Why do you benefit bash?

[greyblanket76]

My family and I are working class and always have been. My friends are too and so are the people that I tend to socialise with/meet in everyday life. I've only been on MN since last year but have seen so many comments bashing people who are on/depend on benefits and I'd really like to know why?

Is this because some people on here think everyone that's on benefits is lazy and doesn't want to work therefore claim benefits? Or is it something else?

I'll talk about my situation and will keep it as brief as possible as I already know people will come in the comments to try and shame me. I'm early 20s and a single mum (didn't start out that way but your whole life can literally change overnight and that's what happened to me). I have one DC and I'm expecting another so I've been on maternity leave back to back as I'll have 2 under 2.

I've worked full time since I was 17 right up until I went on my first maternity leave. Due to the rate of SMP, I'm entitled to benefits as SMP doesn't even cover my rent which is £1200. I'm entitled to £1670 of UC which covers my rent and all my bills. During the first 9 months of my maternity leave I was receiving around £1507 UC (due to deductions) + £638 SMP = £2145 a month.
Once I give birth to my second DC, my UC entitlement should go from £1670 to £1907. This isn't 100% accurate but due to receiving SMP, let's say the deductions would be due £1700 UC + £638 SMP = £2388 a month. That would be excluding child benefit for both children btw.

When I was working full time, I was earning £1383 a month. I do plan to go back to work after my maternity leave ends as I genuinely love my work and have my whole career in front of me. However can people see the huge jump in difference between the two amounts? Nearly a grand in total! When returning back to work, I would be entitled to some benefits however because I'd be working full time, it wouldn't be a lot. That's why it's advised that you drop hours to work part time in order to get the most help available.

I've read my post back and hope it isn't too confusing but I just wanted some people who benefit bash to understand that sometimes life on benefits seems better especially as you have kids because you get so much more help. My mum keeps telling me to consider not working for a year or two just because I need to consider the quality of life my DC and I will have. I wouldn't be able to pay for rent AND childcare so what would I do? There's a lot that comes into play when deciding if you should go back to work or just be on benefits and I hope some people got that from this post. Seeing as this is an anonymous forum, if you judge/bash people on benefits, I'd really be interested to hear why. Posting in AIBU because I'm prepared to be flamed and have learnt not to take nasty comments to heart

@Frequency

It's because people are too blinkered to see past their own, small experiences.

They don't understand that not everyone is capable of getting 2/3 degrees. Not everyone has a family who will support them (practically, financially and emotionally) through higher education. Many working class young people are pushed into minimum wage jobs as soon as they leave school so they can contribute to the household income.

They don't understand that marriages break down or contraceptives fail.

They don't know anyone whose family was so abusive they left home at 16 and took the first job offered to them. They don't know anyone who has degrees and still can't get a job as they can't leave the area due to family commitments.

They don't understand that if everyone had a high paying paying job society would break down. Cleaners, bin men, service workers are needed. A doctor could not perform surgeries if cleaners and maintenance workers didn't keep the hospital clean and in good working order.

And if everyone who "couldn't afford" kids didn't have them we'd be fucked in 20 years when there was no-one to clean the streets or care for all the eldery 2x univerysity graduates.

If it doesn't happen in their social circle they don't get it.

The benefits system is not broken, wages are.

If you earn less than someone on benefits you need to be shouting for a payrise not demanding that others are pushed further down.

@Frequency this is all so true! Thank you for this. The comments on this thread proves how true this is. People really cannot see how other people may have different life commitments to them

@Hospedia

great post.

@lucythejuicy

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

@lucythejuicy I'd love to know what's appalling about my attidue? A pp has already posted the exact figures showing what small amount of the taxpayers money contributed to unemployment. It was 1%. I don't think I'm 'entitled' to sponge off of anyone. You also know nothing about benefits as there's a two child cap when it comes to UC. So 'popping them out to avoid having to work' makes no sense in this case. No real understand of benefits but you have the lip to try and judge something you don't even understand. How embarrassing

I have worked for the DWP in the past as an advisor in the job centre, supporting people get back into work. So I know there are absolutely many many genuine people out there who have fallen on hard times and need that help. There are also people who know how to play the system who have no intention of working. Both exist.

I have also been the other side of the desk myself a few times when I’ve been made redundant (with no redundancy pay), so I understand what it’s like to have to try and live on benefits (I was a single person then only entitled to support with rent and council tax and I’d get £65 a week to pay all other bills and get food - not fun and downright depressing!)

I’ve never bashed anyone on benefits as I’ve had to use the system myself (which I feel perfectly entitled to do given I’ve been paying into it since I was 18).

However, I do have specific annoyance with people like my arsehole neighbour downstairs. Who I know blags her way out of having to work because she doesn’t want to and makes my life a fucking misery by being an antisocial noisy, selfish, ignorant bitch who resorts to shouting out threats to stab you, if you politely ask her to keep the noise down at 4am.
Knowing that my hard earned cash goes towards keeping her living below me and making my life hell, pisses me off.

But like I said my specific annoyance is there, with her. Otherwise, I don’t judge.

I chose to get a university education so that I could work towards financial stability. I made absolutely sure I didn’t get pregnant. I will be paying for this decision for the next couple of decades; every month a chunk of my earnings go to the student loans company. This is despite earning less than the OP gets per month for, essentially, having (presumably) unprotected sex - twice - without any substantial savings.

