Could you forgive someone if they'd said this to you?

[OhHiRocco]

"You didn't give a fuck about X when they were alive and you're only interested now because you're getting their money" (meaning inheritance)

And "you only used to do A for them because they were paying you"

I'm due to see the person that said these things to me tomorrow after almost 6 weeks of NC and I feel like I will just be expected to forgive and forget it all, but I don't know if I can. I can go into more detail if anyone wants/needs to know anything more to make an accurate judgement on if they could themselves forgive, but what they said is very much not true and it hurt me very much.

I had a similar situation. It beyond hurt me and belittled by relationship with the deceased but I choose to forgive, rise above is as I knew the person didn't mean it and was lashing out from the grief. I haven't forgotten though.

I would brush it off. Emotions are high when someone we love dies. Perhaps they do harbour negative feelings and maybe they do feel this is true about you but you can either ignore them and move on or put them right. However I wouldn’t let it upset you. Only you know the truth and the truth counts not speculation.

My other grandparent also had dementia for years before they died, so I do understand how distressing it can be. But this grandparent only got diagnosed not long before they died, and it was not as extreme as what we experienced before. Mostly due to them being in the care home, and restricted visiting for a long time due to covid, so we were sheilded from it a lot. She didn't visit for a long time, as it was only 1 person allowed, and this was my sibling who was the designated person as they had POA. She went for maybe the last few months they were in the home, so it's not like she was caring for them day in day out, 24 hours a day. She has always talked about them in this way and even after they died she talked about how much she resented them and basically blamed them for ruining her life.

Yes, this is exactly how it felt, like they have belittled my relationship with my own grandparent!

Sorry that you have had to go through a similar situation

@OhHiRocco

So wait....it's your mother who's complaining? So I assume that piggy in the middle is your dad.

"Make it make sense."

Honestly, if the relationships are what they think I are, I can't make it make sense unless your mother is, shall we say, not a very kind/nice person. I guess I can see your reason for wanting to continue to be around her, for your dad's sake, but honestly it would be very hard for me after such ugly words.

The best I would be able to do is be icily polite. I just couldn't play happy families or accept a fake apology, it would be too false to myself. And if she dared to say anything about the 'situation' I'd say "Do NOT bring that up. If you do, you will be asked to leave".

I'm sorry you're having to deal with this. It's really shit in the midst of your grief.

As I said above, my DH strongly dislikes them, but even he can see they love our kids and wants them to have a relationship. He would be the first to stop any contact if he didn't think it was a good idea. He cut off his own DM for not bothering with DS1 when he was a baby, she'd go 6-8 weeks without seeing him or even texting/calling to ask after him. He cut off his DB for similar.

As a family you seem to be cutting off quite a few people out of your lives.

Perhaps there is more of a back story here than you've written about, but perhaps consider that communication is a good way to resolve issues rather than blanking people from your life by being continually offended by people not meeting your standards.

Did your mother say some horrible things - yes she did. But I'm assuming it was one of her parents who died and that had a significant emotional impact.

Talk to her about how you feel (without losing your rag) and go from there.

IMHO people go from 0-60mph far too fast in making life changing decisions about family and contact without taking the time to discuss the issue at hand.

It's ok to feel hurt by what she said, but based on what you posted, you and your DH are very quick to cut people out of your lives that don't meet your expectations.

".....are what they think I are". This is what happens when you don't proof read and you're trying to type as fast as you're thinking

"....are what I think they are."

I suspect she is using your children to isolate you further, saying look I can have a wonderful relationship with my grandchildren but not you. It’s another form of bullying and your children are just pawns.

Yes, it's my Mum, her Dad is the one who passed away. And Piggy in the middle is my Dad.

She is, in all honesty, a deeply deeply unhappy person. She has a long list of health issues, that I am not denying is difficult to live with, but she is just so negative and bitter, it's hard to be around her sometimes. She acts like everything is the worst thing in the world, it's always such a drama. She acts as if our family gets all the bad luck and nothing ever goes right for any of us, and that life is just sooo sooo hard, and she makes absolutely everything about her and her feelings. She sees problems that aren't there and makes up ridiculous "what ifs" in her head. It's draining. My dad is a very mentally stable and reasonable man, how they've been together for almost 40 years, I'll never know.

I'm thinking for tomorrow at least, of just being civil and polite, but like you say, not engaging regarding what she said.

There is much more of a back story with regards to DH and cutting off his own family tbh, that was just the final straw before he cut his DM off. There's a long history of growing up neglected, in a home full of domestic violence, physical child abuse, alcoholism and a lot more I'm sure even I don't know about. As a result, he does not stand for people's bullshit, he is very much a "things are black or white" type person. He doesn't do wishy washy, or shitty excuses. If you don't make an effort with me or my kids, then he won't make an effort with you. Which is why he won't cut my DM off from them. He knows that she cares, would do anything for them and will always make an effort with them.

I am a lot more for giving people the benefit of the doubt. It's one of the things he thinks I need to work on, but again, that's for another thread 🤣

This poster has nailed it

I'd never forgive. It actually makes it worse that it is your mother and not some random 2nd cousin or something. I also wouldn't let someone who treated me so horribly around my children. But I had an amazing mother who was my best friend and I am still devastated 7 years after her passing. A mother being so awful to her own child blows me away.

