Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder why mumsnet hates Jordan Peterson?

177 replies

Gogster · 01/07/2022 22:25

Strange because he's actually keen on women's rights

OP posts:
Skinterior · 01/07/2022 22:50

If you can face it I'd recommend his Joe Rogan interview. He pretty much covers the lot. What a PP said about the 80/15/5% of sense to madness is pretty much where I come down on him.

Problem is, the 15% is extremely influential and often taken quite out of context.

xxcatcatcatxx · 01/07/2022 22:51

I wonder what Mumsnet thinks of Joe Rogan?

Wouldloveanother · 01/07/2022 22:51

Stompythedinosaur · 01/07/2022 22:47

Sure. It was in an interview where he was speaking about Alek Minassian.
"Violent attacks are what happens when men do not have partners, and society needs to work to make sure those men are married."“He was angry at God because women were rejecting him. The cure for that is enforced monogamy. That’s actually why monogamy emerges.”

That’s not the same as ‘we should capture women and force them to marry these men, whether they want to or not’

I think it was more emphasis on monogamous, high quality relationships so isolated people feel less isolated

Skinterior · 01/07/2022 22:52

Again - it's important to step outside the echo chamber sometimes!

Getoff · 01/07/2022 22:52

user1471504747 · 01/07/2022 22:48

He believes in enforced monogamy, and that it is up to women to solve the problems of male violence and incels, for a start

Can you post a link where he says any of those things?

Stompythedinosaur · 01/07/2022 22:53

Another of his particularly memorable quotes is about his belief that men are superior to women.

“The people who hold that our culture is an oppressive patriarchy, they don’t want to admit that the current hierarchy might be predicated on competence."

I am genuinely astonished that anyone on here is a fan of him!

SpaceChocolatel · 01/07/2022 22:53

As with all people he says some things that are very good points some things that are nonsense. Personally I find his communication style difficult to digest and often gets my back up before I've really given him a chance. Some people (overgeneralisimg - men) like his communication style and pay him a lot of attention.

JenniferPlantain · 01/07/2022 22:53

www.macleans.ca/opinion/the-context-of-jordan-petersons-thoughts-on-enforced-monogamy/amp/

He’s a woman-hating troll.

user1471504747 · 01/07/2022 22:54

Getoff · 01/07/2022 22:52

Can you post a link where he says any of those things?

Here you go: https://www.jordanbpeterson.com/media/on-the-new-york-times-and-enforced-monogamy/

Stompythedinosaur · 01/07/2022 22:55

Getoff · 01/07/2022 22:52

Can you post a link where he says any of those things?

I quick google gave me this New York Times link giving a relevent quote.

www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2018/05/18/style/jordan-peterson-12-rules-for-life.amp.html

I'm sure there are many more sources! Just look it up!

FunDragon · 01/07/2022 22:55

Seems odd that someone who’s keen on women’s rights is so popular with the Incel movement.

Wouldloveanother · 01/07/2022 22:56

FunDragon · 01/07/2022 22:55

Seems odd that someone who’s keen on women’s rights is so popular with the Incel movement.

well some people say it’s odd that a ‘left wing’ GC movement is so popular with the American far right but we know that’s bullshit.

catpoppet · 01/07/2022 22:59

i think people are pulled in by his tone of voice and style of speaking more than what he actually says. they are hypnotised! he actually doesn't say anything particularly original or profound. just has this way of speaking that people are mesmerised by.

Stompythedinosaur · 01/07/2022 23:02

The sole thing I find interesting about Jordan Peterson, is that prior to adopting his current bigoted TV persona, he was a moderately respected psychologist who published a number of papers. None of his scientific papers indicate any of his racist or sexist beliefs. I think it is quite likely he has adopted the persona to make money out of people who hold those beliefs tbh.

MossflowerWood · 01/07/2022 23:03

I think he's brilliant.

user1471504747 · 01/07/2022 23:04

Stompythedinosaur · 01/07/2022 23:02

The sole thing I find interesting about Jordan Peterson, is that prior to adopting his current bigoted TV persona, he was a moderately respected psychologist who published a number of papers. None of his scientific papers indicate any of his racist or sexist beliefs. I think it is quite likely he has adopted the persona to make money out of people who hold those beliefs tbh.

Yes I think many have fallen into a Katie Hopkins persona to become some sort of influencer.

