To want to move back to the UK from the US?

[Star555]

For background, I am a 30-something year old British expat who has been in the US for a long time. My parents also live in the US, though on the other side of the country. I am currently doing a postgraduate STEM degree (at a very liberal east coast university) that I expect to finish in 3-4 years.

I don't think I've ever felt such a strong longing to return to the UK as I have been feeling over the last year or so, and especially now after the horrific Texas school shooting. Despite the pandemic, Brexit, the war in Ukraine, the cost of living crisis, Partygate, etc. I just feel like moving back home to the UK would be better and safer than staying in the US where mass shootings have become the norm, and the sex-based rights of women are being systematically erased in the name of "trans rights". (At least there is more pushback in the UK from JKR and other feminists and politicians!) I cannot imagine raising kids in the future in such an environment as the US.

I'm stuck finishing my degree for the next few years so it wouldn't be an immediate move, but I've started thinking about it seriously. My parents are permanently settled in the US and don't want to return to the UK, so it would be just me who moves. As an only child, I would feel guilty being so far from my parents as they get older, and any UK salary I earn would be significantly lower than the corresponding US salary, so I wouldn't have any financial cushion, especially if I move to London.

Has anyone been in a similar position? Honestly both the US and UK are a big mess right now, but would you move back to the UK from the US if you were in my shoes? Thanks!

Plus the cost of giving birth if you decide to have children is ridiculous as is the cost of staying in hospital if your baby needs care in the NICU after birth. Unbelievable how a country that is pro life does sod all to help women/families financially should they have children.

Many of the steps that have been taken in the UK to suppress GC women could not have happened in the US, due to 1st Amendment protections.

Can you give some examples of this? I've known GC speakers in the US to have been cancelled and de-platformed. And all the woke universities lash out against any GC sentiments (I have personally felt this myself when I speak up!)

I've lived and worked in the states. I've been turning down return job offers since Trump was elected.

The past three months, I've lost count of how many American friends and ex-colleagues have contacted me, asking if there is any way they can relocate with their families to the UK.

I thought Connecticut, where Sandy Hook is, is a blue state?

Friends of mine sold up and returned to the UK just before their child entered the school system. In their words, they didn’t want ‘how to hide from an active shooter’ being one of the first things their child was taught at school. They do miss the home they’d bought and community they lived in but have no regrets on coming back to the UK. They are now expecting another child and looking forward to having longer maternity leave than they had first time round in the US.

You aren't the only one OP. One of my friends is moving back with her family over the summer.

Unfortunately, the majority of answers that you get on here will come from people who only see the main stories from the US and have not had any experience of actually living there themselves. I’m in pretty much exactly your shoes, and although I miss the UK, I won’t be moving back. I would rather be closer to my parents as they get older (they live here in the US) and I love that we’ve been able to buy a large house for the cost of a flat back home. Wages are better, insurance plans aren’t bad and there’s so many places to go exploring. I’ll probably be paying for a private school education here, but I’m not overly concerned about school shootings. There are good reasons to live in both countries, but I think you’ll find that there are a number of things you miss by going back to the UK too.

I never even thought about this. Do any pension plans come with health insurance? Or do there exist health insurance plans with a built in retirement provision after X years?

Are there large numbers of people paying through the nose for health care during their younger healthier years, and then finding themselves up shit creek at the time they actually need the medical care?

I thought Connecticut, where Sandy Hook is, is a blue state?

It is, but you have to look at the over all risk. Sandy Hook doesn't tell you about the general risk of being shot in Connecticut, any more than Dunblane tells you about the general risk of being shot in Scotland.

Brits tend to fixate on the risk of gun violence in the US because it's an alien risk to us. Same when we go to Australia- we're freaked out by sharks and snakes. Don't get me wrong: gun deaths over all are obscenely high in the US, but they are not evenly distributed. Gun deaths in Mississippi are nearly 5 times higher than in Connecticut.

I would base my decision on your personal financial circumstances. Where are you, given your career aspirations and expected income, going to have a better standard of living, considering access to healthcare, house prices, etc? The UK is the better country to be poor in; the US is better if you're rich.

Can you give some examples of this? I've known GC speakers in the US to have been cancelled and de-platformed. And all the woke universities lash out against any GC sentiments (I have personally felt this myself when I speak up!)

I am certainly not denying the intense social pressure against expressing GC views in 'progressive' environments in the US. But one example I would give is the Caroline Farrow case. I don't believe it could have happened in the US, because it would be a straight-up violation of 1st Amendment rights.

Also, the US is less vulnerable to organisational capture because of its size and diversity, plus the checks on the powers of Federal government. Stonewall managed to gain ideological control over the Civil Service and NHS via a tiny number of activists, because the UK Civil Service and NHS are single organisations (albeit with many different outlets). That would have been far more difficult in the US.

Sort of get where you’re coming from but it doesn’t change the risk. Guns are still readily available, regardless. After Dunblane, we changed things - we changed our gun laws so that anything above a hand gun was prohibited and made it stricter to get a license, and we made our schools safe with other safety measures.

