Guardian is publishing Russian Propaganda

[Swayingpalmtrees]

AIBU to be very disappointed that the Guardian has resorted to publishing Russian propaganda. It was shocking to read, largely inaccurate and wholly from the Russian perspective. I am all for listening to all sides, but there was no effort to understand how Ukraine feels, Ukraine's objective is clearly to win the war and reclaim their nation, and blaming the western leaders for arming Ukraine and the bloodshed caused by the Russians is somewhat misleading, Ukraine have every right to defend themselves.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/apr/27/ukraine-war-end-putin-russia-talks

They will need Western technological assistance to keep exploiting those resources, because their own isn't up to the job.

Indeed. And they need Western input for many things in their industries, technology sector and economy. But, with sanctions, cannot now get it.

So, to answer @CorsicaDreaming's question, I would continue exactly what is being done. Fight, and sanction. And remember that it is not actually up to us, it is up to Ukraine.

And of course there is now no way that Russia can get any kind of weapon, pretendy-civilian use or not, from the West. Even France and Germany have been made to stop supplying them.

Sanctions are hitting Russia hard in all sorts of ways.

@LemonDrizzleSlice -

So, to answer @CorsicaDreaming's question, I would continue exactly what is being done. Fight, and sanction. And remember that it is not actually up to us, it is up to Ukraine.

I agree it is up to Ukraine, but if it was fully up to them to decide what happened, we (the West) would have stepped in already and instigated a no fly zone... and would probably now be in a fully escalated war.

What we are doing now seems to be 'hiding' - not fully fighting, but giving aid and arms - and so allowing huge humanitarian atrocities to continue against the Ukrainian people as a fallout of the current strategy - which is committed but not really committed.

I am not advocating a war, and I can't see any better solution myself, but I am not sure the current status quo is working for the Ukrainian people.

Yes Lemon and all this under the cover of the lies that Putin spins to the Russian people that there is no war - which is going to be a harder sell as time passes. If anyone even believes that now. Hard to imagine with the rolling footage of nuclear weapons and threats...

I’m old enough to remember when Angus Roxburgh was the BBC’s Moscow correspondent, and when he was thrown out of the country or displeasing the government.

That’s an excellent article, written by someone with more knowledge and expertise of Russia & Putin than 99.9% of the rest of the U.K. media put together. We should be learning from him, not criticising him.

but I am not sure the current status quo is working for the Ukrainian people

So what do you think would be better for the Ukrainians? To give up their country and live under Putin? What future do you imagine will be waiting for them?

What we are doing now seems to be 'hiding' - not fully fighting, but giving aid and arms - and so allowing huge humanitarian atrocities to continue against the Ukrainian people

How would you propose to stop those atrocities? By asking Putin nicely to stop raping women and children and killing them en masse? Do you think those atrocities will stop if he were to win? Because you would be in a distinct minority if that is what you are suggesting. At best Ukraine would end up in a never ending civil war if Putin were to win, including endless atrocities and mounting death tolls on both side, or worst case a continuation for decades of a fully blown war until Russia runs out of money/men/both.

There is no way out for Russia, they can not win this war. The sooner they understand this basic fact, the better. The Ukrainians will never accept their occupation, and the loss of their nation. Putin has already lost, even if he is the last to know.

Hear hear

I appreciate your perspectives and analysis, to be honest rather than relying on the narrative of the media, I'd prefer to study the files of the various intelligence, military, defence, energy ect agencies and companies, to assemble the narrative that would hopefully be gleaned from the files.

And yet he still grossly overestimates Russian military capacity, thus has been subject to furious criticism from people whose understanding of military matters is much better than his.

For example

twitter.com/PhillipsPOBrien/status/1519560507149197312

Nobody would learn anything from this article. What's his insight? Putin won't back down. We need to have peace talks. Wow. Amazing. I don't think anyone else has figured this out!
They're having ceasefires and Putin breaks them.
There are peace talks going on but they're not making any headway because Putin only want to crush Ukraine. He's not going to stop his attacks for talks until he's broken Ukraine. And then what? Roxburgh is suggesting moving borders, ie countries giving up their land. Can you really see Poland, Finland, Lithuania etc, giving away slices of their country? Because even if they did, Putins going to come back for more. He knows no one is going to stand up to him.
If Roxburgh knows so much, why doesn't he come up with workable solutions that have eluded the world's military and diplomatic resources so far?

Please feel free to post the information that you are to access from highly classified intelligence, military and defence files hawkins I am sure we will all be very interested. In the meantime, the rest of us will simply analyse the facts before us, and call out articles that are written by the Kremlin. This isn't a forum for those working for GCHQ but a discussion on opinion and thoughts in the UK (and other friendly countries) It is a damn shame the same is not available in Russia now wouldn't you say old chap?

** You have access to from highly classified

More people who know a lot about military and strategic issues who think Roxburgh is full of shit.

twitter.com/bctallis/status/1519464905547689986

twitter.com/JEyal_RUSI/status/1519606596833271810

That being said, he's got the tankies on his side.

Vpn networks, tor browsers ect as long as connection in moscow, then ways and means, plus theirs always the Moscow rules for espionage too, when exchanging information

Roskomnadzor Russia's Internet Protection Society, are daily sending requests for Google to remove URLs under the country’s 2017 “VPN law” and blocking 100's of VPN protocols every single day. On top of this the average russian cannot pay for online services outside Russia because sanctions have blocked payments for all usual payment methods. Making its exreamly hard for the average russian to get information from the outside world, but you would know this wouldn't you with your access to classified information 😎

"Surge in VPN sales
While Western governments and businesses placed sanctions on Russia and announced that they would no longer sell their products or allow the country's citizens to use their services, there was a huge surge in VPN downloads by Russian citizens.
In fact, according to Surfshark's internal data, the VPN provider saw a 3,500 percent increase in sales compared to before Russia's invasion of Ukraine began. Head of PR at Surfshark, Gabriele Racaityte provided further details in a press release, saying:
"A rapid surge in downloads means that people living in Russia are actively looking for ways to avoid government surveillance and censorship, be it accessing blocked websites or social media such as Twitter, Facebook, or Instagram. As the number of shut-down websites grows every day, VPN services act as a window to reach unbiased information and untracked communication channels"

@Hawkins001 yes I can read a puff piece on techradar`s webpage but that's all that is and does not address my points.

How can you be sure your information is more accurate and reliable than other sources ? Especially with newspaper restrictions due to e.g. Operational reasons , on stories ect

@Hawkins001 I prefer to get my information from my colleagues and some old friends on mIRC. I don't come onto MN with transparent buzzwords trying to sound like a white knight hacker or agent 🤣, then start quoting to me from bod standard tech websites.

Correct me if I'm wrong, www.wired.co.uk/article/russia-vpns-internet-challenge

Haha, so you are searching the net for every answer, wondered how long it would take you. Google your friend then. 😏

I am waiting (with bated breath) for the in depth classified military and intelligence files hawkins is going to share with us, any updates yet?

That being said, he's got the tankies on his side.

Oh lordy, I forgot the tankies! Bless them. I haven't been on Twitter for ages, how are they coping?

Mostly by saying waaaah NATO and pretending that there'd be peace if the Ukrainians would just pipe down and be good boys and girls, as far as I can see.