Go on fess up, who’s eating all the good graduates?

[Whatsyournameandwheredyoucomefrom]

I am currently interviewing grads for an entry level role in the marketing industry and SWEETMARYANDJOSEPH it’s tough going.

I’ve been taking in cohorts of grads for 10 years and in past years they were always keen to learn, chatty, determined to show the best of themselves and keen to know more about the industry. I’ve found graduate hiring to be a really
lovely thing; starting people off on their careers is something I love to do.

This year is bloody horrendous. I’ve done 23 interviews so far (5 roles available) and bar 2, without exception there’s zero enthusiasm or ‘self selling’, it’s more like I’m asking them to do a household chore and they’re getting pocket money in return - it’s ‘well if I really must do this job, what’s in it for me’. For example today a 21 year old cut me off mid sentence as I was talking about possible career progression through the industry and said ‘yeah I’m probably not thinking about that right now, I’m just figuring out what industry I want to get into right now you know? Like what is it about XXXX (that industry I’ve been in my entire career) that you think is worth pursuing because I could do basically anything and be fine you know?’ - very nearly snapped ‘this is an interview not a careers fair’ but held my tongue. Another told me £22k was basically slavery (her exact words) and she couldn’t work for less than £30k - not even graduated yet ffs. Also, oop norf so no London premium either.

I’m not expecting gratitude for the interview, I don’t even expect them to know anything about the industry and I’ll pay them £22k for the privilege of being fairly useless for a year while they learn. They can be earning £30k in 2 years with the training they get at the early stages through this role and I’ve had some go one to £50k+ in that time and yet almost without exception, none of the grads this year have turned up to the interview with any indication that they actually want the job.

What is this?? Is someone sweeping up all the driven, good candidates and paying them megabucks? Or are universities setting mad expectations on salary and not teaching interview skills?

I’m 35 so it’s not like I’m totally out of touch and feel a bit daft saying it but is this a generational thing? Covid?? WHAT IS HAPPENING?

I'm actually a bit shocked
I earn money wage so a bit under 20k plus commission (which isn't guaranteed) usually come out with about £1400pm which I live on (no benefits)
I'm 38 with a degree and can't find anything vaguely local paying much better that doesn't want experience/a million other qualifications/1hr commute. Small city in the NW

I really agree with this - the benefits sound amazing but particularly things like healthcare I would hang on til the salaries are a bit higher. Rail fares is again great, but it is taxable so you might like to whack that on the base salary too.

The overall package does sound fab, and it sounds like the company is an amazing place to work so ironically I think it might be the marketing that's letting you down.

I'm fairly well paid but would be happy to take a reasonable pay cut for that work life balance - but that's easy for me to say because I own a house and am not trying to scrimp for a deposit while paying rent.

I think most people are sifting through millions of job options and the best grads will have plenty of choice. So unless your adverts have a table in that says:

Base salary £22k
5 Weeks holiday over and above statutory: worth £2.2k
Your train fare paid: worth up to £3k
Home working grant: £1k
Private healthcare: £1k
Gym: £400
Free lunch: £600
Pension @ 10%: £2.2k

Total package: £32.6k

Then it's really easy not to appreciate the value of all those benefits. And even then you're still going to be missing out on the graduates who filter the job websites (I seem to remember it went in bands of 2.5k when I was looking, worth checking what the ones you advertise on use - you don't want to be at the top of a filter band).

It sounds like you want quite a specific sort of grad - someone who recognises the importance of work life balance but is happy to work hard and efficiently in the time they are there for, and to maximise the benefits of the free training you give. That's different from the "earn as much money as I can as fast as possible" grads, it's different from the "get a professional qualification and keep on steadily up the ladder" grads, and it's different from the "give back to society at any cost to myself" grads. A job like the one you advertise is going to get a mixed bag of the "can't really be fucked" grads (which it sounds like there's an excess of) and some of the ones you want. I think it's worth having a think about how you could change your advertising to get the middle section of grads because actually with that good salary progression etc I think they might well be a fit but not necessarily assuming the role is for them? Obviously that's just my inference from this thread and you'll know much more than me about your own company!

Have you considered not wasting the time and money on new graduates and giving older people, especially women, the training and opportunity to go on to earning 50k in a few years instead?

You’re right. OP seems to be interviewing all the crap ones because they are 10 a penny.

OP you need to sort your search out. There are plenty of grads that would be happy to have this role but you’re aiming too low.

OP change your search criteria. Where did you find your current applicants?

Random two pages I picked off indeed of jobs near me
Maybe I'm just in a job wasteland!
P.S if anyone has careers suggestions I'm all ears, feel free to PM me/help

You don’t seem to understand how this works. It’s not the years of experience. It’s the skill set.
If he’s done the right kind of economics he can get a job close to 30K, easy. With professional exams passed increasing the pay until he ends up at 50K, 3 years in.

That’s a great point!I also filter on salary. not that it works with the sheer amount of coy ‘competitive salary’ ads…

Millennials as a generation are typically those born 1981-1996, so not this time. Probably half the posters on this thread are millennials 😂

Good to see the tables have turned, I was doing “marketing internships” (free labour) as a graduate paying over £300 per month for a London travel card to work for free for a marketing agency. Glad these young ones have the gumption to speak up & be treated fairly for their contributions.

I’ve never seen anything decent on Indeed. I usually find my new jobs on LinkedIn.

@TuftyMarmoset the issue I'm having is they all seem to want qualifications linked to the job or 2-5 years experience
Everything else is just above min wage which is what I currently earn
I have always done customer service jobs, and mostly contact centre, some care and some retail, I'm pretty bright and pick stuff up quickly and have a speed reading talent but nothing is available

I started on £25k on a grad scheme 15 years ago + car + bonus.

I think the package is the problem, esp in current market

No not a shit attitude..it’s called ambition and not underselling yourself!

Are you in Manc? Might have ideas for you

We're paying our entry level marketing grads £30k. They seem like a motivated bunch.

@OooErr I'm not! I'm in the home of the first KFC and PNE (typed like that for search reasons)

@PeloAddict just apply anyway even if you don’t meet the criteria, a man would!

@Porcupineintherough

I agree, years ago (and I'm talking 20, 30+ years ago) many people did work their arses off, yet stayed in poverty.

But you'd be much less likely to be working hard and living in poverty if you picked up a professional degree in the 60s, 70s, 80s or 90s.

Given recent rent increases, along with energy bills increasing etc etc how can you expect an adult to live on £22k?

When I started the pay was poor I had to do bar work in the evening to top up my income. But getting that experience was invaluable

This is almost exactly what teachers get starting and then after five years. I don’t know for sure, but I suspect nurses etc are probably similar. No wonder there’s a recruitment crisis if these aren’t seen as liveable salaries.

I wish I’d had the confidence as a graduate to expect more!

Literally why we don’t call it a grad scheme externally - it’s open to all. We’ve had a couple of career changers over the years and a couple of maternity leave returners - it’s mostly grads though.

I was paid considerably more than that for a marketing grad scheme up north three years ago, and my degrees were in totally unrelated fields with no marketing experience whatsoever.

if you are looking good grads you need to be starting them on not a spec of dust less than £27,000

Are you reaching out to marketing departments at universities? Quite often they will have a list of good grads that are looking to change jobs, maybe under employer or haven't yet found the right role yet that they will promote direct too.

Look beyond the Manchester Unis too.... Think about Lancaster, Sheffield etc.