Summer holidays - outdated

[Wednesdayafternoon]

So I was just scrolling through Facebook and I saw some pictures after school club/breakfast club to my sons school put up and it just got me thinking how crazy it is that schools just completely shut down for like 6-7 weeks.
They have all these facilities during term time to support working families because there is obviously a need to for it, but in the holidays... ahh f*ck it!
Obviously o know there's summer schemes but at a massive expense and also different hours and locations.
My sons school isn't offering one so he's attending some random school for 3 days over the summer mainly just so he's socialising!
I'm extremely lucky as my mum is a great help to me during the holidays. And obviously I'm very much looking forward to spending more time with my boys and no school run... hurry!!!
But I just find it crazy that schools close for such a significant period of time.
Obviously I know school isn't childcare but it school itself enables parents to work so it kind of is 🤷🏼‍♀️

I hope the poster who commented about other places having much longer school holidays ... I had a feeling the prices would be hugely different to UK, £80 a month. I pay £200 a month. My friend has an aunt in Italy again longer hols but cheaper childcare in the school hols.

£80 per month for child care is so cheap. Thats £20 a week, £4 per day.

I'm £30 per day. With a not for profit committee run organisation. OK the hours at 8.30-5.30.

So that must be getting subsidised from somewhere. So effectively paid via taxation as we all know nothing is free.

Your probably right that the UK holidays being so short make it difficult to recruit and set summer schemes up.

@Itisasecret no thanks, I actually quite like my job, despite the impact it will have on me spending time with my LG (which obviously I weighed up before deciding to have children).

I personally don't think it's teacher bashing to point out that teachers do get longer holidays, while also recognising they do a lot of unpaid hours, just like I do - and anyone else who earns a salary. I also don't think it's teacher bashing to discuss the fact that a lot of children struggle with 6 weeks holiday whether that be due to anxiety regarding returning (like I suffered) or because of problems at home. This doesn't necessarily mean children should spend more time in school. Clearly this is a government/childcare problem.

I have 5 teachers in my family so I see firsthand how hard they work and how much they care about their jobs and the children. But I also see that they get to enjoy long summers with their own children, while a lot of other parents really struggle - financially and emotionally. That's not to belittle any aspect of their role, in all honesty, it's a little bit of jealousy that I too work hard, worry about my clients, work long hours including evenings and weekends and I am going to miss out on so much while paying through the nose for my LG to be sent off to various holiday clubs for several years. I don't have a problem admitting that. Would I swap? Possibly, if I could turn the clock back. Would I swap now? Not a chance, mainly because I couldn't afford to retrain as I'm already paying off £30k of educational debt and couldn't afford to not be earning. It's overly simplistic to say "well go and become a teacher" and you know it.

These threads always go the same way, but for some reason teachers cannot fathom that the rest of the population don't hate and disrespect them. Holidays are a touchy subject, a bit like solicitors salaries!

£200 a WEEK! Sorry got mixed up.

But do you work most evenings and weekend, unpaid, marking and planning? The difference with teaching is the vast majority have to take work home. Most teachers do at least 3 hours extra work a day, start at 7 leave at 7 and still have marking or resources to make. The children of teachers that I know always say they barely see their parents at term time, there parents never get to go to assemblies and sports days as are busy teaching other peoples kids.
they don’t get paid for the extra hours of working at home. They don’t get paid for the parents evening, attending fundraiser events, residential trips, or answering emails at 11.30 at night, the list of unpaid work is endless. They also are paid on a pro rata bases so not paid for the holidays.
We have a huge teacher recruitment and retention issue in this country. Massive problem actually and numbers of empty places in teacher training is growing. It’s shit like this thread where parents view school as free childcare and don’t place value on education and whinge about the holidays teachers get that help make many in education go fuck this I’m getting a nice office job instead.
Your childcare needs are yours to sort. Why should the government pay hundreds of thousands more to keep schools open all year? Having children is a choice. When would schools carry out maintenance work? When would vital training take place? Sorting classes out takes weeks. Last year my childrens primary had to have their whole heating system replaced, took all summer and carried over to half term. This summer it’s vital work being done to the hall and kitchens. Can’t be done when children are there.
Schools are not childcare and the sooner a lot of parents realise this the better.

@ClaudiasWinkleMan your absolutely right that schools are not childcare however your in your own bubble because you don't have to source childcare for school hols. I changed jobs from a night to day job and my God I had a very rude awakening to going to having to pay for just 2 days childcare sometimes to 4 days every holidays.

I do agree though it's a parents responsibility but it is easier said than done!

Not in a bubble at all. I have to pay for childcare. I’m not a teacher. Have worked in education before but am a regular working parent if 2 children with SEN. So often much harder to find childcare. I just don’t think it’s anyone else’s problem but mine.

You don't know that.
I personally think a long summer break is a bad idea. Shorter breaks through the year would be better.

Sorry, can I just clarify op. Are you comparing 'overtime' by equating the 1 hour overtime you mentioned and missing lunchbreaks with working a 70 hour week when you are paid for half that?
Or are you comparing with other professions that do a 70 hour week like lawyers, whose salary reflects that overtime and is hugely more inflated than a teachers.

