Are we taking bets yet on when mass civil unrest will begin re. Cost of living?

[UsernameInTheTown]

Having frozen my backside off these past two days as I'm terrified to have the heating on longer than an hour a day, I'm thinking that this will be utterly intolerable come next Winter. Will there be mass civil unrest and the guillotine rolled out while the affluent are targeted by the desperate and those with nothing left to loose?

It may get better by winter. Certainly the fuel crisis is due to sharp increase in demand which may level off with some increased supply especially if the war in Ukraine is resolved. But we will see. I don’t really want riots or things to get worse.

@Thisisconfusing

And I genuinely don’t know why anyone would still vote Tory after what has been done since 2019 ( and before ) . It is all very well people saying that Labour would do no better but that really isn’t a good reason for voting yet again for the Tories. By re-electing them you are basically reinforcing the idea that is doesn’t matter what they do to the general public you will still vote for them. And frankly they haven’t delivered on so many promises just why would anyone vote for more of the same.

Labour need to figure out why and do something about it. Because there's no point in them losing and blaming people for not voting for them. It's their job to win elections, and if they can't do that, they aren't fit for purpose.

@MajorCarolDanvers

It won't happen

In all of history the British have never opted for mass civil unrest.

Factually incorrect.

Tbf, no mass civil unrest is really the entire nation, pretty much ever. But, in terms of large-scale, as in serious unrest?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peasants%27_Revolt

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornish_rebellion_of_1497

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_May_Day

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prayer_Book_Rebellion

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kett%27s_Rebellion

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilgrimage_of_Grace

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1715_England_riots

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1766_food_riots

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1775_Liverpool_Seamen%27s_revolt

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Riots

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1831_Bristol_riots

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1835_Wolverhampton_riot

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1842_general_strike

I got bored so I stopped. There are plenty (though fewer) in the late 19th and early 20th century as well, not to mention serious unrest and rioting in the 80s.

Which is not to say that I think it will happen or even that it should happen. But it has happened before.

I hope people show up to the ballot box.

@Oblomov22

No. No riots. No demonstrations. We'll just get on with it. What choice do we have?

To never fucking vote Tory again.

How would changing parties suddenly make everything different ? Especially when they get lobbied ect via the same groups ect regardless of who's in power

@Nancydrawn

These days, those events are history, especially with the internet and tv to keep the population distracted etc, you may get some groups, but could a whole or almost whole country wide protest be ever achieved ?

Labour need to figure out why and do something about it. Because there's no point in them losing and blaming people for not voting for them. It's their job to win elections, and if they can't do that, they aren't fit for purpose

The entire print media being owned and controlled by Tory backers, and therefore entirely geared toward smearing Labour politicians and policies is a significant hurdle which Labour genuinely can't do much in the way of anything about.

It's become increasingly apparent over the previous two GE that the Conservatives are fully onboard with US style smear-campaigns where you say absolutely nothing about yourself, lest the public gain some inkling of how odious and vacuous you actually are, and dedicate the entirety of your efforts towards smearing and slandering your opponent instead.

It's unfortunate that in the UK a significant number of people still read newspapers and take them on face value as publications that merely report news, rather than seeing them for the biased propaganda mouthpieces that they are. Thankfully print media circulations are in an inevitable death-spiral, but until the print versions or rags like the Mail, Express, Torygraph, Times etc finally expire, it's not a battleground that Labour can fight on with anything like an equal footing.

The last two Tory PM's have both fought an election campaign where they did their level best to be completely invisible and unchallengeable throughout, and both came away with a material victory. I don't see the Tories changing tack for 2024, and no doubt utterly useless clowns like the BBC political lot will stand by and watch it happen yet again. This is going to be the way of it with the Tories from here on in, i.e. never mind about us, just how awful are Labour? and the UK public will lap it up time after time and continue to be the turkeys that vote for christmas.

People don't riot over £700 quid a year extra. Get real. It's not that bad.

[quote Narwhalelife]@newyearnewwname2022 same!! And the price of bread thing goes wayyyyy back!

I dunno though, the tories seem to be making themselves unpopular on purpose (surely) and people are getting desperate. In my job I have a lot of conversations with jo public and the tides are turning even for people that defended the tories before[/quote]
I remember Edward Heath campaigning in 1970 by telling the people that if they voted Labour they would see the 3 shilling loaf.

I can guarantee that half the people on this thread advocating riots and / or civil disobedience won’t be anywhere remotely near it if it does happen. The closest they’ll get is voting YANBU in an ‘AIBU to support the riots?’ thread.

