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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not 'get' the weight lifting craze?

166 replies

bellaiceberg · 24/06/2022 14:50

It's only my own opinion, and I accept we are all different, blah blah.
But I don't get the contemporary obsession with building muscle. Keeping toned and fit? Yes. Strong and capable? Yes, sure!
But basically eliminating natural female curves and softness to a large extent makes no sense to me. For those who are into body sculpting, that's great, but for the general population?

It kind of reminds me of Germaine Greer when she asked why is 'equality' now about imitating men, rather than men meeting us in the middle?
We women do seem to be growing more and more towards the masculine whilst pushing the naturally feminine away somewhat. Strength is something that isn't always skin deep, and our natural bodies perform just perfectly without terrifying hip thrusts and being able to lift up a small car.

Im exaggerating, but I do feel that our culture is becoming more and more weird about women's bodies. Building muscle in theory is great, and we do tend to lay more fat down, but there's a point where it all starts getting weird. Just seen images of a woman with a fabulous figure who was slightly overweight. She had soft curves and looked pretty fit. Everyone advised her to get everything built up at the gym, that her curved thighs and soft (flat) stomach were not 'healthy'.

AIBU to think it is all bollox? That it's gone from a healthy fitness thing towards a fear of the feminine? I know many women dont have curves and are still obviously feminine. I also know that what we term 'masc/fem' is pretty fluid anyway. But I am strictly focusing on weight training here, and the idea that this is the optimal way for a woman to get fit and healthy.

If I look at some instagram accounts where people are into this, I would honestly say it's more of a fashion/vanity project that health related, for both men and women. Whilst some are concentrating on having exaggerated 'booty's', others are desperate to eliminate any softness or curve. As if it is wrong to have any soft flesh at all.

I agree that muscle is as much feminine as masculine, but we still live in a society where our culture teaches boys to look down on anything traditionally associated with girls (from colours ~ pink!, emotional expression, nurturing, softness, intuition, etc). IMHO we have had to imitate men to become acceptable as opposed to men gaining more respect for US.

And yes yes i know people will pile on and say weight training saved their life/the third world/their obesity, etc. But I do think it's bonkers when a perfectly healthy woman is told any softness is unhealthy.

OP posts:
pixie5121 · 24/06/2022 22:44

For the people who do heavy lifting - how did you start? Did you just walk into the weights area and get going or did you somehow learn what to do?

The weights area in my gym is quite busy and always full of men and I think I'd find it intimidating to just walk in!

At the moment, I do my weights stuff in the general stretching area, which has mostly women in. I'm using barbells that are 6-8kg to do basic arm curls and squats and things. I've never done that Olympic lifting or dumbbells or whatever the thing is you lift over your head! How do you know where to start?

Work2live · 24/06/2022 23:13

For anyone on this thread who is struggling to really see muscle growth, it’s SO important to eat at your maintenance TDEE, or in a small calorie surplus if you want to see real progress.

I weight trained for a couple of years before I got myself an online trainer to keep me accountable and it’s been invaluable! I now eat 110-160g protein a day and my muscle gains are insane. I also use creatine.

@pixie5121 your best bet is to ask a qualified PT to show you the basics - how to perform a squat/deadlift/row/press with proper form. There are some really good video tutorials on YouTube etc too. Or do you have any friends who weight train regularly? I’d love it if one of my friends asked me to help them get into it!

pixie5121 · 24/06/2022 23:19

Work2live · 24/06/2022 23:13

For anyone on this thread who is struggling to really see muscle growth, it’s SO important to eat at your maintenance TDEE, or in a small calorie surplus if you want to see real progress.

I weight trained for a couple of years before I got myself an online trainer to keep me accountable and it’s been invaluable! I now eat 110-160g protein a day and my muscle gains are insane. I also use creatine.

@pixie5121 your best bet is to ask a qualified PT to show you the basics - how to perform a squat/deadlift/row/press with proper form. There are some really good video tutorials on YouTube etc too. Or do you have any friends who weight train regularly? I’d love it if one of my friends asked me to help them get into it!

