"Pick-Up Artists" in the street - AIBU?

[nadan]

Has anyone ever been targeted by one of these so-called "PUA" because I think I might have been today. This was in High St, Kensington, but also a similar thing happened here a few months ago and possibly also in Hammersmith. Bearing in mind I am 47! They come up and ask if you live locally, so you expect they're going to ask directions or something. But then they start walking with you and it's hard to explain why, but it's hard to get away from them. A 'technique' seems to be to try to find something in common - "like, oh I've just moved to this area too." Then it's waffle to try and strike a rapport.

I just said "sorry I'm late for work' (god knows why I said this because I don't even work). Then they ask what you do... then they do something similar. .. then it's "shall we go for lunch, have you got time?" I just looked at the guy and said "I am 47 years old." I swear to god he was not a day over 35, possibly younger. But he didn't seem at all phased.

AIBU to think this was a PUA and he was 'training?' And maybe someone was filming him? The other alternative was that he was trying to find a desperate local woman who would be delighted to take him home and then he could rob her? There are so many crazy people on the streets and it's getting worse. Anyone else been mystified by this?

Charity chugger trying to build rapport before getting you to sign up? Distracting you before his partner dips into your bag?

I find a polite “can you please go away” usually works especially if delivered early. I usually say it in the first 5 seconds 😂😂

I feel like there was a thread while back with something similar OP so I dont think you are the only one, let me see if I can find it

It does sound familiar. I'm not far from you, OP, and I've got to the stage where I automatically say no, or just shake my ahead and don't let them get past the initial "excuse me".

My DD recently told me she's had a bit of this in her city too (not here; European city) but having just escaped an abusive relationship she's in no mind to take any crap.
She says straight away and very clearly that she's not interested, and if that doesn't work it's a very loud "Fuck off and leave me alone!" which usually does the trick!

I don't know, but many years ago I discovered a lovely cafe in Tel Aviv trying to get away from a man. Its not a new thing.

I had an encouter in the woods a few weeks ago. Not sure if, PUA, but the guy thoroughly creeped me out. Even more so as you only see other people every few minutes or so. Still, I was determined to shut that shit down. He had also started to follow me and addressed me and I thought he was going to ask for directions as well.

As soon as he started commenting on my looks, I told him "FUCK NO!" in the rudest possible manner. I seriously hope he will leave women alone from now on. I mean seriously, who does that?

It definitely wasn't a charity worker and obviously everyone has a tactic to get away from them if you don't want to get stopped. Nor was it a man who you get a certain vibe straight off that they were trying to chat you up. For a start he wax about 15 years younger. What possibly reason would U want to go to lunch with a random, let alone one that age? It's a definite 'thing' but I'm not sure what it is - are they trying to rob you; find out where you live; or are they trying to pass some sort of PUA test and there is someone observing or filming to see how far they get after the training?

Oh I hate that annoying walking beside you thing that they do! It feels so invasive.

I live near a uni and I've had a few random men approach me asking if I go to the uni. When I say "no", they still try to engage in conversation, asking me what I do instead etc.

I've always assumed PUA training too. I just get that vibe from them.

I heard there are courses that men sign up to about how to manipulate women into dates / sex and they pay a lot of money for these 'courses.' Then they go out in busy high streets and try out the tactics. They get feedback and then it goes on. This is why they're not fussy about age.

I live fairly near the High St and have had this, I’m in my 50s! I think they are those guys on the sleazy pick up course. I normally clamp a headset on and ignore everyone anyway.

Ugh, DD2 was followed off a train bus some creep the other day, who was pestering her and wouldn’t leave her alone. It’s more straightforward to be rude from the off.

I remember a spate of these in west London a few years back. They weren't PUAs but it was a scam - they would be distracting women while someone else picks their pockets/bags/ or tries to get their car keys. It's an old trick.

A guy in Scotland went to jail for this, but was released on appeal.

www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/scots-pick-up-artist-addy-22706330

I'm sure there was even a thread about some twat who was demonstrating how to get a woman to remove her headphones so he could talk at her.

If it was a man in his 40s / 50s, I would just think it was a normal chat up and think nothing of it. But I think this is something different, as I say. What annoys me is that these courses just teach them "women think this" or "if you say this she will be thinking that..." I think it plays on the fact most women don't want to be out and out rude and it's a different kind if approach. They catch you off guard because you're expecting them to ask for money or directions. It's hard to explain but it's odd and it's just annoyed me.

It could be a PUA bootcamp / masterclass where guys pay to learn from some guy who claims to be a master at picking up women. The goal is to cold approach multiple women and attempt to establish rapport and get her to agree to a date or give her number etc. Its very much a numbers game for them and its all about overcoming inhibition to speaking to women or the rules of society that say you shouldn't harrase women in public. They often advocate travelling abroad to places like eastern europe of south america as the women are less hostile to being approached (sexually harrased) there apparently.