The only profession I can think of as coming close to the amount of unpaid overtime to teaching are nursing (who get bashed nearly as much as teachers and have a similarly piss poor wage and public attitude to what they should do) and some.swlf employed people who choose their own hours.

People have rightly identified this as a teacher bashing thread because you keep returning to how it should be schools who sort the problem and teachers who emphathise with you, rather than conceding it's an organisational government issue.

No amount of best teacher mugs or whatever else you bit the person currently dedicated to your child is going to change the fact that you are entitled and treat teachers like slaves.

But thanks for being a walking reminder why so many teachers are leaving the profession. Great love demonstration.

Why would you want short breaks during the rest of the year?

To break it up for the students. They get very tired, it gets very intense. Rather than 6 weeks in the summer, do 4 then have 2 weeks in October and May. Just a suggestion.

Also are people forgetting we live in bloody England.
Enrichment in summer: visit to beaches, parks, woods. All free minus travel.

Enrichment in summer: indoor activities like softplay, swimming pools, craft clubs. Cost money.

Small breaks would mean bored children indoors on their holidays and sweltering in hot classrooms in August.

Long summer breaks mean children outdoors, families can enjoy the weather and coordinate holidays.

Surely you don't need to be a child expert to understand nice weather means there's is more to do with kids?
Or is common sense for parents something teachers have to do now too?

We have a cost of living crisis. If schools did open up for holiday clubs or activities 8:30 -5:00, teachers will not cover them unless they are paid for doing so (and many still wouldn’t) and any specially appointed staff would need paying a decent rate, Lighting and building maintenance will cost money. Equipment (toys, pens, paper) will cost money: many schools have used up all their supplies weeks ago. As previous posters explained, the long holiday is a time for maintenance work to be done which can’t be done when children are around anyway. Our summer holidays are some of the shortest in the world and children do need a break and benefit from time to rest, play and enjoy activities - paid or simply reading and drawing.

The government won’t give money to fund additional childcare as the coffers seem to be empty - furlough, Covid, Brexit or the situation in Ukraine can be blamed. Most taxpayers can’t afford tax rises and many would be reluctant to fund something that for most isn’t an essential, especially if they had to suck it up themselves - which is how human nature works. Therefore, you are perfectly reasonable asking for better provision but you have to expect to pay for your childcare yourself. The American model of ‘camps’ offered at different prices seems fair. If a child is very shy and they can’t take crowds of new people, you need to develop a support network so that maybe five families share holiday childcare, especially if you WFH and have KS2 children who need minimal supervision.

I think it falls to women to compromise their work because of school holidays, and it's not easy without flexible employers. Someone may correct me, but don't civil servants have more flexibility in this regard?
Children need breaks and they need family time. As a society we need to think how this can happen to support the majority of families.

Teachers don’t have an issue with the long holidays, just with the jealousy and vitriol it causes in other people.

To be fair, I’m bloody jealous of those who get to WFH. That’s a nice little number, isn’t it 🙂? Swings and roundabouts…swings and roundabouts.

civil servants have more flexibility in this regard?
Cival.servents may, teachers and school staff don't.
Unless medical emergency, you are not allowed to make medical appointments in term time.
You can't take.holiday in term time and have to commit to your core hours, no exceptions.
Part time is possible, but the reality is the hours of a part time.teaching job roughly equate to a regular job. The only freedom you gain is on your official days off and most schools expect you to be contactable.to.your partner teacher on your days off.
Then there's the fact part timers are not popular with parents so schools.actively try and avoid it where they can and parents often make life so difficult it's easier to leave or revert back to full time hours.

Here we go again!
Teachers do not just work on school days - it goes on all through ‘holidays’ too.
Why don’t you all train to be teachers - there seem to be plenty of vacancies out there.

And I think I should point out that those in education are overwhelmingly female with parenting responsibilities.

I hope the poster who commented about other places having much longer school holidays ... I had a feeling the prices would be hugely different to UK, £80 a month. I pay £200 a month. My friend has an aunt in Italy again longer hols but cheaper childcare in the school hols.

Well then the answer is cheaper childcare,not shorter holidays for kids.

I agree. 6-7 weeks is too long, for kids and parents.

I would prefer we had 4 weeks and then 2 weeks in May and either two weeks in Oct or three at Christmas.

The issue with two weeks in October (which some parts of Scotland do) is it can be cold. Its great for those wanting a cheap florida holiday but not great for those at home.

4 weeks in summer is too short for the majority of people to get time off with kids. And for areas which rely on uk tourism.

May is also right before the secondary school exams. So older kids will end up studying through it.

That would be my preference. I say that as a teacher and mum of adult DC!

4 weeks would be unworkable for working parents trying to all take leave at the same time. Many workplaces wouldn't allow it so you would get people who couldn't take any time off with their kids. Not to mention the extortionate cost of travel if you try to compress it into 4 weeks.

So we may as well stick with what we've got