"Pick-Up Artists" in the street - AIBU?

[nadan]

Has anyone ever been targeted by one of these so-called "PUA" because I think I might have been today. This was in High St, Kensington, but also a similar thing happened here a few months ago and possibly also in Hammersmith. Bearing in mind I am 47! They come up and ask if you live locally, so you expect they're going to ask directions or something. But then they start walking with you and it's hard to explain why, but it's hard to get away from them. A 'technique' seems to be to try to find something in common - "like, oh I've just moved to this area too." Then it's waffle to try and strike a rapport.

I just said "sorry I'm late for work' (god knows why I said this because I don't even work). Then they ask what you do... then they do something similar. .. then it's "shall we go for lunch, have you got time?" I just looked at the guy and said "I am 47 years old." I swear to god he was not a day over 35, possibly younger. But he didn't seem at all phased.

AIBU to think this was a PUA and he was 'training?' And maybe someone was filming him? The other alternative was that he was trying to find a desperate local woman who would be delighted to take him home and then he could rob her? There are so many crazy people on the streets and it's getting worse. Anyone else been mystified by this?

It’s strange as years ago I was at the swimming baths waiting for DD to get changed. A younger and very attractive young man started chatting to me in his bathing suit. He seemed nervous but I was completely bemused why he would want to talk to a middle aged unattractive woman. I half wondered if he was lonely. I’ve always wondered about it.

If a man asks me the way to the railway station I'll stop walking and tell him in as few words as possible what he wants to know.

Try falling into step beside me and I'll tell them to go away. Ask me whether I'm local, or where I work, and I'll say 'I'm not interested in conversation' and move on. A forceful 'go away' will accompany any attempt to follow me.

The fucking entitlement of these men, thinking we are under obligation to part with personal information just because they choose to ask for it. What are they going to do with it, for one thing?

We are far too socialised to be nice and polite. I simply don't want to do that anymore. I want to go about my own business in peace, expecting nothing and bothering no one.

Why won't these fuckers just leave women alone?

😂 perfect response, what the hell are these guys thinking? The sense of entitlement to your time is mind blowing

@Borisblondboufant I guess you never know for sure and I suppose sometimes it might just be someone who is lonely and they are reaching out for a bit of kindness but then the harrasers and the pua's exploit that doubt and kindness so we do end up putting up a wall to protect ourselves. When I was younger I was open and kind, always thinking the best of people but when that openess is repeatedly taken advantage of you need to learn to toughen up, and put your defenses up. It upsets certain men but what choice do we have when being kind or friendly is so often taken as a green light for access to your body.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks "Why won't these fuckers just leave women alone?"

Why can't you understand these men are obviously entitled to your time and attention? Why are women such bitches, they are only trying to be nice to you and to have sex with you???

The above is literally what they think🙄

Getting chatted up by randoms is par for the course in London.

I think they’re more likely to be pickpockets in this case - they want your phone.

Iris It's a different vibe to getting chatted up by randoms though. I've had various blokes try and start conversations with me and just brushed them off - the incident I described in my previous post felt very different. He didn't have that bluff over-cheerfulness where they're all woah-woah-woah at the first sign of hostility. He was a bit awkward but oddly persistent. His manner and his behaviour didn't quite match, if that makes sense. Definitely a trainee!

Maybe the line to use is ‘Are you one of those PUA trainees I read about on Mumsnet?’

I've had this a few times - I just say "I'm in a rush and don't have time to talk to you".

If that doesn't work I just say "Fuck off immediately" and then repeat it as required at increasing volume. Does the trick.

It's vile, though, really not acceptable to ignore a woman saying no/go away.

If men want to reach out for a bit of kindness from a stranger, they need to reach out to other men.

I think when you aren’t attractive men speaking to you randomly is a very strange thing.

Yes, definitely a thing. As you suspected, OP, almost certainly a PUA ‘in training’ - he’s likely to have been being observed (possibly even listened to) by the twat running it and any other participants.

Had this on Charing Cross Road a few years back. The guy was offering up excessive compliments (“I crossed the road just to tell you how beautiful you are”, etc), walking beside me for quite a distance, even managed to touch me (picked up my hand and asked if my wedding ring meant I was married).

It was creepy AF and very disconcerting, although I didn’t realise what exactly was going on until afterwards, when I saw an article in the Sunday Times about it. The more women who learn to recognise this manipulative, predatory, incel BS the better - we should definitely be calling it out.

Christ, when will it ever end?

DD lives in a big city and frequently gets called after in the street (girl you are peng!) or winked at. It doesn't bother her that much as it's fit, cheeky, young men having a laugh. However she recently got hassled in our local small town by a really creepy guy who wanted to strike up a conversation with her and wouldn't go away.
In the end she started to yell "can I have some help please, this man is hassling me" and about a dozen passers by stopped to help.

Dd got this in the European city she’s been living in. Found a little park she’d not been too, sat having a coffee and a read. This guy cycled up and gave this line about how he’d just moved there, he didn’t speak the language (she was reading an English book) in his culture sharing food was a way of making friends, would she come for lunch. She got rid, but then noticed him calling someone, he was not far away, and heard him say “no, she wouldn’t.... I could I guess, I can still see her” she got in her bike and cycled home like the clappers.she was pissed off she wouldn’t go back to that park.

It happens to me a lot. I pretend I don't speak English. It usually works

They often advocate travelling abroad to places like eastern europe of south america as the women are less hostile to being approached (sexually harrased) there apparently.

This thread took me back to living in Brazil when I was younger. Very, very normal there for men to walk with you, follow you, ask hotel receptionists for your room number or your neighbours to let them into your apartment building. They haven’t been on courses, it’s just a totally shit part of the culture. So it’s lovely to hear that these losers are taking advantage of the crap women in these parts of the world already face.

PUAs aren’t really a thing outside MN though, it’s very dated. There are men. There are weird men. There are men who try to pick you up weirdly. Some may have swallowed PUA stuff. The influence on the weird ones is now more porn, Reddit, incel, MGTOW, Jordan Peterson etc.

Unfortunately PUA's are on the rise again. They have a lower profile now, as many of them know they are not welcome in many venues. At least they are less brazen and many people now know they exist.

Men try to pick up women, always will, always have. Some clumsily weirdly obsessively. Whether or not one particular bloke read a particular book/influenced by a particular fad is really neither here nor there.

The real question is why MNers insist on such labels - PUA, Wendy, narc etc.

Pick Up Artist? Ugh, horrible terminology, call it what it is; sexual harassment, sex pest, misogynist etc. Let's not use the language of abusers.

Sorry to hear OP and sorry that women have to be forever on guard for creeps.

I once had a couple of Mormon missionaries try PUA techniques on me, in central Edinburgh. 'So what's your favourite sight?' etc. Somehow you can just tell they're following a script.

Luckily my grandfather (parish priest by profession) had a copy of the book of Mormon that I'd read (tried to read- boooring) as a kid, so I could inform them that I knew what they were about and definitely not interested.

I think you're right OP, PUA out on training mission.

PUAs aren’t really a thing outside MN though

You might want to tell that to the men who are writing the books, and selling the classes!

Type "pick up artists book" into Google, and also notice the number of forum links to sites like reddit with PUA forums, etc etc. "15 Best PUA Books for Men Ever Written" shows just a few of the offerings.

<misses the point>

Oh, what is the point, wise one?!

Iris it started forever ago but it's still very much a thing.