To think paediatric ward should be better equipped for bed sharing?

[Franklepopper]

I’m in hospital with my poorly 1 year old. The care we’re getting is great but the parent bed is a narrow fold down affair with a gap between it and the wall.
AIBU to think that poorly children are likely to want to bedshare with their grownups and that the beds could have been thought about a bit more to make this possible?
I might be delusional but I have had 30min a sleep so far all night…

100% agree. My now toddler coslept until 14 months and there was no chance of him sleeping in a cot when we spent 3 nights in hospital last summer with Bronchiolitis.

I had a single bed and he slept in with me. Fortunately we're both pretty small so it was doable. The nurses were very kind despairing it being contrary to policy.

That’s really key to your POV I think. Some parents are in and out with children who are frequently really poorly. Inbetween they’re likely to be losing a lot of sleep providing care to try to prevent another hospital stay. Never mind trying to meet the needs of other children in the family, make up time at work etc. For someone to sleep through their child’s crying they’re probably utterly shattered.

If children have chronically medical conditions and are in and out of hospital regularly, there are (at least in Spain and Australia) options where carers can be brought in or parents stay in accommodation close to the hospital (usually on the same grounds).

Most people going with children to hospital are for 2-3 nights stay max. Most have spouses, partners, parents, siblings, friends that they can take over in the morning/afternoon for a few hours - it's not different from having a sick child at home and having broken sleep. It's part and parcel of being a parent - you just don't sleep like a baby when your child is sick at home.

I think many people confuse medical care with parental care in hospitals. It can be awfully tough but having sick children is tough whether they are in hospital or at home. What we can't think is that doctors and nurses have the responsibility to provide parental care in hospital. They don't.

The first time DS was in hospital after night 5 a nurse kicked me out to go and get some proper sleep. I was a walking zombie. I was lucky my mum could take over for the night, but what the nurse said to me stays with me 12 years (and many nights in hospital later!) “while you are here you have us to help and support, when you get home he will still be poorly but you don’t have us, get the rest while you can so your fit enough for the next few weeks”

I bedshared with DD2 in hospital when she was admitted at 4 months old. The staff were very accommodating. We used a standard bed for adult patients.

DD2 would've been very distressed to sleep alone. We bedshared until she was 2 years old so she could BF on demand.

In the ward of 4, there were 2 parents bedsharing with infants, one primary age child whose mum was on a narrow pull down bed and one baby who was alone in a cot. His mum visited him for an hour a day. He was often very distressed and the nursing staff had little time to attend to that.

I always get annoyed when I read most children's books about going into hospital with my dc because in them everyone is either having one off planned surgery or they have broken their leg/hurt their head. In our hospital that's not the reality at all. On an average day in the 20 bedded ward there will be 4 dc having treatment for cancer, 2 broken limbs, 4 who will have been in hospital for over a week with a long term health problem, 2 recovering from seizures or asthma attacks, 2 overdoses, 1 appendix and 5 frequent flyers who are in for the day for a lumbar puncture, Mri scan etc. Then there is the day surgery ward where there will be 10 dc twice a day having grommets, tonsils, squint repairs etc. And the 12 bedded assessment ward where they have the tiny babies and the children who might be infectious. They also have a big room there for a child who needs more space for their medical equipment and a 2 bedded hdu.

When ds was in a lot he would come in and ask whether certain children were in that day. There are lots of families who we mainly only see on facebook now but we used to see all the time at the hospital. The people who come in once, have their appendix out and leave are really in the minority. Most of us will be looking after children with long term health issues and need to sleep and have a shower while our children are in hospital.

One of the reasons I left my previous job on a paediatric ward was the attitude of my colleagues.

They refused to feed parents unless breastfeeding but stopped feeding a bf mum if the child was 1 and over because 'the mum isn't the patient'

One night one of my colleagues said to a mum who had asked for the observations to not be carried out overnight (which tbh is a bit ridiculous) because she was tired and needed some rest 'you're not the patient, we've all had nights with kids where we've had no sleep. Maybe get a grip?'

The attitude on the ward was very much parents are there to parent and do all or most of the caring for the child and nurses were there to give IVs and meds and that is it.

The final straw for me was when a parent asked for a coffee because they'd just found out some devastating news and the health care assistant said 'it's not my job to make coffee, there's a kettle in the parents room' that was enough for for me. It's basic stuff like a coffee or a piece of toast that keep peoples morals up so I did my drugs round and then did a tea and toast round without taking my lunch. My manager complained that the parents would expect it now and I gave her my resignation.

Yes parents are there to provide care and 'parent' but children are unwell and it's stressful so if you can help then you should.

