To be so upset that the leader of the Rochdale grooming gang has been allowed to stay in the UK!

[vermicello]

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/ringleader-rochdales-infamous-sex-grooming-24336978

Those poor girls. It is like they have been abused twice, first by him and his fellow groomers and secondly by the UK justice system, police and social workers. It is sending them a big message that their right to feel safe and protected is not a concern. I can't imagine how traumatic it must be to know you could bump into your abuser at any time and nothing can be done about it. Our justice system is a disgrace.

To top it all off, he has apparently received hundreds of thousands of pounds in legal aid courtesy of taxpayers. I really don't want my taxes wasted on people like him. So upsetting and infuriating!

The person who you are quoting is replying to someone who said anyone with ancestral links should be deported. They weren't questioning the heritage of the perpetrators themselves.

And quite frankly anyone who claims someone with 'ancestral links' is less of a British citizen sounds precisely like the sort of person who would say 'one drop of black blood makes you black'

Although I am curious as to who out of my Dutch, French, Greek, Indian, Pakistani, English and Welsh heritage she would choose as my ancestral links if I committed a crime. I'm going to guess Indian/Pakistani, for some weird reason, couldn't possibly put a finger on why...

Sure, you'd lock them up in 'your' country, apparently you are quite happy for them to be set free in Pakistan though given that was actually the other option you mentioned in your original post

So it would seem that colour or ethnicity of the possible future victims very much comes into it

Threepeonies
The person who you are quoting is replying to someone who said anyone with ancestral links should be deported

I chose a succinct heading rather than replying to a specific poster.

And I was only presenting the facts rather than passing judgment on the case.

"And quite frankly anyone who claims someone with 'ancestral links' is less of a British citizen sounds precisely like the sort of person who would say 'one drop of black blood makes you black'"
We already deport some criminals. And other countries deport British criminals who commit crime abroad back to us.

If it was up to me the Rochdale gang would be in British prisons for the rest of their lives, as would all convicted paedophiles. But if they have to be released, and there is another country where it would be reasonable to deport them to, then it should be done. We have enough of our own sex criminals in this country, and opportunity to rid ourselves of some should be taken without question, and I genuinely understand why anyone would argue against this.

Yes but you aren't only talking about citizenship, which I understand even if I don't agree with. You are talking about ancestral links. So how many generations of a family have to live here before you don't think someone should be deported?

If it was up to me the Rochdale gang would be in British prisons for the rest of their lives, as would all convicted paedophiles. But if they have to be released, and there is another country where it would be reasonable to deport them to, then it should be done. We have enough of our own sex criminals in this country, and opportunity to rid ourselves of some should be taken without question, and I genuinely understand why anyone would argue against this.**

Would you be happy for criminals and pedophiles in other countries with any kind of tenuous connection through ancestry to the UK to be deported here??

"Would you be happy for criminals and pedophiles in other countries with any kind of tenuous connection through ancestry to the UK to be deported here??"
No I would not be happy but if we were also deporting criminals to their ancestral homelands it would be fair for other countries to do the same. Of course they would go straight to prison here and remain there.

"Yes but you aren't only talking about citizenship, which I understand even if I don't agree with. You are talking about ancestral links. So how many generations of a family have to live here before you don't think someone should be deported?"
No limit. If there is a possible reason to remove a paedophile from this country it should be taken. Why on earth should it not?

So if someone in Pakistan commits a crime (in Pakistan) but has dual citizenship with Britain, you think they should be sent here?

So my ancestor was william the conqueror, in your eyes its fine to deport me to France if I did something wrong?

Do you realise just how ridiculous the corner you have backed yourself into is?

What angers me most is how paltry his sentence was - 9 years, able to be out in just over half that time for being the "mastermind" of the gang. How on earth was he "only" prosecuted for "conspiracy to engage in sexual activity with a child by penetrative sex and trafficking for sexual exploitation a 15-year-old girl" given all the testomonies by the children he raped (not just conspired to abuse) and organised to be raped by others.

He should have to move areas and be closely monitored for the rest of his life. It's just chilling how the girls that were raped by and testified against these men but don;t have the means to move away have met some of these vile men on the street and in shops and get abuse from their families and friends. The sentencing should be tougher.

Also as I have asked before, how do you pick the ancestry, you only need to go back a few generations in my family to get french, dutch, greek, english, welsh, Indian and Pakistani ancestry. How do you pick which country to send me to?

Of course they would go straight to prison here and remain there

Even if they'd served their full sentence abroad?

No limit

Well that's pretty much everyone in the UK then. Pretty much all of us have foreign blood in our family tree.

