To think this is not a good excuse re: school toilets

[SummerDays2020]

I was at a PTA meeting last week. The school toilets were being discussed. I mentioned that my Y5 DD had said that the boys and girls had to share their toilets and that I didn't think it was appropriate at that age. I was told it was true but 'it was the way things were going, nowadays'. Well, that may be true but I still don't think it is appropriate.

Should I push further or is it acceptable nowadays that boys and girls of 9/10 years old should be expected to share toilets?

I’d push it further if I was you.
Why on earth would this be necessary.
I just checked with my DD (9) and she was horrified at the thought of sharing with boys!!!

Nope, it's not true and it's against the law:

safeschoolsallianceuk.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/singlesextoiletsfactsheet.pdf

What are the arrangements for girls with periods?

YADNBU. So many stories of girls not drinking properly so they don’t have to use unisex facilities.
I imagine it would make boys feel uncomfortable too.

@Aroundtheworldin80moves

What are the arrangements for girls with periods?

In my experience of a school that did this, each toilet cubicle had a sanitary bin so the girls didn’t have to wait for a particular toilet to become free. I think each cubicle had a sink in too, but I might be wrong.

It's against the law. My daughters school tried it, I sent an email and they had girls toilets back up in a week. The school is probably just trying to cut corners due to budget and if you challenge them they will fold. My daughters school has male, female and unisex toilets so everyone has a toilet to use that they feel comfortable with

I don't have so much of an issue with shared toilets if they are single cubicle with a lockable door. That does seem a sensible arrangement to stop bullying etc. Where I have an issue is that the smaller primary schools cannot justify the expense of then having a sanitary bin in each toilet cubicle and so girls on their period have to wait for 1 cubicle in the block - which makes it obvious what is happening to anyone who wants to make a thing of it. These girls then also generally have to out into the main area to wash their hands again difficult if they've had to do a clean up.

Some girls can have periods aged 10 can’t they? They shouldn’t lose their protected space.

Completely illegal. Maybe point that out to them.

No way ! At that age that's too young to share

I cannot imagine DC sharing a toilet area. Just awful. I don’t see the cost of maintaining two sets of toilets is excessive and most heads would not see closing toilets as a possible saving. Ditto bins.

Absolutely push it
Even if it is the ‘norm’ they ‘norm’ should be challenged

Thank you, as I thought. My DD doesn't use the toilets as is uncomfortable with sharing. She also finds them dirty. This leads to many walks home from school with her desperate for the toilet!

Thank you for the information. It is a large school and they have different toilets for different year groups which are near their classrooms.

The school has probably had Stonewall 'training' or similar.

It's not on. Make a fuss for your DD's sake.

[quote Clymene]Nope, it's not true and it's against the law:

safeschoolsallianceuk.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/singlesextoiletsfactsheet.pdf[/quote]
Safe Schools Alliance are not a reliable source on the law, they've been called out for giving inaccurate advice to schools on multiple occasions. They're an anti-trans lobby group and claim the law is what they think it should be, not what it actually is.

@Whatsnewpussyhat

The school has probably had Stonewall 'training' or similar.

It's not on. Make a fuss for your DD's sake.

Stonewall don't and never have pushed for schools to only have gender neutral toilets.

and claim the law is what they think it should be, not what it actually is

😂😂😂😂

Literally what Stonewall does.

Stonewall tells schools they should let male children with a 'gender identity' use the female toilets and changing rooms, thus making them mixed sex and discriminating against the female pupils on the basis of their sex by removing their single sex facilities.

OP, YANBU.

I would take what @SevenWaystoLeave says with a large pinch of salt. SSAUK are not anti trans, I'd like to see evidence of that. In addition, the link between Stonewall and the suggestion of gender neutral toilets is very possible - see here: www.transgendertrend.com/stonewall-school-champion/

The government guidance, as quoted in the SSAUK factsheet, in this area is very clear, the source document is here - see page 5 in particular:

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/410294/Advice_on_standards_for_school_premises.pdf

So please, OP do push further, mixed sex toilets are not a good idea over the age of 8.

Primary head here. Have never considered it so can't advise on the legality but ..... I can't see that it would be in the remit of the PTA anyway. Please address your concerns to the head not the PTA

I'd be making a fuss about that - it's completely unacceptable.

DD's school has unisex toilets, but they are individual cubicles that lock and open out onto the corridor. A bit like accessible toilets tend to be - the toilet, sink and dryer are all in the room. They all have handrails and a couple are wide enough for wheelchairs.
There's not quite enough of them, but they're decent

Can you give me any evidence for that statement @SevenWaystoLeave?

Mixed sex facilities are fine provided plenty of adequate single sex facilities also exist. For example, a school may have a unisex visitor loo by a staffed reception area that children who feel unable to use the regular facilities for their sex can use. This means the majority may continue as normal.

I have just last week received the keys for a brand new purpose built school.

All the toilets (staff and students) are unisex. All individual cubicles, complete with wash basin and sanitary bin. All open directly into the corridor, so there's no "communal" area where you'd usually have sinks and bullying. It seems like an improvement in very many ways.

My worry is that each cublice has one of those locks you can open from outside with a screwdriver (or coin) and I do wonder how long it will be before some poor child (or adult) gets the door opened as a "joke" while on the loo. But there does need to be a way to open from outside in an emergency.

@Silverclocks, so the women and girls will be targeted with sudden open doors as they need to sit down and will be powerless to stop it, all to be 'inclusive' and kind.

Not progress in my eyes.

I also agree with PP that this is not a question for the PTA