Thank you!

I do have friends who are into it but am afraid of imposing or making them feel like they have to help...I'm not good at asking for help!

It might be well worth paying for an hour of PT for them to show me this stuff.

Deux · 24/06/2022 23:20

@pixie5121 hi! I started exactly where you are now. I had an induction session with a female PT at the gym as part of the membership and she put together a program for me. It was pretty basic but it got me on to the main floor (though I had used the machines before).

Then I started reading up, just via google, and listening to some podcasts - I really like and rate Emma Storey-Gordon (esgfitness). She’s properly qualified, well educated and from a science background and she backs up what she says with evidence. That gave me a lot more knowledge.

then I started looking at the PTs in the gym - how they were with members, general demeanour etc, what they did when they worked out, chose the one I thought would be the best fit and booked some sessions. I was really clear with him what I wanted to achieve and he basically walked me through all the kit and I could practice good form with him. I right out said I wanted to be able to deadlift, bench press and squat. Good form is important to avoid injuries. He was excellent. That gave me a good grounding and off I went, progressively increasing the weight I used. I also avoided peak times. And now 8 months later I’m in a dedicated strength training gym.

You can find basic programmes to follow online. It doesn’t have to be fancy. Push/pull/legs or upper/lower/full body programmes will work all your muscle groups. If there’s a TRX/suspension straps at your gym they’re massively underrated and generally underused but fabulous for building strength.

get some PT sessions if you can as it’ll really help your confidence and get over the intimidation factor.

brokengoalposts · 24/06/2022 23:28

I love weight lifting and the gym, it's my happy place. I'm far from a youthful gym bunny, I was a professional athlete in my teens and twenties, the muscle was a biproduct of my sport training. I then had babies and my whole focus was then, I put in weight and lost a lot of my fitness. I restarted at the gym and do it all for pleasure now and because I want to be fit in my later years. I feel much better in myself, the way it looks is definitely one of the benefits, but not the only one, to think I only do it to rid myself of curves is so far from the truth.

Deux · 24/06/2022 23:28

As per a PP, fuel your muscles by eating plenty protein. I aim for 100-120g a day, I do eat in a small deficit though as I’m looking to shift some fat slowly, I take creatine every day.

And I’d absolutely love it if a friend said they wanted to start strength training. I’d be thrilled.

pixie5121 · 24/06/2022 23:40

Deux · 24/06/2022 23:20

@pixie5121 hi! I started exactly where you are now. I had an induction session with a female PT at the gym as part of the membership and she put together a program for me. It was pretty basic but it got me on to the main floor (though I had used the machines before).

Then I started reading up, just via google, and listening to some podcasts - I really like and rate Emma Storey-Gordon (esgfitness). She’s properly qualified, well educated and from a science background and she backs up what she says with evidence. That gave me a lot more knowledge.

then I started looking at the PTs in the gym - how they were with members, general demeanour etc, what they did when they worked out, chose the one I thought would be the best fit and booked some sessions. I was really clear with him what I wanted to achieve and he basically walked me through all the kit and I could practice good form with him. I right out said I wanted to be able to deadlift, bench press and squat. Good form is important to avoid injuries. He was excellent. That gave me a good grounding and off I went, progressively increasing the weight I used. I also avoided peak times. And now 8 months later I’m in a dedicated strength training gym.

You can find basic programmes to follow online. It doesn’t have to be fancy. Push/pull/legs or upper/lower/full body programmes will work all your muscle groups. If there’s a TRX/suspension straps at your gym they’re massively underrated and generally underused but fabulous for building strength.

get some PT sessions if you can as it’ll really help your confidence and get over the intimidation factor.

Thank you! I'm definitely going to try a PT to get started.

Yes, my gym has a TRX...the gym is pretty well kitted out for all kinds of weight training...I'm just intimidated so stick to the little barbells and bodyweight exercises, lol.

GoodThinkingMax · 25/06/2022 09:20

For the people who do heavy lifting - how did you start? Did you just walk into the weights area and get going or did you somehow learn what to do?

