To ask why having an elective C-Section is so frowned upon?

[Rosesandbutterflys]

I am (hopefully) having an elective C-Section soon. First baby, don't want anymore children after.

I've always had a fear of child birth, which over the past 5 years has been compounded by a lot of people around me having children and the vast majority of these (though I appreciate I'm probably unlucky here) have been pretty traumatic births that have ended in severe tears, forceps and a lot of the time, an emergency section anyway. Granted their experiences have mostly been better on their second birth/ child.

Nothing and I truly mean nothing about natural childbirth/ labour appeals to me. Not the hours of pain, pushing, potential rips/ tears, forcep intervention, epidural (yes I appreciate I'd have one of these for a section), damage of my pelvic floor and the panic and stress of potentially having to be rushed to theatre because it just wasn't going to happen naturally and the baby is in distress or whatever.

Now don't get me wrong, nothing about a c-section appeals to me either, it's absolutely no walk in the park and I'm dreading it, but it has to come out some way and I am a person that likes to plan things and to somewhat be in control/ aware of the plan. I have also had abdominal surgery before (though not as severe as a C-section) and I know recovery is likely to be painful and slower than if I were to have a natural birth. But for me, this is the preferred/ lesser of the 2 evils option.

I have also spent hours pouring over research as to the benefits of a vaginal birth over a c-section and last night came across a NICE/ NHS study/ research that found that actually, for a planned/ elective c-section, the risk to the mother of a c-section compared to a vaginal birth is pretty much the same. It states that the risk of the baby ending up in NICU with a C-section is 13.9% compared to a vaginal birth which is 6.3%, so double the risk, BUT it says the research does not take into account the fact that most c-sections undertaken are for medical reasons and therefore the likelihood of the baby needing NICU attention after it's born is increased anyway.

It then went on to say that the risks of an unplanned, emergency C-Section are a lot higher than a natural birth/ elective/ planned C-Section. So I guess if each woman was guaranteed to have a straightforward, natural birth, then great, but a lot of women do end up needing an emergency c-section so, technically they are more at risk than someone who has chosen an elective.

This now seems like I am bashing natural delivery and I'm not at all I totally admire and respect women that chose that route, I only wish I were that brave.

However, the responses I have had from people my whole pregnancy when I have admitted I am opting for an elective C-section have been ridiculous. Not one person has responded positively, all I've had is 'Oh, really? Are you sure??' and 'Oh, why on earth would you elect to have that?' etc etc. Or just a stony faced, tight smile and 'oh right' making it clear they disapprove but not actually coming out and saying it.

I got told last night that the reason I'm getting these reactions is because a C-section is 'taking the easy way out '😕

If that's the case, why on earth wouldn't you? Why is it that it seems the prerequisite to being a good mother is seemingly having to martyr yourself all the time?

So many of my friends that have had children and also the women in my NCT class who are preparing for their births have all expressed dismay/ distress at having to have any pain relief, they all want it to be as natural as possible and I know my friends that haven't had 'textbook' births still harbour 'guilt' and sadness to this day. Why? If you need gas and air or an epidural, so what? What exactly am I missing? If they ended/end up with forceps or an emergency section, it's not their fault, it's just one of those things. Surely modern medicine has provided these things to make childbirth safer?

Anyway, gone off on a tangent now but if you disapprove of someone having an elective c-section, could you tell me why?

To answer why it's because childbirth seems to be the one of the few things where we are stuck in the 1900s with attitude! So many women had been traumatised by their own experience that it's almost why did I have to do that if I knew I had more choice......
Only after major surgery for childbirth are women expected not only to be up and about as quick as possible but also to care for a tiny human.
Reality is though that they can't fit in the number of births if everyone realised they had the choice for a c sections due to greater number of staff and some like the anaesthetist being in short supply plus the time then in hospital after. My trust aims to discharge straight forward births in 6 hours for instance which having given birth is a little bit too quick to make sure everything is OK.

To me birth is a baby entering the world regardless and I've had vaginal births, I used the water as I know that's an effective pain relief for me!
The number of times I have been told I had the dream birth or I'm a super mum for it is ridiculous, answer is neither its just what was best for me! If I didn't live up a steep hill and would be housebound during recovery I would have opted for c section!

@Eggshelly says it well - elective just means it’s planned. There could be a whole host of reasons for that.

