To say this pissed me off about my booking appointment ?

[chattycaterpillar]

I had a pregnancy booking appointment recently, and was talking to a friend about this yesterday, and she agreed this equally pissed her off about her's too, ( she had hers 12 months ago in the same NHS trust).

The actual medical questions were almost skimmed over, ( I wasn't asked if I had any medication allergies, even though I have a serious allergy to doxycycline). But the amount of nosy, social questions asked to "judge," your suitability to parent was ridiculous.

Examples on the proforma list included:

• How long have you been with your partner ? ( Yes, it is a long-term relationship so wasn't an issue for me, but my friend's child was conceived after a short fling and she didn't want to be answering exactly how long it was).

• What is your highest level qualification/ are you educated to degree level ? ( I'm educated to degree level, but interested in the medical relevance of this. Imagine getting asked that at any other medical appointment ...)

• Are you employed ? Is it full time work, what do you do for work ? What does your partner do for work ? ( Why on earth is it medically relevant what my partner does as his job ? )

• Does your partner have any other children ? ( No, but again, not medically relevant...)

• Do you own or rent your property ? ( Why, do you want to take a look at my mortgage deeds....)

Seemed to be a lot more interested in asking a list of nosy, intrusive questions than either a) a serious physical health condition I have that could impact the birth, or b) my medication allergies.

I'm just trying to work out in what other medical scenario this would be appropriate...

@Seasidemumma77 it is quite common for cousins to marry in some cultures

Imagine if you’d come back with a sky high reading. Gone home. Checked your boiler. Realised it was spewing out carbon monoxide and could have killed you.

I promise this happens. I promise.

At my booking in appointment I was asked if I smoked, I said no. She then did a carbon monoxide test and I was in the amber zone (for comparison, my mum who smokes 20 a day got an amber reading at a doctors appt. around the same time period). The midwife said well if you don't smoke it could either be from pollution where you live, or your boiler, so get your landlord to check your boiler. We did just that and the boiler did have a problem with it!

I haven't read the full thread, but I did ask the midwife at my booking in appointment (politely) why they were asking some of these questions and she could not or would not tell me. Nor were subsequent midwives able to explain and in fact normally got shirty if you asked anything at all (I was particularly interested why the appointments were booked for 1.30pm every time when I never, ever got seen till 4pm - this was years ago, before Covid).

There was also very little attempt to gain consent for gathering and processing the data (except a single box on the initial booking in form which asked 'do you consent to health surveillance?') I did ask about that one and was told it was opting in to health visiting.

I can see the point of it but it is yet another example of how a completely different standard is applied to informed consent, to pregnant women, than in most other data gathering situations.

I completely agree these questions should be asked. And we really shouldn’t assume that women wouldn’t open up to their midwives. In the first pregnancy I wouldn’t have to the booking midwife - I found her very unsympathetic. But I would have done to the one I saw this time. She was great at building a rapport. And she had read my notes about the first pregnancy and birth and her reaction was spot on and very helpful.

It's to ensure you receive adequate support and your child receives the correct level of service.
Volatile relationships= can lead to emotional and developmental problems in a child. Relationship breakups often mean a new partner and that does place a child in a more vulnerable position. Read recent news stories on child murders.
Educational level= If you can't read etc you may struggle if they start pointing you towards websites for advice. Deprivation affects child outcomes. Educational level is a maker.
Employment= no money = deprivation again affects child outcomes.
Asking about other children is vital! Do they have health problems, are you experienced parents, subject to child protection etc etc
Housing - Big issues arise from unsecure housing / poor housing/ stress if can't afford rent/mortgage. Again this affects parenting and child outcomes
All these areas can affect a child's health and long term outcome. Lovely that you have no issues but for others this information is vital! As a society we have to protect children and support families, if no questions are asked how the hell do you expect very vulnerable families to be supported properly????
How do you think families in need of food vouchers, enhanced service are identified?
You show no insight at all into why the midwife asks these questions. Take a step back look at all the recent child deaths then re think why when you have a baby people may just want to know something about you.

@C8H10N4O2

Also, almost every woman who smokes when pregnant lies. I’m sorry but they do. If they say they smoke then they then lie about how many they smoke. No one wants to talk about these things but it happens every day.

Then don't go through the fiction of asking the question - just be honest about checking blood carbon monoxide levels and ask them to consent to a test.

In general, it is staggering the degree of control that is considered appropriate for pregnant women - far worse than when I was pregnant and often for barely measurable risk. One would almost think we are in a patriarchal society which has an interest in controlling women in whatever way is possible.

Either pregnant women have autonomy and should be treated as adults or they are not.

Are you seriously making the health of a baby into a feminist issue? Give me strength

Are you seriously making the health of a baby into a feminist issue? Give me strength

Are you seriously suggesting that adult women should expect to surrender all bodily autonomy and consent every time someone says "won't you think about the baybeee"? Or that women shouldn't be given full information and asked to consent and make their own decisions when pregnant?