That said, there might not be any adult beds to swap the cot out for and children have fallen out of the parent camp beds before and the parents tried to sue the hospital for the injuries their child sustained..

The only awkward moment I've had is when a dad co slept with his child and I walked in at 2am to do the meds and he was asleep in the bed fully naked, I accidentally woke the dad up changing the pump and he walked out into the bay to the loo still naked.. totally inappropriate.

Hope your child feels better soon

Most people going with children to hospital are for 2-3 nights stay max. Most have spouses, partners, parents, siblings, friends that they can take over in the morning/afternoon for a few hours - it's not different from having a sick child at home and having broken sleep.

The bits you have forgotten, MOST isn't everyone.
Many with also have other children who need looking after.
Many will also be juggling work. Families might be able to afford one parent to take unpaid leave but not both.
Many live far from family.
Many DGPs still work, it's a big ask to ask someone to take time of work because you have a child in hospital.
Many children's hospitals are a distance away, 30mins travel each way, so an hour long visit actually take 2hrs.
It's very different to having a sick child at home, sick child might actually sleep, child in hospital will be frequently woken for Op, bright lights, people moving around.

I've only ever fainted twice, once as a wee 16 yo over heating at a rock concert. Once as an exhausted mum on a kids ward, lack of sleep, apparently its not that unusual. The Doc and nurse finished dealing with DS before sorting me out. So lack of consideration for parents sleep just added to their workload

The bits you have forgotten, MOST isn't everyone

The bit you have forgotten is that individual needs CANNOT be catered for in public hospitals.

We have an unprecedent crisis in public hospital funding in most countries, there are barely enough doctors, nurses and medical staff to be able to cope with the medical needs of the people under their care. The waiting lists are getting longer to get necessary surgeries because the system can no longer cope.

As I said in a previous post, if a parent is on her own and their child is going to be in hospital more than 3 nights, they need to talk with the nursing staff who will help as much as possible. But what parents can't expect is doctors and nurses to provide parental care for a 1-2 night stay in hospital. They simply do not have the resources to do it.

And for a better understanding where I'm coming from...

I've only been once in hospital with my child but I'm a Spanish registered nurse with 20 years experience in public hospitals.

The bit you have forgotten is that individual needs CANNOT be catered for in public hospitals. of course they can be and should be.

But the need for sleep isn’t an individual need, it’s a need everyone has.

@Sirzy

The bit you have forgotten is that individual needs CANNOT be catered for in public hospitals. of course they can be and should be.

But the need for sleep isn’t an individual need, it’s a need everyone has.

I'm sure you can cope with a couple of nights of bad sleep. You did when your child was an infant and likely breasfeeding through the night.

Oh wow you think it’s only a couple of nights!

@uptonogoode as a parent of a child in hospital it's the kindness, the drinks made and the compassion that we remember years later. I remember the lovely nurse who helped me make a nest out of rolled up blankets in a pillowcase for my non sleeping 5 month old who was used to sleeping in a moses basket rather than a big hospital cot. Even though my non sleeping 5 month old is a teenager now. And the consultant who sat with me and hugged me when I was in hospital with my baby and was missing my toddler. You will have made huge differences to people's lives, thankyou.

One more thing that I haven't addressed in the OP original post.

No, small children can't share a bed with a parent in a public hospital. A bed is only given to a patient, not to the parent as well. It's hospital policy in most Western countries.

The only time I've seen a deviation from this policy is with terminally ill children.

@RichTeaRichTea

Oh wow you think it’s only a couple of nights!

I think you should read all my posts instead of making stupid comments.

My dd was in hospital from birth for 3 months, no sleeping arrangements for parents in the 3 hospitals that dd spent time in (SCBU or NICU). The only time we could stay was when dd moved into the home room where we spent a few days before discharge. I believe there is now a Ronald McDonald house at one of the hospitals so this will be much better now. I've spent a month on a camp bed in the children ward, it's not ideal but much better than having to leave her. On the plus side I can sleep anywhere now..

@Crunchymum

Hope your little one gets well soon.

FWIW parents weren't allowed to sleep in NICU when my DC3 was there (pre covid). Parents were allowed 24h access but there were no beds / nowhere for parents to sleep.

NICU is completely different to paeds. Staffing levels are 1:1 or 1:2 on NICU. When my lo was on the paeds ward it was 1:7. He needed feeding and medication 3 hours, changing every 4-6, checking every hour. They simply don't have the time, especially overnight.