In my case, I had requested an ELCS (maternal request) for various reasons. Consultant agreed straight away at first antenatal appt. As it happened, I had placenta previa so needed an elective anyway however DS decided to join us 6 week early so ended up with an EMCS and he was delivered very swiftly after that decision had been made.

You have a right to request an elective and they are obliged to perform one (check out the NICE guidelines on this); you may have to keep telling your consultant the same message as they will keep asking you if you’re sure from a cost cutting perspective but they will do one.

How you birth your child is no one else’s business than your own.

OP I had an emcs with ds1 after getting all the way to the end of labour (pushing for two hours after TWO days of labour) and the recovery was really tough. I was definitely treated differently on the ward after by the midwives, I was there for 5 days and had quite a lot of direct shitty comments as well as lots of 'oh, I see you failed with your labour' whilst looking at my notes. It took me atleast a year to get over it as I honestly was left feeling like I'd failed. My DH was beyond furious as he couldn't understand the behaviour after he had watched me go through absolute hell, and we could've lost my son. I absolutely resent every single person that made me feel that way.

Second pregnancy I had a consultant who suggested we go over every element of the labour before deciding a birth plan, so what went wrong, why we ended up with an elcs. I went in open minded trying to be realistic about whether a vbac was an option. But when I went through what had happened I absolutely broke down. We went for an elcs. The difference was day and night tbh. I was booked in, surgery happened and I was sent home next day. I was so determined to get in and get out and just focus on me and my baby I ignored everything that came out of the midwives and health visitor's mouths. Was re best decision I made. I felt stronger and was up and about so much quicker.
I am now pregnant with #3 and although a vbac isn't actually an option for me now there is NO WAY I would opt for anything but an elective section, I would not risk an emergency section in any circumstance.

It doesn't explain the stupid thinking that a section is easier, as its not. The recovery is tough. But for me being in control of the second time was much much better. It sounds like you are in the same boat in that you think you can manage the section as opposed to the uncertainty of 'natural labour'. So my advice is just to focus on what is important - you and the baby.

Goodluck OP 🙂

I echo this. Had a traumatic 'natural' delivery for my first (ending in surgery for me and a lot of stress for my baby) - sadly one of the worst times of my life - then two elective sections which were peaceful, joyful experiences, and resulted in calm, happy babies. Would choose a section without hesitation if I were able to go back in time.

I had two "elective" sections. The first wasn't really elective, I had a breech baby and a failed ECV and was told.to.come back 5 days later for a section. At the time I was bricking it but it was an amazing experience, so calm, no pain! The recovery does take a little longer and there was definitely some discomfort the following day but I dont think it compared to the pain from contractions (never actually had one to compare though). The worst part for me was having the canula put in my hand!
With my second baby I had the choice and I went for the repeat section. I can honestly say i have no regrets. Both babies breastfed without any issues, I recovered well both times.
Every birth is different, i know I was lucky to have no complications at all and that doesn't mean every elective section will be drama free but there's absolutely not once single ounce of shame or regret about making that choice.
Stop feeling guilty, stop worrying about what other people think. It's your body and your baby so it's really nobody else's business.

@Rosesandbutterflys I'm not against c-sections because at the end of the day you should do what is best for you and your family. That being said I was told I was going to have one with my now 5 year old and their reasoning was because I was overweight (didn't offer me any form of help in trying to lose weight even though I asked for it mind you). I didn't want one because firstly I was going to be homeless as soon as I gave birth to them due to a clause in my tenancy agreement, secondly I would have had no one to support me with my recovery and thirdly I get benign tumours from scar tissue. So I fought tooth and nail for a normal birth because its what suited me. I know that it's probably hard but just ignore the naysayers and the negative comments/looks. You are doing what is best for your situation. 'normal' births are not always traumatic so I would say that you have just been unlucky in that respect. I had a normal birth with all of mine and all of them except one were born within 3 hours of the first contraction. My youngest I was in slow labour for 92 hours and I have now sworn off having any more children. 😂 I was also lucky enough to have a waterbirth with my second child which was so amazing

Absolute rubbish.
We have an elective team: surgeon, anaesthetist, ODP, scrub nurse and runner in theatre.

No consultant aneasthetists are removed from emergency surgery to carry out electives.

