Will Smith/Chris Rock Oscars - where do you stand?

[Jaggerdagger]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/entertainment-arts-60898250

I'm a bit on the fence at the moment but shocked from watching this - wondered what others think?

YABU Will Smith had every right to wallop Chris. His wife was clearly deeply insulted. He deserved it.
YANBU Chris was just reading from a script and didn't deserve such a public assault.

I’m 48 and didn’t realise it was a movie reference - but knew exactly what he was getting at.

Because all soldiers (GIs) are given buzz cuts, or induction cuts when they enter the army. Especially in the US.

You don’t have to have the first clue about the movie, to understand the dig he was making - especially in the US.

And how is Jada Pinkett Smith more rich and powerful than Chris Rock?

[quote AryaStarkWolf]@CatsAreBoppinAroundToTheRadio definitely take your points about black women however I think Will could have dealt with it and come out looking like the good guy had he commented on it later. It would have been much more powerful and well received had he mentioned the joke in his Oscar acceptance speech instead for example[/quote]
He didn't know he'd won, didn't know he'd be making an acceptance speech. Hindsight is so powerful.

I suffer with Alopecia Areata.

Personally I didn’t think the joke was super offensive. At least I wouldn’t have been offended by it. If I end up having to shave my head from this shitty disease, I could think of worse things than being compared to GI Jane (strong, positive female? Fine by me)

Will Smith was bang out of line.
And as others have said, he was laughing at the joke himself until he saw Jada’s ‘face’.

As for Jada, I used to like her. I haven’t been keen on her for a while now however. She seems to have no qualms about humiliating her husband.

She also said in a video she made that she wasn’t bothered about people’s comments about her hair. Clearly she’s changed her mind

Will could’ve reacted any other way but the way he did. This could’ve even been used for a moment of education around alopecia. But instead it overshadowed the entire night.

Ludicrous reaction. And completely out of character for Will Smith. Which makes me wonder if he’s suffering with some mental health issues to be honest.

@mustlovegin

In case there was any confusion, alopecia is absolutely a disability

Alopecia is usually a very distressing condition, but it's not a disability

I also wondered about that when I read that line from Guardian article that you picked up on, as I had never heard of alopecia being a disability.

I've just done a quick google and it's not a disability in the UK and it doesn't seem to be in the USA either. Although I looked at the article I quoted from again:

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/mar/29/white-outrage-about-will-smiths-slap-is-rooted-in-anti-blackness-its-inequality-in-plain-sight

....and there's a link on the word 'disability', if you click it it takes you through to this article:

www.kenoshanews.com/news/black-disabled-women-point-out-the-layers-behind-chris-rocks-alopecia-joke-at-the-oscars/article_8e3465fe-e6f4-5500-8ab0-f7f0a847f132.html

...which does talk about alopecia being an autoimmune disease, but I don't think it specifically states that it's a disability.

Whilst googling, I also found this article below by Joelle, an actress with alopecia, which seems to be saying that although alopecia isn't a disability, it might need to be thought about in a similar light, when considering whether or not to make a joke about it, here's a quote from Joelle and link to the article below:

www.standard.co.uk/escapist/alopecia-jada-pinkett-smith-disability-race-sexuality-joelle-b991075.html

'I understand that comedy brings people together through laughter and that sometimes we laugh at each other to break down barriers and create bonds with one another. But making jokes about a visible condition should be taken just as seriously as if someone were to make a joke about someone’s disability, race or sexuality.'

He didn't know he'd won, didn't know he'd be making an acceptance speech. Hindsight is so powerful.

For months the arsehole had been the favourite to win. Of course he knew he was going to make a speech.

He should've used that time on stage to speak out about why the joke wasn't funny, if he didn't know he was going to win, and not slap him.

In case there was any confusion, alopecia is absolutely a disability

No it isn’t. It’s an auto immune disease.

I know, because I have it.

@Merrymouse

Even if all you take from the joke is that it's an insult (and it is a joke, even if you didn't find it funny)

How is it funny, and if nobody finds it funny, how is it a joke?

I understand that a joke can be funny and witty and insulting, but without humour and wit it is just an insult.

The primary purpose of a fictional story is entertain. If, theoretically, noone found a given story entertaining, it would not cease to be a story and become something else. It's just not a good and effective story.

Same with a joke.
That joke was told on a stage, by a professional comedian hired in the capacity of a professional comedian. Audience members laughed at it, so it even fulfilled its primary function.

