To ask why having an elective C-Section is so frowned upon?

[Rosesandbutterflys]

I am (hopefully) having an elective C-Section soon. First baby, don't want anymore children after.

I've always had a fear of child birth, which over the past 5 years has been compounded by a lot of people around me having children and the vast majority of these (though I appreciate I'm probably unlucky here) have been pretty traumatic births that have ended in severe tears, forceps and a lot of the time, an emergency section anyway. Granted their experiences have mostly been better on their second birth/ child.

Nothing and I truly mean nothing about natural childbirth/ labour appeals to me. Not the hours of pain, pushing, potential rips/ tears, forcep intervention, epidural (yes I appreciate I'd have one of these for a section), damage of my pelvic floor and the panic and stress of potentially having to be rushed to theatre because it just wasn't going to happen naturally and the baby is in distress or whatever.

Now don't get me wrong, nothing about a c-section appeals to me either, it's absolutely no walk in the park and I'm dreading it, but it has to come out some way and I am a person that likes to plan things and to somewhat be in control/ aware of the plan. I have also had abdominal surgery before (though not as severe as a C-section) and I know recovery is likely to be painful and slower than if I were to have a natural birth. But for me, this is the preferred/ lesser of the 2 evils option.

I have also spent hours pouring over research as to the benefits of a vaginal birth over a c-section and last night came across a NICE/ NHS study/ research that found that actually, for a planned/ elective c-section, the risk to the mother of a c-section compared to a vaginal birth is pretty much the same. It states that the risk of the baby ending up in NICU with a C-section is 13.9% compared to a vaginal birth which is 6.3%, so double the risk, BUT it says the research does not take into account the fact that most c-sections undertaken are for medical reasons and therefore the likelihood of the baby needing NICU attention after it's born is increased anyway.

It then went on to say that the risks of an unplanned, emergency C-Section are a lot higher than a natural birth/ elective/ planned C-Section. So I guess if each woman was guaranteed to have a straightforward, natural birth, then great, but a lot of women do end up needing an emergency c-section so, technically they are more at risk than someone who has chosen an elective.

This now seems like I am bashing natural delivery and I'm not at all I totally admire and respect women that chose that route, I only wish I were that brave.

However, the responses I have had from people my whole pregnancy when I have admitted I am opting for an elective C-section have been ridiculous. Not one person has responded positively, all I've had is 'Oh, really? Are you sure??' and 'Oh, why on earth would you elect to have that?' etc etc. Or just a stony faced, tight smile and 'oh right' making it clear they disapprove but not actually coming out and saying it.

I got told last night that the reason I'm getting these reactions is because a C-section is 'taking the easy way out '😕

If that's the case, why on earth wouldn't you? Why is it that it seems the prerequisite to being a good mother is seemingly having to martyr yourself all the time?

So many of my friends that have had children and also the women in my NCT class who are preparing for their births have all expressed dismay/ distress at having to have any pain relief, they all want it to be as natural as possible and I know my friends that haven't had 'textbook' births still harbour 'guilt' and sadness to this day. Why? If you need gas and air or an epidural, so what? What exactly am I missing? If they ended/end up with forceps or an emergency section, it's not their fault, it's just one of those things. Surely modern medicine has provided these things to make childbirth safer?

Anyway, gone off on a tangent now but if you disapprove of someone having an elective c-section, could you tell me why?

@bigyellowTpot Silly for not even trying that takes the absolute biscuit. What other areas of health do you enforce that mantra? Your attitude is appalling and just shows the rank misogyny there is in women's healthcare especially maternity care.

Women should have the options regarding birth clearly explained to them and then be supported without judgement to make the choice they want that they feel suits them best, that is progressive women centred health care.

I myself needed an episiotomy and ventouse delivery with my first birth. How fucking ironic that someone who claims the female body is designed to just deliver babies naturally needed interventions to deliver their own - so not such a perfect design then and if you were in a place where those options were unavailable then you and/or baby would most likely have died.

Yes. As I said upthread I was coerced into an induction. I questioned it for weeks because I wanted evidence for it it which all I received was stillbirth stats every time. I found out upon research later that this was a common tactic often used to coerce women into inductions and the stats themselves were outdated. By their logic and the stats they used, they should be inducing every pregnant woman in the population at 39 weeks. I was a healthy, 28 yo ftm, who the consultants thought my baby “looked” big. Every sonographers said they didn’t see it. I questioned if he was so big, why weren’t they offering me an ELCS? How is an induction safer? Once again, stillbirth stats. I was told that doctors knew best. A blue baby that wasn’t even 7lbs came out with two traumatised parents.