OP it is absolutely your choice and tbh after 30 years in midwifery I would never judge any woman for planning to have a planned caesarean.

I like to refer to it as a caesarean birth. Your body your choice and nobody else's business.

I was discussing my maternal request c section with my dad recently (a retired GP), it was classed maternal request because my age wasn’t considered a medical reason, despite the increased risks associated with vaginal birth. Anyway my dad surprised me by saying that if I hadn’t chosen a c section off my own bat he would have been strongly recommending to me that I have one and that any woman over 35 should be seriously considering it.

Any FTM over 35 I should have said

first pregnancy ended in an EMCS. Second pregnancy was a natural birth, gas & air only. I’d take the natural birth any day. It’s bloody hard having to look after a newborn when you’ve just had major abdominal surgery. But, that said - that’s my experience and I don’t knock anyone else who chooses an elective section. Your body, your choice. Best of luck OP. :)

If a friend said to me they were having an elective CS for their first child, I'd probably react very similarly to the ones you ve already recieved.
However, it would not in any way be because I thought it was the 'easy way out', quite to opposite in fact. I personally can't understand why someone would put themselves through surgery when it's something that most female bodies are able to do to naturally if its not medically needed.
I've had 3 vaginally births and knowing I can get straight up and walk around etc made a big difference. A CS was genuinely one of my biggest fears. My mum had CS's on both myself and my much younger sister, so I did see what she went through.
If you do decide to keep discussing it with people, maybe ask them why they're reacting the way they are, it might surprise you.
Other than that, just don't tell anyone. Your body, your birth, your baby 🤷‍♀️

I had a planned c-section, it was great. I don’t feel the least bit bad about it. Every single one of the women in my family had horrific births. There is no badge or award you get for the suffering, if you want to do have a natural birth go for it. If you don’t want one but are being shamed into it then ignore and do what you want.

also I wonder what the cost of treating birth injuries over a womans lifetime are or when they have been turned down for one and complications have led to children leading lifetime medical assistance.

www.cmaj.ca/content/193/18/E634

thats a study on low risk elective c-sections vs vaginal delivery. It suggests adverse outcomes were lower in planned c-sections vs planned vaginal delivery. When I was pregnant there were few studies which parsed out emergency c-sections and medically necessary c-sections from elective so it was hard to tell which option was a better choice.

Also it is not normal to expect new mums to get up immediately and look after a baby. The country I gave birth in assumes you will give breastfeeding a go but otherwise You are expected to be resting and recovering for a few days, eating, walking and breastfeeding. I didn’t change a nappy till DD was 5 days old (first nurses did them and then DH).

People asked me all the time about what I was thinking in regards to labour and if I was going to bottle feed.

Terrible labour with my first and a C section with my 2nd.

Both were horrible in different ways, to be honest I would have much rather had them the other way round. But you heal and get over it and now I can't wait to have a 3rd and don't care how it comes out 🙈.

Good luck and keep a strong head when it comes to your choices, people love to judge and make comments (I'm no different) but I do try to put my self in the lersons shoes and if I were in your shoes with those fears I think a c section is the way to go.

Actually the only problem I have is how my body looks after the Csection, that doesn't happen with a VB. I hate it!

Your body, your choice! I had a planned section with my boy. It was due to the fact that I had a brain hemorrhage 10 years ago and my OB did not want to take the risk of me going into natural labour. I recovered remarkably well, best advice was to get up and walk as much as you can. It helps the healing process. Either way there is no such thing as an easy way out, do whatever you feel comfortable with and to hell with everyone else!!

This!

There is bizarre snobbery around c sections. It is frowned upon because it is more expensive to the NHS. As you have discovered risk factors are pretty.much the same. My first son I too begged for a section. Refused and ended up emergency section and he had brain damage. Thankyou nhs. 2nd son was elective and fabulous radio on. Calm and peaceful. I recovered well and quickly.from both...I think moving Is beneficial and not resting all the time. I had no choice but to move with both of mine and actually think it helped my quick recovery. Ignore others. Do what is best for you natural childbirth pfft I recently broke my leg and had op. No way would I let my body heal it alone as it knows what to do. Rubbish. Great if that's what you want. If you don't...that is what modern medical science does. Good luck to you x

I had 3 babies all natural deliveries. My sister had 3 sections, 2 non-elective and one elective. I would have a natural any day of the week over a caesarean purely because I don’t see having a C-section as the easy way out at all. Not one bit! My sister endured pain for an extended period after each of hers. Sore etc whereas despite stitches/grazes etc I was able to be up and moving and home within a day. This is purely my outlook. Everyone is different. My sister saw me give birth to my second child and said she was glad to have had 3 sections as she wouldn’t be cut out for pushing the baby out 😆 You see…we’re all different and what someone else would do (including me) is 100% irrelevant to your situation. If it’s right for you, don’t be swayed by other people opinions. Because a C-section is most definitely not the easy way out!