I changed gyms from a private small gym (which was lovely but the owner died, sadly) to a big chain gym (FF) which is not the swanky David Lloyd type, but not the bargain basement PureGym-type. Part of the joining deal at the time was a couple of free sessions with a PT. He told me straight "You can't out train a bad diet" and I said I wanted to learn weightlifting , as anyone can sort out cardio for themselves (you know, just do C25K, and intervals etc).

I thought he'd give me a programme on all the machines, but his approach is to mix it up so each session we do strength work for 30 minutes (deadlifts, or squats, or the sled), then usually some form of functional training, and usually in the form of metcon (fancy shorthand for "metabolic conditioning").

We clicked - he's a brilliant coach in all sorts of ways, and a genuinely nice kind man. My PT hours are also a kind of talking therapy - when I have the breath to do so, which is usually only the first 15 minutes! Completely respectful, and I'd trust him with my life. His approach has changed my life really.

And I"m very strong& fit - and in my early 60s, that's important!

LongLiveThyKing · 25/06/2022 09:51

I started lifting and gaining muscle when it was first popular at the start of the “strong not skinny” movement four/three years ago whilst recovering from anorexia. I loved how I looked: abs, muscular thighs, arms, toner booty etc and I was dating fitness model men and strong men as they appreciated the effort my body took. I then met my current DP who disliked muscular woman and asked me to stop training. I am glad he did as I look back at those pictures of me now and think I looked too manly and just generally not as attractive as now. However, I do miss feeling powerful and being able to run miles and miles without feeling it.

Scianel · 25/06/2022 09:56

LongLiveThyKing your post has made me sad. You loved how you looked for a reason - you were strong and fit and healthy. You were protecting yourself against ageing after what your body had been through due to anorexia.
I think it's awful that your DP actually asked you to stop being healthy and looking after yourself. I'm not surprised you miss feeling powerful and fit.

gamerchick · 25/06/2022 09:59

LongLiveThyKing · 25/06/2022 09:51

I started lifting and gaining muscle when it was first popular at the start of the “strong not skinny” movement four/three years ago whilst recovering from anorexia. I loved how I looked: abs, muscular thighs, arms, toner booty etc and I was dating fitness model men and strong men as they appreciated the effort my body took. I then met my current DP who disliked muscular woman and asked me to stop training. I am glad he did as I look back at those pictures of me now and think I looked too manly and just generally not as attractive as now. However, I do miss feeling powerful and being able to run miles and miles without feeling it.

Done a right number on you hasnt he?

NeverDropYourMooncup · 25/06/2022 10:23

The only reason it's not realised just how strong women were in the past is because a) nobody other than the odd (in all senses of the word) middle or upper class man was particularly interested in recording what women did or looked like if it wasn't on their backs and b) clothing covered the body, including the upper arms so nobody really saw muscle development when photography became the new hobby.

Think about it - a galvanised 5 gallon bucket weighs about 20kg. A milk churn would often be 11 gallons, so around 54kg. Then the work of scrubbing dairy floors, moving cows, looking after livestock, shifting whole cheeses, etc, etc. A milkmaid wasn't just fetishised because she was clean, well nourished, unlikely to get smallpox or was very skilled in particular hand movements - she would also have been muscular, strong and healthy.

Pit brow women were absolutely stacked (they were banned from working underground in Victorian times because the idea of not wearing a lot of clothes and trousers in particular, really upset the upper classes). They were still employed until the early 1970s.

Women would climb and abseil cliffs with just a rope and baskets to collect gulls' eggs or reach shellfish - the strength needed for that is phenomenal.

Even those who didn't do an exceptionally physical job would be carrying coal scuttles, fetching water from wells and pumps, sweeping, mopping, scrubbing, handwashing, beating carpets, preparing food, carrying shopping, lifting children, caring for animals, walking miles - if they were fortunate enough to have access to reasonable nutrition, they would have built muscle on backs, arms, shoulders, hips, thighs, calves, everywhere. And don't forget riding - it takes real core and leg strength to be able to ride, whether sidesaddle or astride (which was normal, there is thousands of years of clothing designed for women that showed they rode normally before the invention of the double pommel saddle.