I would like to know how an ELCS would have been more expensive than a 3-day failed induction, emcs, therapy for ptsd, and possible life long special needs care for him.

@MissChanandlerBong80 Thank you for such a lovely post! As I say, it took a while after an exhausting delivery for my milk to come in last time and it's reassuring to hear that my feeling - that the delivery and associated issues were related to the delay - is probably a fair one. Once we got started, DD breastfed beautifully and we kept it up for nearly 2 1/2 years so I'm cautiously optimistic that it can be good this time as well

I don’t know where to start.

Except that you don’t piss out of your vagina, ffs.

i didn’t know you could get this in the NHS. I guess for it would be the cost associated with it - but if you’re paying for this privately then no one can and should judge you. My sister In law had three paid for privately - she didn’t want a natural birth.

You can now get this under NICE guidelines. afaik. Sorry if I was in any way offensive up thread. I just really hope all pregnant women these days check out all of the risks and benefits relating to all modes of delivery and fight for what is right for them. ( Although it shouldn't be a fight.)

@bigyellowTpot My body didn’t do what it was supposed to. I didn’t dilate sufficiently, DS was wedged, shoulder presenting not head. Thankfully I had an EMCS. I’m grateful to be alive in the 21st century.

After that and with DS2 being transverse, I chose to have a C-section. Stop being judgey - we may have the same plumbing but it doesn’t necessarily work the same way for everyone.

Go with what you want. Nobody else should care.

I really wanted a vaginal birth. Luckily it was a textbook delivery, no issues afterwards. Was up and about a couple of hours later, back running and at the gym within a few weeks. I was actually terrified of a C section because I had a fear of my uterus being sliced open and dealing with a wound.

FFS @bigyellowTpot the more of your posts I read the more I despair. my grandmother was one of 13 but so what?

Childbirth was a risky business for women, if if you’re not Caucasian then the risks in the West are still too high. Elsewhere the statistics make for grim reading.

Women aren’t being weak or snowflakes, do some research into childbirth through the ages. What our forebears endured was quite horrific and dangerous. And in all too many cases fatal for mother and child.

I don’t get the attitude of ‘well I wouldn’t want that so other women shouldn’t get to choose it!’ Isn’t the whole point of choice and options the fact we aren’t all going to pick the same things..

@bigyellowTpot my grandmother was one of 13 but so what? They were lucky to survive such big families.

Childbirth was a risky business for women, in the UK if you’re not Caucasian then the risks in the West are still too high. Elsewhere the statistics make for grim reading.

Women aren’t being weak or snowflakes, please do some research into childbirth through the ages. What our forebears endured was quite horrific and dangerous. And in all too many cases fatal for mother and child.

@bigyellowTpot so your body wasn’t able to do what it’s supposed to do naturally so you couldn’t have a natural birth with either of your children - but all women should have a natural birth as it’s what their bodies do naturally. Ok then. Thanks for your valuable contribution to the thread 😂😂😂

Since the day I told people I was pregnant everyone feels they have some right to tell you what to do, how to feel, what you shouldn't be doing. It drives me crazy still now 8 months pp. Just block out the noise. You know your mind & body. Do what is right for you.

People shouldn't judge you on how you want to have your baby!!

You literally asked for people's opinions, then argue with people for explaining. So why exactly did you ask?

I blame the ‘too posh to push’ brigade. Celebrities getting nip and tucks at the same time caused a stigma almost. Sections can be highly dangerous in some circumstances, had 3 emergency sections and that is only my personal experience. Do what suits best and ignore others

Media stigmatising it i mean

Just don't tell. Nobody needs to know. And I would never judge you for that. You gave birth. It's a miracle. All the best OP.