Given the choice again, having had a backache first labour ending with a botched high forceps with lasting repercussions, I'd definitely choose a caesarean. Second and third backache labours were nasty, but due to the internal damage from the 1st delivery, they were mercifully shorter.

Your body your choice. I tell you now, if I had my time again, I would have done the same as giving birth is absolutely horrific. I had an extremely traumatic birth and I’m still suffering nearly 2 years later. Every woman has the right to choose how they birth and if that’s a c-section then so be it. But they don’t mention this as it’s quite a big expense to the NHS. You be proud of your choice and don’t let anyone make you feel ashamed about it. I don’t get the whole martyr thing either. Safe, trauma free and limited pain all the way!

I haven't read every ones posts but here's my story. I developed pre eclampsia going into eclampsia with baby 1. Was induced at 35 weeks after being in icu for a week to force the hand of the hospital to bring on additional nicu staff to save my baby's life. Baby turned sideways at 8cm with both head and feet down. Emergency section was had. Everyone was miraculously fine. Second pregnancy under advisement. Same thing started to happen. Was hell bent on going natural but not a single thing would dislodge no 2 from his comfy spot. I was given an elective section (even though i didn't want it) and wasn't allowed to be induced. Ended up with pnd and didn't bond with my child in the same way i did with no 1. Recovery from section was hell compared to no 1. You need to do what is right for you but the only thing i would say is ask them to induce you first - in my opinion this was the difference for me. My body didn't realise no 2 had left the office so didn't do what it should have done hormone wise. Would love to do research into instances of pnd in births without labour but that's just me! Good luck whatever you chose to do and congratulations!

The only thing i could say is - people say it is the NHS saving money - but if we were all to have c-sections how would that work - dont think there would be enough staff and operating theaters to accommodate this. So i dont think it is very feasable for every one that wants one to have an elective c section.

Many hospitals have a pretty straightforward policy of women being able to choose a c-section if they want one, and they have managed. It’s worth remembering not all women will choose to have one as we all have different preferences as well as different personal risk factors.

a lot of UK hospitals already have a 1 in 3 c-section rate, the majority being emergency sections. Women choosing an elective c-section will not being needing lengthy inductions lasting days and all the additional care/staff/bed space that entails, as mentioned many of the women choosing a c-section would have needed to have one anyway. Women opting for C-section would have needed care for giving birth anyway.

I’ve had two very different births, first was very medical, 25 hours start to finish had epidural and ended up in theatre for ventouse. Second first was all “natural”, very fast and ended up in a bad tear. I’ve not had an epidural but that’s on the cards for my third. I was hellbent on all natural for my second without epidural and I have to say it bloody hurt I dunno why I was so adamant about no pain relief 😅 Do what works for you, sod everyone’s opinions! X

You do you. I thought I was going to have a vaginal birth. Discussed it all with DH about what stated I might want drugs etc. DD was late! Called hospital on day 6 and day 10. By day 12 they asked me to come in and induced me.

I started off well, not a lot of pain but uncomfortable. About 8 hours later I was in agony. I demanded an epidural and was told to ‘calm down’ as I was only 4CM. A scan was performed and next thing I know I’m being wheeled in for EMCS. Turns out I had placenta eruption. The surgeons were brilliant, saved me and DS. The maternity staff were horrible. All of them. It put me off having another child for life.

Post surgery I didn’t feel too much discomfort. I had my mum to look after me and that helped. I was moving around and walking by about a week, albeit slowly but I felt better when I was moving.

had I had the courage to have another child I would definitely have done elective. I loved being pregnant but the birth just traumatised me and even 11 years later I remember it like it was yesterday and all those feelings come back.

hope it all goes well for you and don’t let anyone make you feel any less.