To think that the NHS had lost the plot over breastfeeding?

[WandaWomblesaurus]

www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-10892531/NHS-accused-putting-babies-harm-advice-trans-women-wanting-breastfeed.html

It feels like some kind of bizarre experiment - except it's babies who are being used for affirmation.

Am I being gaslit here?

Excuse me, but you really have no idea about how long I’ve been aware of this issue and speaking out against it.

What I am saying it's a term that is mainstream

'Cis' is absolutely not mainstream, its niche jargon. Come and chat to the working class women in my neck of the woods, they'll have no idea what you are talking about.

At the end of the day it is a parent who is giving their newborn baby something (that is not known what effects it will have on the child) for their own validation. Women are given a big list of things they shouldn’t eat, drugs they shouldn’t take and things they shouldn’t do whilst pregnant, but all of that care for the baby’s well being goes out of the window here.

And I’m not taking about actual mothers who have given birth and need help with their flow. I am talking about natal born men who, since time began, have not biologically evolved to feed babies.

Or mine, where white British middle class people, for whom English is their first language, are not the majority.

Sorry, here is a click link

www.them.us/story/trans-women-breastfeed/amp

This is an article written by a known transitional male and is a collection of three accounts of males who have done this and why.

It is well worth reading unless you are determined to attribute only child centred intentions to males desire to breastfeed an infant. If you are determined to think that, then expect push back from others who have seen other accounts that match this.

The NHS is always saying it doesn’t have enough money yet it seems hell bent on wasting the money it has.

It can’t keep crying poverty when it does this.

So far I have been refused HRT, sleeping pills for chronic insomnia, I live from month to month wondering if I am able to get my ADHD meds. Had to take a week off work recently because they said I wasn’t on the meds I was on and so they weren’t prescribed. I am self employed and if I don’t work I don’t get paid.
I am diagnosed with arthritis, no prescription forthcoming for me. I was told it was part of ageing and almost inferred to suck it up.

If that is the case then shouldn’t the response to a male wanting to breastfeed be suck it up, get over yourself.
No meds for you.

I wonder sometimes how many transgender women there would be if they were treated exactly the same as a woman
and weren’t able to use their size, strength and voice to call discrimination at every turn when they don’t get their own way

The concerns about HRT

Let’s be clear here. Men using medical interventions to try to present as women/ as feminine are NOT taking HRT. They are NOT replacing naturally occurring hormones as women are.

They are taking huge doses of artificial cross-sex medications.

The nhs needs to get its act together over supporting women breastfeeding their newborns, as per the medical and anthropological evidence base before they prioritise male un biological, whimsical, self centred, un evidence based desires to waste nhs resources (time and money) that could probably meet the needs of many more women and newborns than that individual male.

That's horrific @Kennykenkencat, how old are you? If over 45 you should gain access without any hoops.

You can call yourself cis or Ming the Merciless if you like.

Don't call us cis. We reject the magical thinking on which the term is based: that the nature of being female can be identified into. By forcing us to accept the term, you force us to believe that woman is not a sexed state of being, with various lifelong implications that we can't escape, but a shared "feeling". And one that can be felt by a male who recognises it as female. And is not felt by transmen or non binary females. In other words, absurdity. And not at all the same thing as a personal feeling of disconnection with the natal sex of one's own body, and a desire to exist as the opposite one.

I saw you upthread rejecting the word "woman" because you don't like the associations. That's ridiculous. It means "adult human female" - that's it. It recognises the sex of your body and all the things that entails that you can't change. It doesn't say anything about how you must identify, to whom you must be attracted, how you dress, the colour of your skin or anything else.

It's liberating. It recognises the protections you can't help needing and it doesnt suggest anything about what you must wear or do to "look" or "act" like a woman. It literally is about being, not any stereotypes.

What's not liberating is obfuscating this fact so that womanhood becomes a costume or a feeling in a male person's head.