It's very possible that the narrow waists on clothes from earlier times wasn't solely because women were 'thin' and wore corsets - it was because they had very strong core muscles/could even have been to emulate the body proportions of those women who worked. As, after all, the clothes that have been preserved will be the ones of wealthy women, not working ones.

The Reubenesque 'soft' women were different because they showed wealth (as in more than adequate food and no exposure to sunlight). But if you actually look at the paintings, such as in The Judgement of Paris, there are depictions of defined musculature in their backs, arms, shoulders, thighs, calves and backsides. And, of course, they were of actual women, rather than of male models with breasts painted on. If you look at Raphael's study for the Alba Madonna, the woman has defined shoulders and amazing thigh musculature.

In short, if you actually look at art beyond the portraits of fancy dresses and think about what life would have actually been like, women have always been both feminine and strong/muscled in a way the less well-informed are unaware of.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 25/06/2022 10:28

LongLiveThyKing · 25/06/2022 09:51

I started lifting and gaining muscle when it was first popular at the start of the “strong not skinny” movement four/three years ago whilst recovering from anorexia. I loved how I looked: abs, muscular thighs, arms, toner booty etc and I was dating fitness model men and strong men as they appreciated the effort my body took. I then met my current DP who disliked muscular woman and asked me to stop training. I am glad he did as I look back at those pictures of me now and think I looked too manly and just generally not as attractive as now. However, I do miss feeling powerful and being able to run miles and miles without feeling it.

I'm so sorry.

I hope sometime in the future that you can realise just how awful this man is and you are able to run miles and miles away from him.

Kfjsjdbd · 25/06/2022 10:33

I was a competitive cross fitter pre kids, training 5 - 6 days a week, lots and lots of very heavy weights. I never looked ‘not feminine’. You need to stick to an extremely strict diet and be blessed genetically for that to happen.

I find your OP massively misinformed and disappointing. We should absolutely be focussing on weights. My 70 year old aunt can’t lift herself out of the bath because she lacks the muscle strength. This is what we should be lifting weights to prevent .

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 25/06/2022 10:33

LongLiveThyKing · 25/06/2022 09:51

I started lifting and gaining muscle when it was first popular at the start of the “strong not skinny” movement four/three years ago whilst recovering from anorexia. I loved how I looked: abs, muscular thighs, arms, toner booty etc and I was dating fitness model men and strong men as they appreciated the effort my body took. I then met my current DP who disliked muscular woman and asked me to stop training. I am glad he did as I look back at those pictures of me now and think I looked too manly and just generally not as attractive as now. However, I do miss feeling powerful and being able to run miles and miles without feeling it.

Fucking hell
this is tragic

willithappen · 25/06/2022 10:37

YABVU - women don't get 'big' from lifting weights.

SwanAnn · 25/06/2022 10:47

I agree it is tragic @CloseYourEyesAndSee

I do lots of sport and exercise, running, yoga, ballet, etc, but weights have made the biggest difference for me and helped in those areas. Even my stamina.

After 40, I believe, it's supposed to be especially beneficial to lift weights of some description. Someone with more knowledge will be able to explain why, but something partly to do with muscle loss.

I'm slim but have defined arm and shoulder muscles, which I'm rather pleased about. I think proper weightlifters might scoff that my dumbbells are only 2kg each and my kettlebell doesn't weigh much more combined, but I plan to improve, expand and increase as I'm still relatively new to weights.

SwanAnn · 25/06/2022 10:48

And lots of male and female ballet dancers lift weights. There are variety of weights and weight machines in the gyms at ballet schools.

Wanderingowl · 25/06/2022 11:00

Over 50% of women of European and Asian descent will develop osteopenia post menopause. Over 50%! Ie, most of us. Of those 40% (more than 1 in 5 of all ethnic European and Asian women) will go on to develop full osteoporosis. Do you really think that the majority of us are meant to spend the latter half of our lives with our bones not fully able to support out bodies? I don't. We are meant to be stronger than we (collectively) currently are. We are meant to have our bodies' natural muscularity. We actually need to have it in order to make the latter half of our lives healthy.