"I'm thinking for tomorrow at least, of just being civil and polite, but like you say, not engaging regarding what she said."

@OhHiRocco I think that's best. And I'd try to stay away from her or not be alone with her as much as I could.

I think you need to have it out with your mum and consider further NC. I'd look at it like this, it sounds like your mum was and is emotionally abusive to you and in having an ongoing relationship you are allowing her to continue to hurt you. I certainly wouldn't trust how she'd be with your DC not least that she is disrespectful of and undermining of you and that your DC may well pick up on this. We tell women to leave abusive men because of how children will think of those relationships, would you want yoyr children to think being treated like this is acceptable? Denying access to DCisnt about pushing your mother, it's about protecting them from someone who could do them harm. I'd cancel the visit, say you don't feel able to meet and suggest a talk another time. Tell DC unfortunately DGP can't come. Or let your dad come alone. He doesn't have to be piggy unless he wants to be.

I'd also suggest read Phillipa Perry's amazing The Book you'll wish your parents read (and the book your children will be glad you read). I'm, sorry you have such a shit mum. You dsereve better and you don't have to tolerate her.

You need to read about ring theory and circles of support.your grandparent is the centre of the crisis, your mum as close family is in the innermost circle next circle you and your siblings, next circle extended family and close friends next circle etc. The rule is that people can dump outwards, but only support moves inwards.please try to grow the emotional maturity to follow this.Your mum , as the most affected, can dump outwards on you, but in return you should give support.
It is extremely hard to have a parent suffering dementia, and I think it is pretty poor you did not visit the care home.Please try to grow up a little bit and stop making this crisis all about you

The person who said these things sounds very cynical and mean spirited, and someone who does not like or respect you. Having read everything they've said. I wouldn't have them in my life again.

I know you've said that she loves your DC and treats them differently to how she treats you, and as a grandmother to them I can believe that. BUT, do you honestly think that she would avoid dripping poison in their ear about you? Even if it's unintentionally? I just couldn't trust them alone with my DC, and if I couldn't be there with them too (and I wouldn't want to be), they wouldn't see my DC. Actions have consequences.

Maybe she genuinely feels what she said is true Until you said it was your mother, my brother could have written this about me. I have a very poor opinion over how he behaved when my mother was ill and dying and that will never change, no matter how he has rewritten the story. He has now become the victim while I put up with his actions over a very long period of time but to say anything meant I was perceived as lashing out or being unfair.

I wouldn’t want to be around someone who thought so badly of me ever again. Have they even apologised?

You are beib rather unfair on your DH here; he absolutely is supporting you to the point that he would be very upset on your behalf if he saw this person again.
The fact you are allowing this person to come to your house and interact with you DD puts DH and person coming with Nasty Person in an invidious position.

Has you DD missied Nasty Person since you've been NC? If Nasty isn't important to her, you are being unreasonable to let this person come just to satisfy their own need

You didn't give a fuck about X when they were alive and you're only interested now because you're getting their money
Is it true though? I said this to several family members when my aunt died. They hadn’t visited her for over a decade but they turned up and cried at her funeral. And obviously they put their hands out and took the money.

I agree with this. I also know how damaging it can be for children to be around toxic extended relatives especially when they know there is an issue with their mother and the toxic one. They know- they always know and if they are too young now they will come to realise it.

And you dad might be sensible and reasonable but he is also her enabler. You are considering allowing her to come because he is coming. He is facilitating access to her and has put up with her nastiness for years. This is enabling her. I have always said that everyone tiptoes around the most difficult person in the room, but you can stop that now.

Give yourself a breather and some space. Read up on some of the very excellent books for adult children of absuive parents. Figure out what you want to do when you have had a chance to separate yourself emotionally a bit. You are so stuck in the grooves of how you relate to her you probably cannot even see it for the full amount of toxicity that it truly is.

And no, I would never forgive that comment.

So, I'm in a similar position. My DM whinges about everything, nothing is enough, etc. she can't be stressed or unhappy without everyone around her feeling it too, and when she's happy it's because her needs have been met even if at the expense of everyone else. If she has a thought, even a nasty one, it falls out of her mouth. She's very critical.

My dad was a lovely, grounded man. How he put up with her for years I'll never know.

Some things to bear in mind...

I've often regretted bitterly that he died, and she's still with us. It's not fair. I'm not a nasty person, there are many reasons why this way round has been very hard on us all.

He actually chose to be with her for almost 60 years. Active choices. I have to respect that. I actually don't respect the way he pandered to her- he made an active choice to let her carry on the way she does.
So your piggy in the middle is choosing to indulge his wife's ways, remember.

We can see someone's weaknesses and choose to overlook them. Just don't make yourself emotionally vulnerable to her. You know what she's like, don't expect her to change or be different.

She's judging you on her own standards. She knows what goes on in her own head, and assumes similar in yours. That's means what she says is not a terrible insult, even if it sounds like it. It's not based on her knowledge of you. It's based on her knowledge of herself. So let it go.

Be careful of your children. Give them tools to manage unreasonable people. Just because she's lovely with them now, doesn't mean she'll cope with them when they get older and break out of her idea of what a lovely grandchild is like. DM was great with babies, awful with unreasonable toddlers. It got better for us as the DC were old enough to realise the score, and behave accordingly. For my nieces and nephews it got worse as they didn't behave accordingly (cheeky teens).