To admit I have no idea wtf is going on with Russia and the

[Dustlandcinderella]

I follow the news and can see that There is a lot about Russia and the Ukraine. But I can’t quite figure out what is happening , what the background is, and what the truth is (bearing in mind in any war there is propaganda on each side).

Am I the only person who doesn’t actually understand what’s going on

@Keepyourheadscrewedon wrote:
"I couldn't care less as long as a country can choose for itself if they wish to be autocratic fine, if they wish to be democratic that is also fine - but the wish of the people to have peaceful lives is paramount."

I don't understand this, I'm afraid. What does it mean for a country to "choose" to be autocratic?

How would you know what "the country" chose without the people expressing their views in some kind of election or referendum? Isn't that democracy?

If a country voted to maintain a system of government with a strong president and elected a particular person into that role, that would be one thing.

But can the people of Russia be said to have freely chosen to have Vladimir Putin leading them for all this time? If not, in what sense has "the country" chosen this?

An "autocrat" is a ruler with absolute power. If they can be removed by the people, they don't have absolute power. If they can't, then even if they were originally elected how can we know whether the country chooses them now?

@Keepyourheadscrewedon

Above post for socks otherwise known as a Putler apologist.

This is not true and a disgusting comment.

I have said clearly that I do not agree with any military action.

@CasperGutman I am slightly losing the will to live with this, because if you say anything at all which disagrees with @Keepyourheadscrewedon's idea of world order you get called a Putin apologist, but if you want to know what the Russian people really think, France 24 (English speaking) have made a few reports which are on youtube in the last couple of weeks, which interview Russians on the streets to get their opinions. In summary, one was filmed before Russia went in, and the majority of Russia thought that Ukraine and the West were to blame. One of the reports was shot after Russia had gone in and more people were critical of the war.

@socksnjumpers kudos for keeping your cool on this thread, I'm impressed your patience has lasted this long

socks I am afraid I am not so easily impressed, you have been largely supportive of Russia all the way through the thread (and others) and your obsession with trying to force feed to us what Russians think is remarkable. What do you think the rest of the world thinks having a despot threatening the world with nuclear strikes?

Your idea of diplomacy is laughable. 'Talk/agree or I will nuke you' will only take a country so far I feel. Nonetheless, Russia appear to be ready to talk, I personally don't believe it, and see it as a stalling tactic, another way to serve their own purposes of appearing 'reasonable' all the while bombing the shit out of Ukraine.

However, Russia are losing the war at the moment, with many many more losses than they were expecting so who knows? We can only hope for a compromise, and an uneasy solution. I personally pray this happens, and Ukraine is saved. You can not decide to erase an entire nation, which is the Russian aim, and take it over and expect to get away with it. I am hopeful but not optimistic a compromise may be reached but who knows?

Quite where that leaves the rest of the world, with a deranged man running a country that is just about to completely unravel who seems quite content to threaten nuclear every time he is challenged will be a bigger issue.

Putin will wake up to the huge run on banks today, panic is likely to follow, the Russian banking system could collapse, a currency that halved over night and his own population must be terrified now as well about the possibility of nuclear war. This is not going well for him needless to say.

I have always watched Russian channels to get their perspective, I have many Russian friends that are very informative. Many of whom are now in a very difficult situation, but my sympathy lies entirely with the Ukrainian people, and the babies and children that are now lying terrified in bunkers whilst their country and their fathers are being killed and blown up.

One man has caused of this utter destruction, distress and chaos and I have never heard you acknowledge that, and I am most definitely calling you out on it.

Thanks!

You are extremely welcome socks

Russia and Ukraine are due to talk.

I am really hoping that they agree to UN peacekeeping corps to go in and to maintain peace until the political issues have been resolved.

And that all the political issues are on the table to be resolved including the wider issues around Crimea, NATO and sanctions and agreements around NATO put in writing this time.

I don't believe Putin is serious about peace talks, but he's losing face in front of the whole world with this invasion as the Ukrainians have proved a worthy opponents, and making Russia look weak.
This morning Russia has woke up to a broken economy, 20% interest rates, panic at the atms, rouble value slashed against the usd, banned from travelling to most countries, banned from most sporting events... loathed by most of the world.

The people of Russia will now suffer because of their leader.
I hope this cones to an abrupt end and the people of Ukraine can rebuild their lives.

[quote socksnjumpers]**@CasperGutman* I am slightly losing the will to live with this, because if you say anything at all which disagrees with @Keepyourheadscrewedon*'s idea of world order you get called a Putin apologist, but if you want to know what the Russian people really think, France 24 (English speaking) have made a few reports which are on youtube in the last couple of weeks, which interview Russians on the streets to get their opinions. In summary, one was filmed before Russia went in, and the majority of Russia thought that Ukraine and the West were to blame. One of the reports was shot after Russia had gone in and more people were critical of the war.[/quote]
A good point, and there are certainly those in Russia who are supportive of the current regime. However, there's a big difference between an informed opinion expressed in a secret ballot which people have confidence in, and what a self-selecting group are willing to say publicly on camera while they're living in a repressive regime.

Similarly, the fact that thousands of Russians have been willing to protest on the streets against the war in Ukraine is, to me, much more impressive than the time a million or more Brits marched against the war in Iraq!

Whammy I agree - the 'talks' could well be a decoy, we have seen this many times before. Saying one thing and doing another.
If they were serious about 'peace talks' one might ask why they are still bombing the shit out of Ukraine even as we type, and why not stop and pause and allow the talks to conclude?

If Russian intentions are genuine then we should see an immediate ceasefire immediately, without that it is all meaningless.

Russia need to stall, they are losing badly in most areas and need to regroup. The plan was for a lightening erasure of Ukraine, and that ship has sailed and now they look bogged down in a never ending war - so they should take their chance now to leave Ukraine with dignity.

@Whammyyammy

I don't believe Putin is serious about peace talks, but he's losing face in front of the whole world with this invasion as the Ukrainians have proved a worthy opponents, and making Russia look weak. This morning Russia has woke up to a broken economy, 20% interest rates, panic at the atms, rouble value slashed against the usd, banned from travelling to most countries, banned from most sporting events... loathed by most of the world.

The people of Russia will now suffer because of their leader.
I hope this cones to an abrupt end and the people of Ukraine can rebuild their lives.

This is what I can't see: how does Putin save face? It is not going as he planned; the West is uniting rather than dividing. He can shell Ukrainian cities but without ground troops with adequate training/prep/food, water and fuel, he can't hold them. I'm frightened that he may conclude that he has nothing to lose, in which case ANYTHING up to and including nuclear deployment is on the table. Lukashenko in Belarus is shit-stirring for all he's worth, too, for his own reasons.