If someone is a quarter French/Irish/Indian/Swedish, which country do they go to?

I'm not sure you've really thought this through @Florenz

AmaryIlis
Absolutely NO-ONE receives hundreds of thousands of pounds in legal aid

2012
Abu Qatada runs up £500,000 legal aid bill to stay in UK

www.theguardian.com/world/2012/dec/15/abu-qatada-legal-aid-bill

He was deported in 2013 -

www.gov.uk/government/speeches/home-secretary-addresses-parliament-on-abu-qatada

My abuser was white English. What do you propose is done with him?

I committed minor crimes such as shoplifting while homeless after fleeing abuse, and my mum's grandparents were immigrants, meaning the new legislation overruling the Human Rights Act means even though I was born in England to parents who were both born in England (and a dad whose family have lived in England since the middle ages) I could absolutely be deported to a country I've never been to where I don't speak a word of the language. Hell two years I was nearly arrested at the Sarah Everard vigil, now the Tories are making protest arrested, only a matter of time before you can be deported for attending a protest or a vigil.

Would you be happy to see a vulnerable teenage girl deported to a strange country for shoplifting, or attending a peaceful protest? Because that's the precedent that's being set.

The sentence is / was derisory. I really and truly cannot understand how a multiple child rapist and pimp managed to get such a short sentence. I bet if the dirty nonce had raped boys or men in such numbers, he would have been serving a MUCH longer sentence.

Bleating about 'sending them back' is rubbish. They're British, we're stuck with them. Let's look at proper sentencing for child sex offenders instead.

I'm pretty sure @Florenz would expect his family history and dna to be combed through until they could find somewhere else to send him, even if it was Viking dna.

I'm actually quite 'lucky' in that currently my Indian and Pakistani heritage isn't documented due to an illegitimate ancestor, but legislating that anyone can get deported to a country they have zero links with is pretty horrific. I'm pretty sure some of these posters are not fully 'british' themselves if you go back far enough.

So you want paedophiles anywhere but here? They can prey on victims as long as they're not doing it in your own country? At this point it's just embarrassing for you to keep talking.

The dual nationality is largely irrelevant. Deportation is largely dependent on your place of birth and in some cases your parents place of birth.
Was this offender actually born in Pakistan?
My understanding is that a person can only be deported in they were born in another country.
Immigrant with British Nationalities are often deported in they commit serious crimes.

Except the Tories wouldn't have to explain how anything happened on their watch. They would lie and point the finger elsewhere as they always do and the voters would believe them. Look at the way they are demonising human rights while at the same time they've practically made rape legal through Tory cut to policing and the justice system.

It's very naïve to think this will be used to rid the UK of paedophiles.

Around 90% of men convicted of sexual offensives against a child in this country are white.

The vast majority of men on the sex offender register are white.

There are plenty of sex traffickers and groomers who are white. There are grooming gangs made up of white guys. (In fact most grooming gangs are groups of white men!) It just doesn't get press the way Asian grooming gangs do.

How many of that 90% of white paedophiles, and how many white grooming gangs do you think are going to get deported, even if the authorities could find some trace of French or German ancestry as the grounds to deport them?

None. The authorities don't give a shit about paedophilia, it's an excuse to create a precedent with which to get rid of brown skinned people they don't want.

There are flights due to leave the UK tomorrow, deporting innocent mothers and grandmothers who have been accused of no crime, who have lived in the UK for decades - in some cases ripping mothers away from their young children. Today a man was arrested simply for standing on a pavement speaking his opinions out loud. That's who this precedent will target. People who are the wrong colour, or who have the wrong political beliefs.

Do you want to see a Britain where you can be arrested and deported for protesting for women's rights? That's the slippery slope we're on.

Bizarrely thats not true. I was recently dealing with a man who was born in London, has never even been outside the UK, and is liable to deportation because there is some doubt over his parents' immigration status when he was born.

Florenz · Today 09:36

The "Human Rights Act" can go to hell. If someone commits a serious crime like this and has citizenship or ancestral links to another country, of course we should deport them. Why should the "human rights" of a convicted rapist take precedent over the rights of girls and women not to be raped?

The sooner the HRA is abolished in this country and we start looking out for the rights of the law abiding citizen over the rights of the criminal, the better.

Totally agree.

The sooner the HRA is abolished in this country and we start looking out for the rights of the law abiding citizen over the rights of the criminal, the better.

Totally agree.

So you want the government to be able to deport women for protesting against violations of women's rights? (Could easily be considered criminals under the new bill.)

LeoOliver
Was this offender actually born in Pakistan?

Yes he was.