Surely they can’t expect us to pay 240 per month for power!

[Ellie198712]

Just read Martin Lewis’s latest email and it’s predicting average bills of £2900 per year!! Surely the government will need to step in and subsidise this cost. Our current bill is about 100 per month, and this just seems untenable for the vast majority

Yes, loads of older people pay a lot of money for social care. This was my father in law. He ran out of money just before he died. If fuel payment was means-tested he would have run out a little but sooner and his care would have been paid for by the state.

@ThinkAboutItTomorrow

Any older person who had a mortgage or a higher income in the '80's or '90s benefited from the North Sea oil and gas windfall that the UK squandered.

I think it's entirely fair that they pay that back now both as income tax and inheritance tax.

We had the same amount of oil as Norway. They kept it state owned and saved the cash in a sovereign wealth fund worth $1trillion. Today that pays for most of their benefits and social care. They also have state supported fuel prices so no increases.

We sold it off for a song - £1.5b - and used the tax revenue to give breaks on mortgages and higher rate tax.

This boon to the wealthy has mostly fuelled house price rises.

WTAF? Those were political decisions made by Tory governments - I opposed it at the time and I have never voted Tory - you can fuck off if you think I should now pay extra for fucking Thatcherism when I opposed it. I paid for it hard enough at the fucking time thanks.

@wearingtheT

I don't resent it, i'm much better off TBH.

I resent their attitude. You think they should get free stuff, due to their age when people queue at food banks?

hahaha

This really hit the nail on head. That is exactly their attitude.

The freebies going towards them (for totally political reasons) need to stop.

The freebies going towards them (for totally political reasons) need to stop.
Presumably by "political reasons" you mean "can be arsed to vote"?

@SamphiretheStickerist

I volunteer for two homeless charities and donate a healthy amount per week to the food bank.

@Blossomtoes

Right now they pay zero

They don’t. They pay every penny of the cost of social care if they have more than £23.5k. Every penny.

That's not true for the first person in a couple. If one goes into a home but the other doesn't the state steps in.

Only 36% of care home residents are self funding whilst over 75% of over 65's in the Uk own their own home outright.

So jack and Jill live in a house worth £500k but only have £30k of savings. Jill goes into a home so They pay £7k of fees until the savings hit the threshold.

After that I think the state pays. Typically 3 years of fees (average time in a home) are £110k. And still gives Jack attendance allowance.

Jack outlives Jill but then has a heart attack. The family home is inherited by their kids who pay ZERO tax as the IHT threshold for a couple is 3 x the average UK house value.

The freebies going towards them (for totally political reasons) need to stop

What “freebies”? The bus pass which you have to apply for and which is no use to anyone outside big cities? Or the £200 fuel allowance which costs less than £2 billion, that’s less than child benefit which anyone earning less than £50k can claim.

@HereComesSpringAgain

all our contracts will drop off throughout spring/summer

i'm a 70's child

i remember the constant power cuts
i remember the drought with no water in the taps
i remember food being a lot scarcer than it is now
i remember having just one coal fire as home heating

we need to adjust our mindsets now....as harsh as it sounds, its how many other countries manage. it can be done and we all might be a bit better off in other ways. it doesn't have to be as miserable as we think

Yep.

Frost on windows and seeing your breath indoors.
Getting dressed under the duvet.
Wearing layers and layers to school.

And that was so much better than previous generations. We never had it so good.

Last time I looked immigration was still allowed and still happening.

Not enough to make up for the drop in birth rates

In the next 2 decades, one in 4 people will be over 65, it's about 1 in 5 now. Who is going to fund the NHS & social care when the dependency ratio is so low?

@daimbarsatemydogsbone

The freebies going towards them (for totally political reasons) need to stop. Presumably by "political reasons" you mean "can be arsed to vote"?

Again, with the cluelesness.

Let me describe our glorious UK system of "First past the Post"

A material portion of rural areas have a very high % of 65+ folks, because the younger folks go to the urban areas for jobs and school.

No matter if the entire population of younger folks "votes" in those rural areas, this voting block would not be enough to out-number the 65+ folks.