If we accept that male people can not produce enough “milk”, of a quality high enough to sustain a baby as a mother’s breast milk would, which is what the research shows, then why would any decent man or transwoman choose to induce “lactation”, especially when the effects on the baby are also unknown?

Think about it. How can anyone doing this want the best for their baby? The best is the mother’s milk or formula, both freely available.

It is well documented that there are transwomen out there who do get off on “chest feeding” babies. So what if they don’t all? If making this possible allows even one transwoman to become aroused by letting a baby suck their nipple, then it’s one too many for me. It needs to not be a thing.

Type into Google 'psychopathy traits in children'. Your Op lists a lot of the behaviours

Yes and let's be also clear that they are damaging their own bodies in doing so. This is definitely a trans rights issue - they don't get told the truth about impact.

The medical information coming from males who have been on hormones from a young age and longer than 10 years is very concerning, as with females who've taken cross sex hormones.

The nhs is going to be helping a large number of males and females who've done this on the nhs with incontinence, osteoporosis and heart conditions in the future.

Because the adults concerned are male.

I thought cis was a deletable word on mn? As it's so sexist.

Me too LunaLights
This is experimentation on babies. Just as children and teenagers are being experimented on by taking puberty blockers despite the lack of data and evidence.
The abuse and removal of women's language by a misogynistic ideology irritates me. The open experimentation on infants, children and teenagers terrifies me. They will be the casualties as long as these unethical, narcissistic beliefs are allowed to dominate and we all stay silent in the face of the aggressive bullying.

The whole thing is a massive medically negligent fuck up.

Or the white middle class people in my area. To be fair, a few have heard it though and like me find it deeply offensive. It is a term that nit only reduces us to a subset of women and thereby removing the meaning of the word, it also reduces womanhood to a feeling - we are women because we feel like it, we are paid less because we feel like women, we take on a larger share of the burden of caring because we feel like women, we are objectified by men because we feel like women - see it is all our fault!

Much though I agree with many of the issues raised in this thread, I must admit the Daily Mail is up to its usual amping up in terms of how it has represented the issue. The fundamental issue is that if you view gender as a performative act, you require other people to validate your self perception/actualisation etc. So yes, it's quite possible that there are trans women around who really want to breastfeed, because it's both very performative, and very feminine. I read a long blog by a trans woman who was trying to do just that. Her wife was apparently not very happy, but it also sounded like the baby was in fact being fed with standard human breast milk. Another setup would potentially be very harmful for the baby and would need review of the health risks to the baby. But this is not actually happening on the NHS.

I was shocked to hear that hospitals are insisting that new mothers supply their own formula too. 16 years ago I was well supported by the NHS in my area with once a week clinics and they still run those clinics. I was disappointed to discover that wasn't across the UK.

I fully agree that more support is needed for all mothers who have given birth to be able to breastfeed, or to formula feed. There should be no stigmatising, no shame - just centred on that infant and its needs.

This...completely. Women's health has been relegated to second class status for decades, and now even within the gynie area money is being spent on this nonsense rather than helping those women who need it.

I really query the wider implications of a newborn being born into a family where the male is as self obsessed as to put their needs above the infant's.

I am over 60. Went through the menopause at 54.
Went to get HRT from the GP who said they didn’t prescribe it. I wasn’t referred to anyone else who was.

Struggled through, tried to get sleeping pills as I was having 2-4 hours sleep per night.
I was told they don’t work so they don’t prescribe them.

Had an X-ray about the pains in my joints and was told I have arthritis and that was it. It wasn’t till friend was diagnosed with arthritis that I realised there were meds.

I really don’t have the will power to go back to the doctors because I know ot will be one huge waste of time.
I take painkillers instead.

I have now got the hot flashes back and I really don’t know what to do as I read I am too old for HRT now.

What on earth have I just read?!
Poor, poor babies.

Why are things getting so weird over the past few years?