@Summersdreaming

My dd was in hospital from birth for 3 months, no sleeping arrangements for parents in the 3 hospitals that dd spent time in (SCBU or NICU). The only time we could stay was when dd moved into the home room where we spent a few days before discharge. I believe there is now a Ronald McDonald house at one of the hospitals so this will be much better now. I've spent a month on a camp bed in the children ward, it's not ideal but much better than having to leave her. On the plus side I can sleep anywhere now..

NICU is different, it's newborns requiring 24/7 intensive care - parents can visit during certain hours but won't be able to stay with their child. It's the only time hospitals take full control because their patients are too sick to need any other type of care apart from medical.

One of the things I love in Australia is the Ronald McDonald houses. Kids with cancer and very serious conditions requiring long stays in hospital can have their parents accommodated in the same hospital grounds which makes so much easier to have good sleep while being a minute away if they are needed it.

I've seen parents sleeping more than two weeks in chairs. One where they were sitting and another on their feet to make it a bit more comfortable. I've seen parents going home to have a shower only to come back in a hurry because their child got worse and got a call from the hospital.

Most parents are incredible. They will catch up a couple of hours sleep anywhere but will always be there with their children. Then, there is the other kind....

I think there's lots of negativity on this thread when the OP's suggestion is quite a reasonable idea! Of course it won't always be possible to bedshare, the child's condition may prevent it or the child might not want to. But if it could be an option, that would be great!

I recently stayed a few days in hospital with my 1 year old. We live in Thailand so it was a private hospital and the care here is very different, but it was a cheaper hospital as we went as an emergency to our local one rather than further away to the fancy international hospitals we sometimes go to. Our room didn't even have a cot or separate bed for my daughter, there was one fold-down sofa sort of thing that was basically a mattress on the floor. Not quite double sized but bigger than a single. That was where we stayed for 3 nights. My daughter wouldn't leave me AT ALL so if there had been a cot, she would not have let me put her down anyway. The set-up was great for both of us.

My sister, on the other hand, recently spent the night in a hard plastic chair when her son was admitted overnight in the UK.

Nothing wrong with at least raising the suggestion of bedsharing being an option. We can aim for it, even if it wouldn't be feasible in all settings or for all children/parents.

Nothing wrong with at least raising the suggestion of bedsharing being an option

Nothing wrong with raising the issue on Mumsnet, with infants it'll be much better for the child to have mum close. It won't happen.

Public hospital beds are for patients only. I don't know how many of you have gone to visit family in hospital and sat on the bed only to have a nurse saying "you can't sit on the patient's bed".

Beds in hospital cost money, lots of money and bed sharing means is a nightmare financially to allocate funds for a sick patient when the patient is sharing it with a healthy individual.

DS spent a week in a children's ward and I was half in a camp bed and half on his pillow with bags stuffed in the gap. My bed was low down and he would sob if he couldn't see me. Overnight the camp bed would slide further and further away.

There was a no cosleeping rule, and tiny ones would spend all night crying. No one got any sleep. One night there was an almost riot because several parents had reached the end of their tethers. Security ended up removing one person and a nurse swapped with another in children's A&E after being reduced to tears at being screamed at. Another parent discharged themselves and made arrangements to come in 3x daily for oral antibiotics as she couldn't cope. Each time she went to the loo/for food/shower her son would cry and another parent would kick off for him waking theirs up. The atmosphere was awful.

We ended up going privately for an op for DS purely so he would have a private room and wouldn't meet any other parents.

That would be an admin nightmare.
Risk of infection.
Child in bed needing resuscitation with staff unable to reach from both sides.
Risk of injury to child from parent rolling on them
Risk if adult falling from the bed and suing
Extra large sheets, blankets needed……..
I could go in. Can you imagine the risk assessments that would need to be done.

Everybody needs sleep, it's not an individual need, it's common knowledge humans have 4 basic needs, food, water, shelter and sleep.
Its not a special need, it's not unique, nor individual, everybody needs sleep.

Pediatric wards are relying on an adult being there 24/7 that adult has basic needs that should be met. One night in a chair is manageable 2 or more becomes torture.

Modern hospitals should be built with extra space to accommodate a pull out bed for the parent in pediatric wards.

I honestly don't know how single parents are meant to cope.

@Xpologog

That would be an admin nightmare. Risk of infection. Child in bed needing resuscitation with staff unable to reach from both sides. Risk of injury to child from parent rolling on them Risk if adult falling from the bed and suing Extra large sheets, blankets needed…….. I could go in. Can you imagine the risk assessments that would need to be done.

Yet, as has been detailed by my posters, happens just fine in many places.

No-one has suggested double beds or anything like it. Just beds with no gaps big enough for children to fall down.

I am intrigued how a parent poses more of an infection risk lying next to their child than doing all the other things they do?