Why are people on here so pressed about the existence of SAHMs?

[DaffodilsandCoffee]

It’s fair enough to point out the existence of certain downsides are risks, but there seems to be so much spite and resentment on here. Why are some posters do angry at the existence of women who prefer to do all the childcare themselves rather than outsource some of it? Also, are they equally as angry at SAHDs? (I know it’s not as common but I personally know 3)

I think everyone should do risk management about their future income streams, no-one should just rely on the fact that a single individual will always be around and amenable to pay for them, but there's plenty of ways to do that without committing yourself to a classic "career" lifestyle including but not limited to investing in assets, maintaining essential outgoings that are affordable even on benefits, creating alternative relationships that can be relied on in times of duress, staying debt free and joining a convent, doing small amounts of side work to maintain and develop skillsets etc etc - it's really not the either or people make it out in these threads.

I became a SAHM because I didn't enjoy working.
I wanted to stay at home, enjoy my dc and not get bossed about or answer to anyone.
I'm probably the reason people feel anger to a SAHM but I will only live once and I want enjoy my time so my time is not for sale.

@mijas

You asked why I view the role negatively. I answered. Its not about you.

Its about the wider impacts on society that result in women thinking they dont want anything else but to be mums.

While men think they can want and be whatever they like.

Its not about forcing everyone to be the same, however as I said before you were happy enough to put forward your social circle as the ideal earlier.

OK for everyone (man at work, woman at home) to be the same when its what you want

Some working parents inevitably will be jealous, though. Particularly if they're miserable in their jobs and would rather be spending time with their children.

@mijas

Yes.

If the millionaire (is that supposed to be impressive?) didn't work, they'd be unemployed.

If they didn't work but volunteered they'd be an unemployed volunteer

What women in the UK think they can only want to be mums? I've never met any woman who doesn't think they can aspire to exactly the same things as men can aspire to. Some people, men and women, are not very interested in careers - focusing on a household is an easier way for a woman to get out of it than a man though because men are more willing to pay for a woman than women are to pay for a man.

@AccessibleVoid

Are you asking me if its ok to be unemployed to avoid tax?

@Dinosauratemydaffodils

Are you well off?

I have a feeling there may be a demographic issue at play.

Most sahms aren't wealthy. Lots are trapped.

They're not learning 2nd languages and being trustees

If that payment structure is avoiding tax it's how almost every small business pays out profits to owners. The government is well aware of it and the tax structure is set up that way to enable it.

@AccessibleVoid

doesn't think they can aspire to exactly the same things as men can aspire to.

why aren't they meeting those aspirations the same way men are then?

I wanted to stay at home, enjoy my dc and not get bossed about

I've never been bossed about more than by darling children in their toddler years. Must be doing it wrong.

@AccessibleVoid

Yup.

Tax efficiency and minimising tax are just nicer ways of saying tax avoidance

Well for one they often have different interests.
For two there's still plenty of structural inequality that makes it genuinely harder for women in the workforce.
For three there are still social expectations on both working and non-working women that they are responsible for things that men aren't (case in point, my mother in law visits, she sees my house is a mess which it always is, she asks why I didn't clean up - as though it's entirely my responsibility lol no) that put additional stress on women regardless of their working status.

And no-one pays more tax than they have to. Your tax obligations are your tax obligations, if you pay more than you're obliged to then you're a chump (same as if you don't claim all the entitlements you could get). There's no virtue in wearing a hair shirt, if you think you should pay more tax then lobby your representatives to change the tax system so that you're obliged to.

The difference is that if your kids boss you around you can say no, laugh, and ignore them until they learn it's pointless but if your boss bosses you around you can get fired if you do that.

@AccessibleVoid

I agree. Yet apparently saying we should be challenging these things that force women to not aspire to more, thats wrong?

Nah.

Tax avoidance is probably a different thread but I think its obviously more common the more we'll off you are.

People deciding to stay at home with their children doesn't cause any of those things (and the first one is fine, people can have whatever interests they like, if all women just happened to be more interested in art and literature than they were in construction to the point that women ended up more likely to spend their time doing artsy things instead of building houses that would not be "a problem" even if it meant there were less women working in construction).

@AccessibleVoid

Of course 'women staying at home with their children' contributes to and is caused by these things.

Women are not a homogeneous group all weirdly into not working while men are all weirdly into not looking after kids.

Theyre brought up to fit into these roles.

Most sahms aren't wealthy. Lots are trapped.

How do you know this? Have you done a national survey?

That was to Topgub.

The vast majority of British mothers aren't stay at home mothers, it's a pretty uncommon thing to do these days. When I go to the playground the only women I meet during the day tend to be people on benefits who have mental health issues preventing them from working, this is less true in the first year after having a baby when there's still a lot of people on maternity leave, but for anyone who's child is over three being a SAHM is extremely rare in the UK unless you're from a niche religious sect that encourages it. So where does homogenous come from - choosing to be a SAHM is not something many people even do.

"for anyone who's child is over three being a SAHM is extremely rare in the UK unless you're from a niche religious sect that encourages it."

What?

I don't disagree with what you say @AccessibleVoid but I'm guessing joining a convent was a typo 😀

Maybe extremely is an exaggeration but from the ONS "In April to June 2019, 3 in 4 mothers with dependent children (75.1%) were in work in the UK." - and a lot of that 25% not in work will not be in work for reasons other than childcare (involuntary unemployment, disability) or mothers of children under 3.

Its an option lmao. Might not be one many people would choose but hey if it's that or starve you can take account of it in your planning 😅

Some people, men and women, are not very interested in careers - focusing on a household is an easier way for a woman to get out of it than a man though because men are more willing to pay for a woman than women are to pay for a man.

It is one thing that makes me glad to be a woman. Me not working and living off my husband's wage is not looked down on quite the same way as a man who is living off woman's wage.