American needs to fight against terror closer to home

[josil]

And focus their energy on teenage boys who seem to be causing terror frequently by shooting us schools. Supermarkets etc etc.

What never ceases to amaze me is somehow these shooters manage to escape the stereotypes that others ethnic groups find it impossible to shake off.

RIP to those dead ok the latest massacre in the US.

The US needs to fight against terror and start with those close to home.

I always felt that if change didn’t happen after Sandy Hook, then it would never happen, but I do hope that maybe with newer generations, minds will change.

I find it hard to imagine the police will be against a change in the law. How many police officers are killed by guns every year?

Stringent gun control works in other countries because personal fire arm ownership is low in the first place.

America has the highest rate of personal fire arm ownership in the world and they won’t give up their guns.

'1776 will commence again if you try to take our firearms' -Alex Jones.

Completely agree with this. As a teenager I dreamed of living in the US. Now I wouldn't live there for any amount of money. The rest of the world is slowly waking up to the reality of the 'American Dream'. Britain is a shitshow, but I'd still rather be here.

Americans can keep their right to bare arms. But those arms don't have to be the kind of arms used in these shootings. Let them all have a 1777 pistol not a 2022 rifle and see the effect that has on mortality rates. Problem solved, no more school shootings. Because the shooter will get maybe one or two shoots at best.

We don't have a gun ban in the UK we have stricter laws on gun control, which is not the same thing. There are many people with a gun license. But these are harder to get, involve stringent checks and the types of weapon are restricted. America could absolutely improve gun controls in the same way over time and see a massive reduction in these kinds of incidents. Would it eradicate Them overnight? No. But it would improve the number and severity of incidents pretty damn quickly.

When your kid keeps drawing on the wall, you don't hand them crayons more easily, do you? No. You take the crayons. You hide the crayons. You only give them crayons when they have some paper to draw on. You make the crayons harder to get. You give them alternatives, why don't they play dolls or do jigsaws? They might still get hold of a crayon and draw on the wall, but there will be less crayon overall.

These teenagers are reaching out in desperation for something to help them, and instead of finding connection, community, therapy, mediation, love, a mentor, a parent, a friend, a priest, they are finding that a gun is in easier reach. But what if it was harder to get to a gun? What if it was so difficult to get one that by the time they did they had had a chance to make a different choice. They had a chance to fix some of their feelings and problems and never got to that gun at all?

The easiest intervention is to create distance. It is so much easier for a kid to not draw on the wall if they don't have any crayons. So much easier not to eat all the cookies if you don't buy any cookies. So much easier to not shoot up a school if you can't easily come by a gun.

The problem of disenfranchised young men, incels, racists etc. Is not unique to America, but the shootings are. And that can only be because of the availability of guns, and not just any guns but the kind that are largely restricted elsewhere in the world.

Completely agree with this. As a teenager I dreamed of living in the US. Now I wouldn't live there for any amount of money. The rest of the world is slowly waking up to the reality of the 'American Dream'. Britain is a shitshow, but I'd still rather be here.

I love the US (or parts of it!) I'm frequently on here defending it and I hate the anti American slant on MN, there are a lot of bloody lovely Americans and a lot of their country is breathtakingly stunning. But I'm not sure I could live there and like you it used to be my dream.

Thankyou @iklboo
Bit of light relief

Even if handguns and ordinary rifles were still freely available, why on earth they don’t ban automatic rifles I will never understand. Who on earth outside the military - or the police - ever needs one?

As has been pointed out, the constitutional right to bear arms was enshrined in law long before such weapons of mass murder were available.

It did here. It did in New Zealand. There is no need to keep firearms apart from a very very small minority ( like farmers having a shotgun)

How about something radical like doing both?

@BritWifeInUSA

You are missing the point when it comes to gun ownership. Stopping responsible law-abiding gun owners from having guns will not stop this sort of thing from happening

Would you still be opposed to tighter regulation if your children will killed by a school shooter?