The real question is what makes you so adamant that it wasn't a joke?

The real question is what makes you so adamant that it wasn't a joke?

Because there is no wit or humour.

Similarly a story has a plot and a beginning and end. A storyteller in a story telling venue doesn’t tell a story just because they speak.

The idea Rock proposed was ‘you have no hair because you have alopecia and should therefore be in a film about a woman who shaved her head because she was a soldier’. It is an insult because it was designed to reduce the target to one feature, with the full knowledge that this feature has caused her distress.

People often laugh at insults, and they often laugh when they think it is polite and they have been given a cue. That doesn’t mean an insult suddenly becomes a joke.

Tbh I don't really care. They are just a bunch of rich people patting themselves on the back for doing their jobs, virtue signalling at every opportunity and trying to tell everyone else how to live their lives. Can you even imagine the carbon footprint of all the people in that room with their private jets compared to every else. Celebrities are so self righteous and up themselves and I really think show business is less about the art these days. It's exhausting constantly having them shoved in your face day in day out.

“I would not have made a joke about his wife’s hair. I would have made a joke about her boyfriend.”-
Ricky Gervais

@Merrymouse
Previously, you said it wasn't a joke because it wasn't funny. It seems that what you meant is that it's not a joke because you don't find it funny.
Noone else is going to subscribe to that definition of a joke.

This thing gets stranger and stranger. There is a video clip showing Jada laughing while Will hits Chris
www.buzzfeednews.com/article/leylamohammed/jada-pinkett-smith-reaction-will-smith-slap-video

Will was wrong to hit him; there is simply no question about that. Whether you think it was a joke, not a joke, a cruel insult, doesn't matter. You don't hit people. If you want to respond to the insult, you do it in kind ... with words.

Imagine if Chris had hit back?

The more I read about this the more I am convinced it was staged.

A bunch of rich people fighting.

@southeastdweller

He didn't know he'd won, didn't know he'd be making an acceptance speech. Hindsight is so powerful.

For months the arsehole had been the favourite to win. Of course he knew he was going to make a speech.

Yes because the favourite always wins. Makes you wonder how the bookies make money.

[quote ToiletPoster]@Merrymouse
Previously, you said it wasn't a joke because it wasn't funny. It seems that what you meant is that it's not a joke because you don't find it funny.
Noone else is going to subscribe to that definition of a joke.[/quote]
Nobody else has explained why it was funny, or why it was a joke.

Your argument just seems to be that whatever a comedian says whilst being paid must be a joke.

It was a joke. Not a great one but still a joke. Will was laughing at first.
It's pretty common to have a joke set to be a roast of the people there

Will certainly could have had a word with Chris later to defend his wife and say it was hurtful.
Hitting him wasn't appropriate.

The whole things is just too cringeworthy to be real. Which makes me quite happy that it happened. Whenever I fuck up or embarrass myself I can think ‘well at least I didn’t slap Chris Rock on stage in a completely over the top temper tantrum at the Oscars in front of millions of people and turn what should have been a career highlight for me into an almighty awkward shit show that no one can stop talking about…’

I reckon he went up with the intention of punching him. Realised he couldn’t do that once he got up there but couldn’t back down as he’d make himself look ridiculous so decided to slap him instead in what was supposed to be a jokey manner … only he was so enraged deep down that the “comedy” was lost and the assault was very much real

This.

This thing gets stranger and stranger. There is a video clip showing Jada laughing while Will hits Chris

She laughed because, like most people in the audience, she thought it was a joke. Remember they couldn't see the hit close up at that point.
It was after seeing Chris Rock's shellshocked reaction and smith's full on aggressive shouting and swearing they all realised.

No way was this a set up.

This should be seen as an important lesson. If you find your buttons being pressed by a goady fucker, stop and think.

And if you are the goady fucker, one day you will cross someone who will face the consequences of their actions for the satisfaction of punching you in the mouth.

@EV117

The whole things is just too cringeworthy to be real. Which makes me quite happy that it happened. Whenever I fuck up or embarrass myself I can think ‘well at least I didn’t slap Chris Rock on stage in a completely over the top temper tantrum at the Oscars in front of millions of people and turn what should have been a career highlight for me into an almighty awkward shit show that no one can stop talking about…’

Agree.

‘…and completely overshadowed the career highlight of everyone else who’s worked so hard for years to get their Oscar nomination’