?

Had = Now

So an expensive fix. 60 p per unit compared with 27 p for the current price cap rate.

And no they don't want to take you (or anyone really) on as a customer if they won't make a profit out of that customer, which they don't really at the price cap.

Many suppliers have taken on a lot of extra customers from the failed suppliers so could well be operating beyond their capacity and might be struggling to service existing customers, let alone new ones.

Or just a random extra word - I'm going to blame the heat and bow out now before I go full gibberish.

The problem with the DD is they are often use previous usage as a way of forecasting future spend. It works well in normal times but when there rising prices not so much.

Problem is it seems to ignore the simple fact that as prices get more expensive people typically will cut back on usage. So if you used 12k worth of gas last year, it will setup a new DD based on 12k gas rolling forwards. but instead you may only use 9k gas as your being much more careful with usage.

However your DD will be setup for 12k use, not 9k, and therefore be 25% too high.

Of course its possible the increases beyond this winter mean the forecasts are correct, even with the wrong methodology.

Factual explainer on what will happen if you don't pay

What if I don't pay?

😁

You constantly have a go at Labour but whatever they announce wont make a jot of difference and if they come out with good ideas, the Tories will use them.

Folk will then say "oh look how good the Tories are" and vote them back in, its not Starmers job to design Govt policy.

Why no criticism of the Tories?

Johnson still blaming Labour for no new Nuclear, fortunately Labour were kicked out of office on 2019 and the Tories will now build a nuclear power station each and every year.

I'd like to ask the conservatives where those forty hospitals are that Boris Johnson promised.
The energy bills are a disgrace and many will simply have to turn it off this year or drastically cut down. It is worrying people and we are not even at the peak of the price rises yet.
It is all very grim.

Always have a go at Labour? Yeah, I bloody disappointed with them. Where the hell has Keir been for the last four weeks? Why is Gordon Brown doing all the heavy lifting when he isn't even an MP anymore? Where the fuck is the opposition - they are meant to be opposing?

To the extent I still give Johnson any thought at all I have no doubt he'll want this crisis to be absolutely terrible so people look back on his tenure with some kind of fondness.