I think a lot of these people are to a certain extent trolling, and deliberately being extreme to rile people up and flame the culture wars.

Getoff · 01/07/2022 23:04

Stompythedinosaur · 01/07/2022 22:55

I quick google gave me this New York Times link giving a relevent quote.

www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2018/05/18/style/jordan-peterson-12-rules-for-life.amp.html

I'm sure there are many more sources! Just look it up!

That's entirely behind a paywall.

MangyInseam · 01/07/2022 23:06

As far as I can see it's because they read articles on him by other people, or small videos/quotes, and don't really engage with much of what he says.

I always find it really interesting too that some of the things people get twisted about are pretty standard things he talks about from within his discipline and not all that controversial. Although I guess that is maybe not unusual, I've known a few people to get really hung up on things that are considered standard basic uncontroversial facts in my own discipline too. There seem to be some things that the general public think are live controversies which really aren't.

Some of the articles about him, for example from the NYT have been inaccurate enough that I would say they were irresponsible journalism - I remember a few claiming he advocated forced marriages based very much on their own misunderstanding, and really they should have been withdrawn. But weren't.

If you ever hear him talking about women in the workplace etc it's pretty clear that he supports women doing pretty much whatever they want, being supported to do so, and against abuse, by the law, and advocating for themselves. He does think that women have different issues in the workplace then men, but so do a heck of a lot of women.

NoiceToight · 01/07/2022 23:08

I've seen him described as "the stupid man's smart person" and I quite agree.

Towcester · 01/07/2022 23:09

His two main points made sense to me.

Studies have shown that men have more attributes that the job market rewards like non compliance, assertiveness. E.g. more likely to ask for a pay rise/promotion.

Equality of outcomes should not be the target but equality of opportunities is absolutely desirable. E.g. we shouldn't be aiming for quotas of women in traditionally male dominated industries. The most egalitarian societies in the world in Scandinavia which gave the most opportunities for women to choose their path still showed no real increase in female engineers and women still dominated careers in nursing for example as much as any other societies.

Numbat2022 · 01/07/2022 23:09

He believes women exist for the benefit of men. He's not unusual in this - many men do, which is why they think we're here to cook/clean/parent for them. Also why we should look attractive, to beautify their world. However, most men don't base their careers on this belief.

user1471504747 · 01/07/2022 23:10

MangyInseam · 01/07/2022 23:06

As far as I can see it's because they read articles on him by other people, or small videos/quotes, and don't really engage with much of what he says.

I always find it really interesting too that some of the things people get twisted about are pretty standard things he talks about from within his discipline and not all that controversial. Although I guess that is maybe not unusual, I've known a few people to get really hung up on things that are considered standard basic uncontroversial facts in my own discipline too. There seem to be some things that the general public think are live controversies which really aren't.

Some of the articles about him, for example from the NYT have been inaccurate enough that I would say they were irresponsible journalism - I remember a few claiming he advocated forced marriages based very much on their own misunderstanding, and really they should have been withdrawn. But weren't.

If you ever hear him talking about women in the workplace etc it's pretty clear that he supports women doing pretty much whatever they want, being supported to do so, and against abuse, by the law, and advocating for themselves. He does think that women have different issues in the workplace then men, but so do a heck of a lot of women.

I’ve seen plenty of things from him. The link I posted is directly from him, not an article about him. Also plenty of other issues such as posing with a fan wearing an Islamophobic tshirt. And quotes directly from him about “racism” and how it’s supposedly not useful to look at institutional racism.

Like him if you want, but you can’t deny a lot of the criticism directed at him is actually from his own words and actions.

Stompythedinosaur · 01/07/2022 23:10

Getoff · 01/07/2022 23:04

That's entirely behind a paywall.

It works for me, and I certainly haven't paid anything.

But here's a similar article from The Guardian which also cites the quote.

www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/fashion/2018/may/23/jordan-peterson-public-intellectual-isnt-clever-violent-men-monogamy

Getoff · 01/07/2022 23:10

There's hours of video of him talking on Youtube, I think if you want to be convincing, link to something that actually shows him actually expressing and explaining the views you claim he has. Both his alleged fans and his mortal enemies tend to badly misrpresent him, and a female journalists has been known to try and force his views into a box that suits their agenda. (Watch the infamous Cathy Newman interview on Youtube, if you're not already familiar with it.)