The only way the younger folks "win" in those rural areas is if enough of the 65+ folks stay home.

Thats it. There is no secret to it beyond that.

That is precisely why the Tories give the 65+ more and more freebies, and why they are able to have a majority with only 40% of the vote.

Or the £200 fuel allowance which costs less than £2 billion, that’s less than child benefit which anyone earning less than £50k can claim.

But wasn't there an equivalent child benefit payment that wasn't means tested? my parents got it.

I can guarantee when I'm older that free prescriptions , fuel allowance & free pass just won't exist.

I'm on payment meters, my electricity has just risen from £25 to £40 and gas from £15 to £25.

That's a week.

That's not true for the first person in a couple. If one goes into a home but the other doesn't the state steps in

It is true. In those circumstances the local authority places a charge on 50% of the house, payable when it’s sold.

Only 36% of care home residents are self funding whilst over 75% of over 65's in the Uk own their own home outright

41% of people in residential care are self funders, while 15% of over 85s are in residential care. You’re comparing apples and pears.

That is precisely why the Tories give the 65+ more and more freebies, and why they are able to have a majority with only 40% of the vote.

Whilst obviously not every old person or young person votes the same way if there are more older people they will be targeted for votes.

Again, with the cluelesness.

OK, that's me out, now you've started sneering as if you have superior knowledge when you plainly don't.

I am fully aware of how FPTP works, and I oppose it, but I suspect I have spent a lot more time on the psephology of this than you bothered to.

If it's true that the Tories (for whom I have never voted in my 59 years) were the only party to give 65+ people "freebies" - answer me this - who introduced the winter fuel payment in 1997 and the concessionary travel scheme in 2008?

I'm going to bow out of this thread now as its populated by boomer bashers who don't have a clue.

@Blossomtoes

That's not true for the first person in a couple. If one goes into a home but the other doesn't the state steps in

It is true. In those circumstances the local authority places a charge on 50% of the house, payable when it’s sold.

Only 36% of care home residents are self funding whilst over 75% of over 65's in the Uk own their own home outright

41% of people in residential care are self funders, while 15% of over 85s are in residential care. You’re comparing apples and pears.

Thanks @Blossomtoes I stand corrected, good to know

I expect care in the home will include a charge on the house at some point in the future.

I think that was Mays policy which was hated but Im not sure how else they can raise revenue as income now has a huge burden.

Wow, that’s refreshing @ThinkAboutItTomorrow. Kudos.

The majority of social care is home carers. Not people going into a home. People including couples pay for that.
I am amazed at the fact that if one person goes into a home because of severe care needs, the fact we don't make the other older person homeless is seen as generous by some on this thread. Yep they should just toss 80 and 90 year olds out onto the street.

@lorking

I expect care in the home will include a charge on the house at some point in the future.

I think that was Mays policy which was hated but Im not sure how else they can raise revenue as income now has a huge burden.

In theory,

Reforming council tax can cover some of the social care shortfall. Higher value properties then pay more council tax, thus higher social care precepts. This can then help fund social care locally.

But yes, thats only a small part of the cost problem as many areas do not have enough of a tax base to fund social care.

Stop being the online personification of Duning-Kruger. It does society no good.

Oh, the irony.

@alltheapples

The majority of social care is home carers. Not people going into a home. People including couples pay for that. I am amazed at the fact that if one person goes into a home because of severe care needs, the fact we don't make the other older person homeless is seen as generous by some on this thread. Yep they should just toss 80 and 90 year olds out onto the street.

Whether you like it or not,

The only way paying for social care works is if we tap into poperty wealth (which is mostly unearned mind you)

Always find interesting how many older folks try to advance the notion that they "worked for their housing wealth".

They twist themselves into a veritable pretzel trying to take credit for temporal macroeconomic factors that had nothing to do with them.

This is the kind of thinking the UK is up against.

Until people come down to earth and are objective about what they have actually "earned", the whole economy will keep being destabilised duento sheer socio-economic inertia.

@BambinaJAS how popular will that be though?

Nobody wants to pay for it, that's the problem.