Had 2 EMC's and the recovery was brutal and the operation I was throwing up flat on my back and forcing myself to stay awake. Numb up to my neck no golden hour no holding baby either time for about 3 hours til I came round enough
Appreciate these aren't elective but the operation is the same. It's not the easy was out

@bigyellowTpot it’s not fear of the unknown. It’s fear of the known. The OP has done her research. The long term health issues of a third or fourth degree tear are horrifying and people do not give a shit about women’s health issues, so you’re on your own.

the day of my natural birth I was told everything I said and felt was wrong. So I was left to Labour and they all got a shock when it turned out I was right and the very large baby had come quickly. Because they wouldn’t believe me or support me through the labour, I was left with a third degree tear. Because of other labour emergencies going on, I was left for 5 hours before they stitched me up. They don’t care about my prolapse or lack of sensation. I am classed as a fully recovered case. Compared to my friends, I am! One has horrendous incontinence issues that affect her relationship and sex life. Another was left labouring too long and had nerve damage and could walk for 6 months after. Why on earth would I put myself through that again? Why should any woman risk it if they don’t want to.

OP I had a ECS for my second and have one booked in for Friday. It was great! I mean, major surgery is never fun but it was so much calmer. I think it was the psychological recovery that made all the difference. My Mum tore strips off me for being honest about my birthing experience after my first. Said you don’t talk about it and I was blamed for traumatising my sister who wasn’t even pregnant. People are weird about birth. It’s so fucked up were meant to keep it secret. My sister recently had her first and had an ELC. She found it an amazing experience. She recovered physically and mentally from it a lot quicker than her friends and NCT group.

I opted for a elective section with my second after a bad vaginal birth with my first (with a third degree tear). Best decision I’ve ever made. It was wonderful. Recovery was a piece of piss compared to my first birth. Cost to the NHS was a snip compared to my first birth. I’ve very few regrets in life but not asking for a planned section with my first is one of them.

Anyway OP I hope your surgery went well and that you’re enjoying your lovely baby.

@FunDragon same. I had my ELCS 5 weeks ago and, touch wood, it was an easier recovery. I’d say much much easier, but don’t want to speak too soon, as I haven’t tried lifting heavy things just yet. Don’t get me wrong, it was very painful for the first week, but doable with painkillers, and it improved very quickly. After my vaginal birth I was in pain and still carting around a gutter cushion to sit on for 3 whole months. Also, no end of associated issues, some not completely resolved to this day - bladder, pelvic floor, back etc

My grandmother was left with life changing injuries after her vaginal birth, which blighted her marriage, meant she could never carry a child again, and meant she had to have several traumatic abortions.I guess her body didn’t get the memo that “it was made to do this”. Spoiler alert - it wasn’t. Our bodies have evolved away from easy births and towards higher intelligence. Which in turn has facilitated the medical advances that make births easier and safer again.

If anyone who disapproves of c-sections would like to dare call me selfish or whatever, please go ahead. We can fit you with a plate across your pelvis too and then make you give birth naturally, with a pelvis that no longer moves for the baby. No drugs either, you know, got to be all natural. 😁I'm sure once you're screaming in pain because the baby can't fit through without breaking you in half will soon change your mind.

Some of us literally can't have a baby without a C-section. It would be too dangerous. I'm not interested in their opinions, because if they had to go through the above or choose a C-section, they'd choose the c-section. Because trust me, you don't want to go through a pelvic break. You just don't.

People should stop being so judgemental. It's got nothing to do with you, and if you prefer to put yourself through traumatic pain, go right ahead. I've done it accidentally far too often, I know the pain levels, the rehab, the constant pain afterwards. I'll take the 'easy way out' thanks.

Each to their own what ever suits you. No one knows what kind of birth they are going to have. My only issue is when people say a women has the right to choose. Its just the NHS trying to save money. This is not possible, there would never be enough staff or theatres to let every pregnant women have a c section. And the NHS does not have a bottomless pit of money.

I've had my ELCS now (I posted when this thread first was active saying I was going to be having one soon) and it was wonderful. I am 3 weeks PP and feel like I haven't even had surgery! I was back driving at 10 days, stopped pain relief after about five days (and that was just diclofenac and paracetamol) and am fully active and out and about with both DDs at classes and activities. I don't know if it's been so easy cos it's my second section or just because electives are so much easier on the body than emergency ones, but I've been amazed by how quickly I felt normal.

The actual section was lovely, very calm, music playing, lots of chatting, lovely pics of us all, and I was home 24 hours later.

Obviously this is just my experience but I am so glad I opted for that over a VBAC. Maybe the latter would have gone great too, but I feel great after my ELCS so I'm happy with my decision.