Port of Dover Critical Incident

[AndreaC74]

Why are we blaming the french? they didn't vote for Brexit and aren't responsible for increasing/paying for extra capacity at the French border posts on UK soil.

Stamping passports is what happens to 3rd country nationals & that adds time, a lot of it, when dealing with 100s of '000s of passengers, plus having recently been to France, i ve seen UK people arguing with French officials because they don't want their passports stamped!

The UK seems incapable of organising anything at the moment, the numbers travelling across the channel is entirely predictable and delays we are now seeing were talked about pre 2016, i remember seeing the graphs on how long the queues would be for just a few seconds of delay for each passenger.... all Project Fear.

I don't like/trust Johnson either. It's almost like I came to my own conclusion and saw through the bullshit.

I'm not shocked at Dover. I will also bet it will be sorted and won't be a problem next year/the next few days. This is only because it was an ideal time to create mayhem.

Were critical incidents called at Dover before?

Someone else who doesn't recognise that any problems that do exist are amplified by Brexit and a hard border.

Dover has its problems. A hard border and increased checks exacerbates those problems.

You do understand that, don't you?

This is only because it was an ideal time to create mayhem.

Who created mayhem?

England and France. A quick Google and you will see this.

Maybe we should think about using Ramsgate again?

Plenty of space to expand. It could offer people a smoother journey with fewer delays.

"Someone else who doesn't recognise that any problems that do exist are amplified by Brexit and a hard border.
Dover has its problems. A hard border and increased checks exacerbates those problems.
You do understand that, don't you?"

They obviously don't understand . That's the problem.

They created this mayhem on purpose? Why?

I have just solved the problem of not enough space at Dover - but it's a bit radical and I think the people of Dover might object

Why not take over the Western Docks? It might mean goodbye to the Marina...but it would improve the flow of goods and allow expansion.

Or look at Ramsgate?

These are some radical ideas - but do they really want lorries stacked up the M20?

I just can't think! Why would France want Britain to think a vote made a few years ago was wrong? Why would Britain allow this thinking to happen?? Both sides have an agenda. It will fix itself really quickly. You would question why it took so long.

Mostly leftwing remainers who seem to think everything in life is some one else's fault. This country needs a hard lesson in self accountability, if you have an issue look at your own actions first not expect the government to baby site everything you do and pay you to live. If you work hard and make your own informed desitions and take responsibility for you own actions life is far more easier. Some on here should try it

So, @Swizandswap, how is it the fault of remainers that, when warned about this problem and advised to invest in more customs facilities, this pro-Brexit government did fuck all about it?

I voted against Brexit, I'm not in that queue. How is my fault?

I must say, you're no advertisement for the standards of education and literacy of Brexit voters, let alone their powers of logical thinking.

Sorry, my mistake. I didn't realise you werebeing disingenous, I thought you were asking a genuine question so I responded in good faith. My bad.

A few French staff were temporarily delayed (on the way in to Folkstone) and suddenly it's a plan by the French Government.

Hard borders mean greater delays, particularly when it is busy.

"Enhanced passport controls since Brexit mean the average time for a car to be cleared by French officials at Dover has roughly tripled from 25-30 seconds to between 70 seconds and two minutes, Doug Bannister, chief executive of the Port of Dover, said"

twitter.com/thetimes/status/1551194675155009536?s=21&t=epW4bV-zWdd25jb71Jmhaw

So no break down then????

Funny that!!

I'm completely genuine. How many other people have come out and announced they voted Brexit? It doesn't happen often enough on mumsnet!

What's going on down there today, is it shifted yet or still constipated?

Both sides have an agenda? About what?

France is sticking to the oven ready brexit deal Johnson negotiated and signed off, what is wrong with that?

France (Macron) want to let Britain know what they have left. Britain (Johnson) wants to fuel any hate for the Eu.

Very few on this thread have said it's normal/expected. Don't worry. Don't be angry.

This is a simple exercise, years of prep and knowledge and forward thinking. Comes with teething issues. People are paid alot of money to avoid this.

It still happened. Both sides have blamed each other.

It maybe just my thinking that this should be sorted. I didn't go to France. I have no vested interest. I didn't sit in traffic.

This is the UK government's issue to sort out, not the French government's.

As PP have pointed out, Dominic Raab's comments while Foreign Secretary about not understanding the significance of the Dover-Calais route sums up the government's general lack of knowledge and interest. It's not a surprise that these checks were going to be introduced and there was time to make some changes but a few extra booths were only introduced last week.

As has been reported, it takes around an extra minute/minute and a half to do the new checks. A small time in itself but significant when multiplied by all the traffic at peak times. Yes, Dover has had issues in the past, but if you add an extra minute per vehicle it is inevitable queues will build.

The government either needs to plan how, and if Dover can be expanded or look at alternatives. The attraction of Dover is it is the closest point to France therefore crossings are quicker and cheaper. Improving facilities at Ramsgate or elsewhere will only work if that longer route can be made more attractive. (Maybe the thought of not sitting in hours of traffic will be enough if an incentive!).

Another option is to scrap the Le Touquet agreement so that passport checks have to be done on the French side. The UK government was the driving force behind the agreement, however, so that wouldn't be popular. It would also probably still lead to jams and delays, just with vehicles trying to disembark rather than embark.

However, we can probably be fairly certain that the government has given little to no thought to the situation, much like with the rest of the practicalities of Brexit. If there is no big sound bite to be made, they just don't seem to bother doing anything.

And the Bay City Rollers hadn't been formed yet either which is about as relevant.

No one, just no one is saying there weren't difficulties with Dover before Brexit, been caught up in them myself. But if you have an extremely busy port with little capacity to expand facilities, were the slightest problem causes major tailbacks, adding a hard border into the mix was always going to make those problems more frequent and bigger.

FelicityFlops · Yesterday 20:53
Oh, but hang on. What used to happen before we joined the EU in 1972?
I definitely remember going on holiday to Europe in 1970 and 1971.
As far as I remember we didn't need visas and children didn't have their own passports they were included on a parent's passport.
I did a school exchange in 1973 on a British Visitor's Passport. I don't think I had my own passport for at least another 2 years, possibly after I was 16?

But the whole point of Brexit for many was to stop freedom of movement. 😵‍💫Actually I remember customs and border checks in the 70s being a major pita.

A critical incident probably isn't necessary if temporary and can be resolved, like a strike. Brexit is permanent and there's nothing the port can do.

Brexit always was a shit idea, now we have to live with it.

Husband says no particular problems there this am. He is going via the Chunnel

Letter in the Guardian which says it all: "Any leave voters queueing at Dover, you've got the end of freedom of movement you wanted".
Historically, pre-1973 you didn't need a visa to visit France but you did to stay and work there. Now there's a similar arrangement for stay and work. Progress?

I went interailing in the early 90s. Endless passport checks. It was a pain. Brexit is a. Total pain in the arse…