Women's reproductive care is absolutely a feminist issue, as is the second class health care women in general receive, the poor maternity care in the UK and the general infantilising of women in health care.

In this country we don't actually consider a foetus to have independent rights until it's actually born. So yes, I could well see that the way questions are put to pregnant women, (with no explanation as to why they are being asked, what the days collected is used for, and often with zero tact) could well be a feminist issue.

@toomuchlaundry

The safeguarding services are there to look after the child *@Volhhg* too, it's like bits of a jigsaw. So if you don't think HCP or schools should be involved, who do you think should be looking out for the welfare of children?

I think it's great that schools are involved in safeguarding but that the state is too heavily reliant on schools having to do this and it's another thing that has been pushed onto schools.

Days = data

Rosesandheĺebores we get that your DP/DH is a barrister and very important. It s getting boring now

How dare they try and safeguard children! Totally inappropriate to try and help people!

They had his occupation in the notes but clearly in an emergency they didn't look at the background information of course they wouldnt. And there was a higher chance he was in the Dock than a solicitor in due to there being more criminals than solicitors.

You don't see the questions and answers as relevant because you (I assume from your posts, and for the purpose of this thread) are in a stable relationship with a decent, safe home with no risk factors such as domestic violence, safeguarding issues, social services involvement or learning disabilities. All of these factors are vital for the team supporting you and your baby to know. These questions, while just giving benign info about YOU, may well give key info about the level of support needed for another family.

I got asked this too, i roared with laughter. Midwife said its more common than people think in some areas 😮 you laughed?!!

Of course it's a feminist issue. It's interesting that the issue around housing is brought up because you don't qualify for an extra bedroom in regards to local authority housing policy until the child is actually born.

@Mommabear20

How dare they try and safeguard children! Totally inappropriate to try and help people!

Did you read the post from the woman who revealed she had been adopted to a midwife , and her susequent treatment by HCP's following that. I don't think she felt very " helped".

I wasn't asked a single one of those questions! Must be region specific.

Most nosy question I got asked was "was the baby planned?" But that was followed up with "so you've been taking the recommended amount of folic acid prior to conception" so not a pointless question.

@Laniania

I think it is inappropriate too OP but honestly good luck getting anyone to agree on here. Most people seem happy to accept any level of state nosiness, judgement and interference in the interest of preventing abuses that said state mostly subsequently fails to prevent anyway.

Fully agree with you.

Luckily I had my children long before the state became this nosey. I have no problem though in saying that I'm not going to answer the questions in similar situations.

I'm pretty much the complete opposite. Not only am I not bothered one jot about being asked these questions, I want my general data to be collected. The more population data they have, the more health and social care can be directed towards the needs of the population. I've consented for my data relating to my pregnancy and delivery to go towards research because there's so little out there on twins, and as I see it, every morsel more of data makes the research better.

Haven't read the whole thread but those asking what help would actually be provided if you gave them an answer which caused concern; when my DD was pregnant she was asked these questions, she disclosed that she'd previously been in an abusive relationship (he wasn't the dad but was still hanging around like a bad smell early in her pregnancy) The midwife referred her to social services, who then referred her to an early support worker. They worked with her throughout her pregnancy and after my GS was born.

I think it was really helpful, firstly because it highlighted to my daughter how seriously they were taking her previous relationship. She knew, in no uncertain terms, that if she ever got back with him her DS would be at risk, and likely removed. She's never had anything to do with her ex since.

Secondly, it removed the 'fear' of social services/health-visitors and made my dd more confident in asking for help, which she has done throughout. She's brutally honest with them (to the point of embarrassing sometimes ) My GS is 5 now and is being assessed for autism. She has worked relentlessly with agencies to get him the support he needs. I really don't think she would've done that had the midwife not opened up that world to her in those initial visits.

So yeah, I can see how they can seem irrelevant and judgy if you're in a good place with plenty of support, but they aren't really there for people 'like you' - it's worth the irritation if it helps identify those who aren't as fortunate.

Did your partner attend with you? I'm sure they would've directed the relevant questions about him, to him. It's to identify risk, which I think is great, I didn't mind answering those questions in the knowledge that by asking some people, they can identify risk to a child and provide support. If they didn't ask, there'd be a lot more cases of awful child abuse on the news than there already is

Really glad to know that your midwife was concerned about your child's security and is looking out for any safeguarding issues.

OP you're clearly in a stable relationship with a stable home life all round.

Not every woman is. Those questions are aimed at finding those women who might need more support so they can be signposted / referred.

As your pregnancy progresses things become more medical as issues come up / things impacting your birth become more relevant.

As for the related question, in some societies marrying a cousin is perfectly ok. That is a close blood relation which could have an impact on the baby.

God knows what you'll make of the stickers on the back of the toilet door when you go for you scan.

@PeeAche2 that sounds so upsetting. I'm in early pregnancy from IVF and have had miscarriages and much heartache. I would be devastated to go through your experience when my baby is so wanted. Maybe you will consider putting it in writing to the NHS Trust.