[quote Hawkins001]@Nancydrawn

These days, those events are history, especially with the internet and tv to keep the population distracted etc, you may get some groups, but could a whole or almost whole country wide protest be ever achieved ?[/quote]
I think that's a fair point. I would also note that most of those riots and rebellions I listed were counter-productive, insofar as they tended to alienate the middle, who then aligned with the authorities in a reaction against violence. There are relatively few long-lived rebellions in history, and even fewer that truly subverted the social order; when they succeed, it's often because they align with the interests of some section of those in authority, who encourage them.

That doesn't mean they're pointless, or that no rebellions ever work. Interestingly, those that enforce social norms tend to work better than those that subvert them. And those that can capture the support of the middle, often in peaceful terms, tend to do best.

I was just reacting to the idea that "In all of history the British have never opted for mass civil unrest."

(In terms of the idea of mass, I'll say that even things we tend to think about as "mass" unrest are usually a voluble minority, or a majority in a limited area.)

(My father is very fond of history and I had to listen to his discussions on this quite a bit when I was young.)

@Nancydrawn

Intriguing points to consider, much appreciated

We are stuck with the Tories for the foreseeable future. People have short memories.
The tories will cut tax in the General election year and throw in a few monetary sweeteners and they will get re-elected.
The right-wing papers will make Labour seem even more unelectable through smear campaigns. TBH though Labour doesn't need much help in that which is frustrating as hell
Labour can't win votes in Scotland, without those votes it's difficult to get enough seats because the south bar London usually votes Tory, Wales is watered down by Plaid Cymru and unless Labour can swing a load of Tory seats in the south then I doubt it will happen.
Until their core voters start to suffer then they will still vote for a donkey wearing a blue rosette.
The tories know this, it's why they never target pensioners. They kept the triple lock and the national insurance hike won't affect their pensions.

When people don't have bread, circuses Netflix and internet won't be enough.

We need some civil disobedience, walk outs, strikes, riots won't work. Rolling mass walkouts of essential services, public transport, civil service, bring the country to a standstill, it is the only way, unions need to find their balls & call members out. It needs to be coordinated to have the biggest impact.

@Livelovebehappy you are, to put it politely, delusional!

There is NO safety net any more, you can owe the DWP money before you’ve even received a penny due to punitive sanctions, and it’s perfectly acceptable in this torie ‘only the rich matter’ world for people to starve / freeze to death. And it already is happening, and the government don’t give a damn, they just make matter worse!

There is no point in rioting. When masses of people go out on the streets to demonstrate about all the issues, you will always get certain types of angry people, who will really Riot in the true sense of the word, and who set fire to cars, smash windows in shops, set fire to things all over the place, fight with the police, and chain themselves to things.. and superglue themselves to NO.10 Downing Street.

Well there was so much public support for lockdowns, wasn’t there? Looks like Covid will kill fewer people that that the inflationary pressures brought about by the crazy restrictions.

@notwhatineednow

With respect you haven’t answered what labour would do to change things today if they were put in power, which would make a significant difference to the average person.

And based on the state of the economy, where they would get the funds to pay for it?

It’s easy to promise people more money and a better quality of life and to blame the government when you are the opposition but another thing to actually change things in reality. I just can’t take labour seriously, as they make out that they will stop poverty for example and other outrageous promises which would be great in reality, but don’t back that up with practical ways of funding it. The windfall tax would be a drop in the ocean for example and not a good idea in the long term if we want those companies to invest in renewables.

I feel that all parties should not be able to make promises and policies that they cannot keep and should be legally bound to stick to their manifesto. That may make them more realistic, not pie in the sky. That would enable the electorate to make a more informed choice without being hoodwinked with false promises. Then I would have more respect and interest in politics.

You can’t really compare 1997 to now as we hadn’t just had a global pandemic and before that a recession and forced austerity measures, and Tony Blair led us into wars which depleted our monetary reserves, so he was hardly a great example.

You must live in cloud cuckoo land if you think labour would be any different to the tories without bankrupting us in the process or opening the doors for cheap labour from the rest of the world which is very much a short term solution.

It needs long term planning which neither party is capable of or interested in it seems......

@Libertaire

This is Britain. We don’t do ‘mass civil unrest’. We leave that sort of thing to the French, who are actually prepared to stand up to their rulers, rather than just complaining about them. We just moan about how badly the country is run, then go out and re-elect the Tories.

Best post ever ! And true

@Cyw2018 I didn't know that re. Protesting effecting certain jobs/DBS checks.

The next elections being 2 years away make the voting thing (if there were a party to vote for!) unviable. The effects will have already well and truly have been felt by then.

I don’t think there’s will be. People voted for this and will continue to do so. The gap between the elite in society just seems to be widening and people keep voting for Boris and his buffoons. I honestly despair!

@prettyLittlefool

People don't riot over £700 quid a year extra. Get real. It's not that bad.

You haven't got a fucking clue, have you.