Or would you say the murderer's right to bear arms was more important than your children's lives?

Genuine question, not rhetorical.

It's a generational thing. When the current generation of 20 and 30 somethings gain political power they will vote for a ban on privately owned weapons. The baby boomers (who seem to think it's ok for these children to be slaughtered and that its a price worth paying so that they can have guns) will start to die off soon, and the voting result will change. It's just a matter of time but obviously they will have to tolerate this sort of thing until then.

I just can't understand why the USA allows 18 year olds to buy these powerful automatic rifles (not sure of the correct term). I understand there is a belief in the 'right' to have a gun, but surely not these huge powerful guns for 18 year olds. I frequently hear of peoples need to 'protect' themselves, so they buy a gun. The US must be awash with guns, from what I understand, citizens will never accept a ban. So why not control the access to powerful automatic rifles, an 18 year old does not need one of those!

Stopping responsible law-abiding gun owners from having guns will not stop this sort of thing from happening

Agreed.

They should bring into law gun safes. So kids/teenagers cant get hold the parents guns.

You've overlooked that the type of guns available has changed. How many ordinary citizens prior to the 1960s could get hold of an automatic weapon? Difficult to have a mass shooting using a Civil War musket.

I agree. I think it's a wonderful place, most of the people, most of the landscape and most of the everything else is the ultimate dream.

But when I think about guns, healthcare, the insane justice system and death penalty, the abortion laws and their food and drugs laws I would never ever live there.

When I was a kid my dad got offered a job in Pittsburgh. We went over for a visit and my parents were shocked at the gun crime and how dangerous it was, so turned down the job. I’m sure it’s a lot safer now than it was in the 80s. I have friends that live in the US and I’m sure for the most part it’s a lovely place to live but I wouldn’t want to live there.

Sorry, it was Detroit not Pittsburgh. My brains not working today.

I’d love to think you were right about this. But sadly, I simply do not think you are.

The belief in the right to bear arms is handed down the generations.

Gun owners in the US give guns to their babies when they’re born. First birthday? First gun.

If you think, for example, Trump supporters are all ageing Boomers, you’re sorely mistaken.

“Gun owners in the US give guns to their babies when they’re born. First birthday? First gun.”

Source: Trust me bruh

In the USA, Mexicans do not consider themselves white, nor are they considered to be by others

Which just goes to show how bonkers America is. The rest of the world sees people of Spanish heritage as white but the USA thinks anyone of any European heritage must have blonde hair and blue eyes like Dolph Lundgren.

One of the most bizarre things about the Hilaria Baldwin controversy wasn't that she lied about pretending to be Spanish but that so many Americans thought Spain was in central America.

*Americans have had the right to bear arms since 1776.

School shootings such as this did not start until the 1960s.

This suggests that guns are secondary to a primary cause. Mental health*

to start- americans have had the right to bear arms as part of a well regulated militia. Not sure that Dave up the road with an assault rifle could be described as well regulated.

secondly do you think MH issues only started in the 1960’s? That between 1776-1960 no one had MH problems?

the primary cause has always existed. So that is not the cause of mass shootings post 1960…

"Yes it does. And that has been proven in every developing country that has banned guns.
It's worked. The USA is just to fucked up and backwards to do it."
What other country with mass gun ownership and a strong gun culture has banned guns? It simply wouldn't work in the US and would lead to civil war and the breakup of the country. Police officers just wouldn't be prepared to kill their neighbours and friends who had been law-abiders all their lives, now branded criminals because they own a gun.

@BritWifeInUSA everyone is law abiding until they are not surely? It was legal for this 18 year old who had not committed any crimes to buy two assault weapons. Which he then used to shoot and kill 19 adults and children, injuring many more. The only thing that would have prevented this was to stop his easy ass access to fucking guns.

But of course on certain subjects you can't tell Americans anything. Only they know about guns, freedoms and rights.

Though I agree with gun control (who wouldn't?) that's such a good point.

Alienation.