So Mississippi and other red states have higher gun deaths than blue states…but a horrendous massacre of little kids happened in a blue state and still, nothing changed. So for me, that risk stays the same.

im in the uk, from the uk and like nascar racing and other types of motor racing and also i liked las vegas so what stereotype would i fall into?

Can you give some examples of this? I've known GC speakers in the US to have been cancelled and de-platformed. And all the woke universities lash out against any GC sentiments (I have personally felt this myself when I speak up!)

Based on what I have read, there have been criminal investigations in the UK for the expression of views as hate speech. For the most part, speech in and of itself cannot be a crime in the US because of the First Amendment.

I've never lived in the US but after the last shooting, I can absolutely understand why you'd want to leave. I can't imagine sending my kids to school and having to think that they might be shot. I know it's a statistical improbability but the thought would always be there I think.
I was reading a thread on Twitter after the shooting (here) and I'd never realised that children there have been doing active shooter drills for many years. The thread was heartbreaking to read and put me off ever wanting to live there, with children at least.

Sure, just try coming back and see if you like it. There are pros and cons to both places.

Your parents chose to uproot in the first place, so I don’t think you need to feel guilty about them, and if you are on opposite coasts then travel is already significant.

I have loved lots of individual Americans. In fact, my favourite people in the whole world are intelligent American anglophiles. All my favourite professors at my (British) university were American, and the best friend I ever had was an American.

That said, I couldn’t live there. A vast, fascinating, exciting country, sure, but just too **ing crazy for me. It’s also too brutal. There’s an undercurrent of violence and danger, a feeling that things could suddenly explode.

I feel safer in the U.K. Compared to the states it seems calmer and more civilised. God knows it’s far from perfect. And god knows I wish we had more sunshine (and more American optimism). But it’s my country. I’m secure here. I certainly wouldn’t raise children anywhere else. In the U.K., I kind of feel like I know the threats, like I could see danger coming before it was too late. The more I travel, the more puzzled I am by British self-loathing. To hear some Brits speak, you’d think we lived in the worst country in the world.

So Mississippi and other red states have higher gun deaths than blue states…but a horrendous massacre of little kids happened in a blue state and still, nothing changed. So for me, that risk stays the same

It did change, though. Connecticut tightened its gun laws after Sandy Hook.

Connecticut is further from Mississippi than London is from Rome. The risks are just not the same. Do you worry about gun crime rates in central Italy when you're in London??

@Star555 have you looked at salary and cost of living differences? Politics aside, that really matters. I've lived in both countries and the US is very divided - I doubt you find many that agree with your political views on the east coast,liberal college towns and IT centres so does the big picture matter that much? The US is so heavily federalised.

@MissLucyEyelesbarrow i live in London and don’t worry about gun crime at all 🤷🏻‍♀️ I certainly don’t worry about my children going to school, and that is worth its weight in gold.

But I guess we’re all different. I couldn’t live in a country that accepts this risk. That tries to do anything but remove the risk. I feel very lucky I live in the UK - for ALL its problems, and god knows we have lots. I feel lucky I don’t feel sick with worry sending my young children to school.

I’m not sure what you’re trying to argue, exactly. Sandy Hook showed us it can happen in the more liberal states. It’s never going to not happen as long as the NRA has its way with access to guns. Comparative risks in different states don’t remove the risk it will likely happen again and again. So maybe it’s less likely in liberal states - that would absolutely not lessen any anxiety I might feel and so for me, it’s not worth it. The whole point is it could very likely happen, just a bit less likely in some states than others whereas in the UK, it’s extremely UNLIKELY to happen. That’s an unacceptable level of risk, for me personally, when it comes to my children.

London and other parts of the uk do have a problem with knife crime though - it's not an automatic rifle but if your child gets stabbed in a shopping centre it's just as lethal to them.

Big picture politics barely matters if you can't afford to get on they housing ladder or can't pay your rent and you're facing a multi-month (sometimes years long) waiting list for any health care referral you or your future child may need.

I personally wouldn't. My standard of living is way better than it was in the UK. Yes, there are some things I don't agree with and accept but there's a lot of amazing things as well.

I'm an American expat in the UK and I definitely think things are lots better here. Definitely not perfect but not as utterly insane as they US. I do miss my family but used to see them regularly prior to the pandemic. I especially wouldn't move back now I'm a parent. I can't imagine worrying about school shooting and guns generally.

I do fantasise about living in a warmer place like LA. Getting up and enjoying the warmth, not standing on freezing rugby pitches freezing my a**e off. Eating dinner outside for more than 2 months of the year. I think it would genuinely improve my mood.

The US is rapidly going backwards! White, elderly men deciding what some cannot do with their own bodies etc, school shootings! On what planet do people think it’s ok for CHILDREN to practice active shooter drills like it’s fucking normal?????? Get out !!