I was harrased by this guy, Troy Francis a couple of years ago, when I was living abroad. I was 42 at the time and my reaction was, what the hell is this sad old fuck up to? He has all the charisma of a wet, dirty dish cloth. I did a bit of research on him and discovered that he's a failed writer (Troy Francis isn't his real name) who now makes a living scamming gulible men out of their money and into believing he can teach men how to be successful with women. As far as I can tell his only success with women is via expensive ticketed orgies which are staffed with sex workers who are paid to be there and engage the paying customers. He's also misogynist who hates women and most of all himself.

I really think women should be taught about this sort of fuckery and how to be alert to it, the only good thing is that I don't think it actually works and most PUA's are more likely to be regular sex work users.

Not that I condone using sex workers, I don't.

I've had one of these, although I'm not sure he was a PUA - he seemed too confident and learner-PUAs are usually fundamentally socially inadequate. I think he just thought he was charming and he really was not.

I brushed off his endless fucking questions with vague answers while walking quite firmly away. He gave up quite quickly.

It's PUA training, you can find it on YouTube. It's hilarious when they all use the same lines and moves. I've even noticed 'celebrities' do it. No, mate! Be straightforward and honest. I don't want to be tricked into bed.

PUA training or conman, I'd guess. I had a young man come up to me in the street the other day and offer me "professional massage services" and try to give me a card which looked like he'd printed it on one of the machines you used to get in stations featuring him with no top on. What is the world coming to? [grasps pearls]

I had a very weird one once where a guy started trying to chat to me at an ice cream van - I had two small kids with me and was very stand-offish, but he still worked up to closing on "you're very attractive, can I have your number?" I was a bit flustered (fifty percent on my guard and the other fifty trying to prevent the kids dropping their ice creams!) The bit that made me think PUA was that I then saw him go and have a very earnest chat with a guy sitting on a picnic blanket - lots of the other guy talking while the first one nodded. If I hadn't had the kids with me I might have gone up and said something....but circumstances didn't really allow it. It did make me angry though!

Thing is I'm very wary of telling men on the street to fuck off when I get unwanted attention. Things can quickly go wrong. IIRC a woman nearly ended up on train tracks because she'd rebuffed a man's advances. I really hate than women just can't be left alone. Even men staring does my head in.

@Stroopwaffels I remember this case, that guy was so grim and again most of his "lays" as he liked to call them were as a result of paying for sex or taking advantage of drunk women. He was a sex pest and should have went to jail.

I worked with a guy years ago who lived near the centre of town. On Friday and Saturday nights he's sit in himself until 2am then he'd wonder the streets of town looking to pick up drunk women outside clubs, hopefully alone and try and get them to come back to his flat with him, he used to boast about this approach as it was saving him money on drinks and entry fees not understanding that he was basically hoping to rape women. The only saving grace is that he was apparently never successful in picking up anyone.

Another guy I was at university with also did this he'd drive around after the clubs emptied and would try to find women seperated from their friends in the hope they would be willing to sleep with him, after he offered to assist them, drive them home but they never were. Unfortunately he got fed up waiting for a willing woman and he did end up raping a girl. He went to prison for it.

And these sort of guys moan and complain that women are hostile to being cold approached in the street, maybe if men were not so dangerous or have a rapist mentality they wouldn't have to be but as things stand its basic safety.

I tend to move off as quickly as possible

also good to say, in your best RP "I'm sorry, I don't speak any English whatsoever".

I know it's dangerous, but many of these guys are looking for easy victims. To give them hell will let them know that you aren't going to make it easy should they try something. These men are cowards and are more likely to take out their anger on women if they think there is low risk of them fighting back.

Furthermore, by engaging your anger you are already in fight mode in case he gets aggressive.

If you look at many of the videos of women getting push under trains, they push these women most of the time when their backs are turned towards their attackers.

It sounds exactly like a PUA-in-training - it's a homework assignment for a lot of the online PUA courses to practice hassling women, trying to "get to yes". And the script is laughably textbook. He may have been targeting women in different demographics per his assignment, or he may have considered you likely to give him the time of day for some reason, or maybe you were the most approachable-seeming lone women about (not rushing, not wearing headphones/sunglasses, etc.) They're counting on your niceness and your uncertainty: he MIGHT have some legit reason you just can't see, so it would be rude to say "go away and leave me alone". If you DO say "go away and leave me alone", he'll try to guilt trip you about are you always so rude and unfriendly and so on. Just shut it down; your time is valuable even if you're "only" using it to go for a walk unmolested. If "go away, leave me alone" or "not interested" is too much, then "goodbye, sir", putting your headphones in, or making a call on your mobile all work. Sometimes.

These creeps are a scourge (as of course are the people who run the courses, who probably never act so stupidly themselves). If you can do so safely it's best to be direct with them and tell them that they're hassling you and it's unwelcome. Fobbing them off with "I'm married" or "I'm twice your age" or "I'm meeting a friend and must rush" just encourages them as they're supposed to be practicing getting around women's objections. And at the very least they can go away saying they failed because you're married/monogamous or late for work or whatever and try again with someone else, rather than having to acknowledge that they're misogynist creeps and that women are not some resource laid on by the local authorities like free wifi or water fountains, to help out lazy sub-par men.