But misogyny and classism lead to 'femininity' being defined by our softness. Only peasant women had muscles, proper ladies were soft and delicate. We aren't male, we're not meant to look like men but strong healthy muscles aren't exclusively male. The idea that they are male is false. Women are meant to have strong healthy muscles too. They don't take away our natural curves, in fact the body type that builds muscle most easily is mesomorphic, which in women is a natural hourglass.

Some online fitness influencers have clearly cut their body fat lower than is healthy for a woman. I suspect that many of those women cut heavily in the days before filming, film a months worth of content and then go back to better eating patterns and look much less defined in their normal lives. I don't think this is a particularly healthy way to live as I suspect the cutting is too extreme. But I do know that allowing ourselves to feel hunger while keeping out bodies as strong as we can, by exercising for both functional strength and hypertrophy. And having a strong focus on our cardiovascular systems, especially for endurance, is the absolute number one way to reduce our mitochondrial age. Allowing us the most potential for long, healthy lives.

AquaticSewingMachine · 25/06/2022 11:01

I am also really disturbed by @LongLiveThyKing 's "D"P, and giving him some serious fucking side-eye.

You don't ask someone to change their body for you. You just don't. And you really really don't ask someone to stop doing something they enjoy and is beneficial for their health to make them look more to your taste.

Fadeout83 · 25/06/2022 11:04

LongLiveThyKing · 25/06/2022 09:51

I started lifting and gaining muscle when it was first popular at the start of the “strong not skinny” movement four/three years ago whilst recovering from anorexia. I loved how I looked: abs, muscular thighs, arms, toner booty etc and I was dating fitness model men and strong men as they appreciated the effort my body took. I then met my current DP who disliked muscular woman and asked me to stop training. I am glad he did as I look back at those pictures of me now and think I looked too manly and just generally not as attractive as now. However, I do miss feeling powerful and being able to run miles and miles without feeling it.

You miss being healthy and strong. This doesn’t surprise me. I hope you realise that this man is toxic to your life and find the strength to leave and be your best self for yourself.

SwanAnn · 25/06/2022 11:08

Excellent points @Wanderingowl

AquaticSewingMachine · 25/06/2022 11:12

Absolutely @Wanderingowl . I sometimes think the future depicted in Wall-E, where humans have completely lost the ability and muscle tone to mobilise their own bodies, isn't that far-fetched. Such a bizarre priding of "softness" and perception that the second a woman picks up a 3kg dumbbell, she'll become "bulky" and "mannish".

BordoisAgain · 25/06/2022 11:22

I think a lot of women are seeing what being "soft and feminine" actually does to the female body as you get into old age and don't want to end up with osteoporosis, kyphosis, etc.

waterlego · 25/06/2022 12:07

@NeverDropYourMooncup, your post was fascinating; thank you for taking the time to write it. My history knowledge is poor, so a lot of that was stuff I didn’t know or hadn’t really thought about.

@AquaticSewingMachine
I sometimes think the future depicted in Wall-E, where humans have completely lost the ability and muscle tone to mobilise their own bodies, isn't that far-fetched.

Completely agree, and although I think Wall-E is a great film, it has always disturbed me because I totally see it as prophetic!

Like some of the PPs, I’m a woman who doesn’t have much in the way of natural curves. Small bust, small hips, wide waist, so I just look rectangular 😂 I think I now have a nicer shape thanks to lifting weights. I carry most of my fat round my middle and weight training actually gives me a waist because I’ve built muscle around my hips and bum.

Plus, as so many others have said, it’s essential for our health. My paternal grandma, and 90% of my aunties (of which there were seven) all had osteoporosis so badly, they had quite extreme curvature of the spine by the age of 70 or so and needed walking aids. I hope to mitigate against the worst of any genetic tendency I might have to that same fate.

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