[quote lucythejuicy]@Frequency come off it - we don't need people to have children and live of benefits to look after us in our old age. There are plenty enough children born to parents who work hard and don't do this. There's a huge difference between people working and on UC (which most people have no issue with) and people lie the OP. Additionally with an attitude like OPs her children are likely to be the same so not actually a benefit to society as a whole [/quote]
@lucythejuicy maybe you struggle to comprehend something you've read. I'm working, I'm on maternity leave and I'll be back to work when my maternity leave finishes. I receive UC because £600 SMP doesn't cover £1200 rent. You're starting to come across as somewhat uneducated

@Hospedia

Wait for the hand waving dismissal...

@000YourMum000

I chose to get a university education so that I could work towards financial stability. I made absolutely sure I didn’t get pregnant. I will be paying for this decision for the next couple of decades; every month a chunk of my earnings go to the student loans company. This is despite earning less than the OP gets per month for, essentially, having (presumably) unprotected sex - twice - without any substantial savings.

Same. I can't bloody wait to see the back of that effing student loan that's followed me around since circa 2004 😩

lm.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.walesonline.co.uk%2Fnews%2Fwales-news%2Funiversal-basic-income-welsh-government-23106727%3Futm_campaign%3Dgroup_walesmain&h=AT1IAqv4FVHg3UT_Qg-v2uwhopSq9sYRG3UGGPFOV1YFyx6x3bOdjBUXu_B59sEZxTd_HFOq2q2f8WAI59odR4whYHKBrgw2A9lxUBalj2s2af3KIXr-qi6Io-muZ5yY9IJl

Its a kick in the teeth when you work full time miss out on so much time with your kids and I take home a grand less than you. Im sorry its not right at all. You shouldn't be on so much more money not working. Not your fault just the messed up system we live in.

Op I'm from a working class home and all of us Worked from ages 13 on after school and every school holiday and were pushed and pushed and pushed by parents to get an education and to make the right CHOICES to ensure we didn't end up on benefits. Over and over we were told education was the key, we were warned on the dangers of having children young and under no circumstances could we even mention having a boyfriend/girlfriend at home until we were mid 20s.

All but 1 of us now have degrees and masters and professional jobs and homes of our own.

My DH is from a benefits background. They were brought up to think education was out of reach and that they were entitled to be housed and benefits. No one batted an eyelid at young people having babies they weren't prepared for in non committed relationships. Any woman who worked made sure it was just enough hours to get the max benefits and multiple children was the only way forward to ensure you got a council house etc.

I think it depends a lot on how some people are brought up and what they are exposed to and think is the norm.

My MIL can't understand the choices we have made owning our own home that we have to pay for and maintain and both working and paying childcare. I can't understand how she thinks that's not our duty as able bodied adults who chose to have DC.

However, I do have specific annoyance with people like my arsehole neighbour downstairs. Who I know blags her way out of having to work because she doesn’t want to and makes my life a fucking misery by being an antisocial noisy, selfish, ignorant bitch who resorts to shouting out threats to stab you, if you politely ask her to keep the noise down at 4am. Knowing that my hard earned cash goes towards keeping her living below me and making my life hell, pisses me off.

Antisocial behaviour aside, which is completely unacceptable and unfair on you, would you want someone like that looking after your elderly Nan in a care home or knocking on your door with your Amazon parcel or serving lunches at your kids school or cleaning around your bed in the hospital?

As unpleasant as it sounds (and I apologise for my phrasing of this, I don't mean it to be so blunt), there are some people who lead such chaotic lives that the chaos itself becomes an impediment and - as things currently stand - it is worth the cost of UC for them to not be out there working. It's shit and the system is massively failing these people, early intervention starting in childhood could help them as could a benefit system that lifts people up rather than shoving them down and keeping them down (it's called the poverty trap for a reason) but people won't vote for that because it costs money and they've been conditioned to believe that spending money on these people is bad - the irony being that not spending the money is exactly what creates this situation in the first place.

I wrote this post because I was recently at a mum and baby class and got to talk about our housing situation and the fact that UC has to pay the rent with one of the mums. I then started thinking, I've never heard anyone say a bad word about people on benefits yet I see people benefit bash with no explanation. I made this post because I wanted to know why.

I don't even know what writing a goady post means

@Stroopwaffle5000

I can't believe how much you receive in benefits! I didn't previously bash people on benefits because I thought they were struggling, as they received barely enough to live on. I stress the PREVIOUSLY because now I've read your post, I feel like I want to benefit bash!! That is a full time wage for some people! My OH took home £1700 a month when he was working a very stressful 48 hours a week as the Deputy Manager of a hotel chain! You get it for doing nothing!!! Obviously if people physically can't work, thats a different story.

Also why have a 2nd child when you're already on benefits? You can't afford to look after the 1st child by yourself!

@Stroopwaffle5000 so every woman that's on maternity leave is doing nothing? Right ok👍 if you read my posts you'd see how much UC I currently receive and the fact that I have £73 left over each month

@Frequency

It does baffle me how people manage to get degrees when they are apparently incapable of basic reading and comprehension skills.

OP works. As do 90+% of UC claiments. She's currently on maternity leave.

Thank you!

@IrishMama2015

We had remarkably similar experiences in terms of being pushed to prioritise further education.
This resonated strongly:

I'm from a working class home and all of us Worked from ages 13 on after school and every school holiday and were pushed and pushed and pushed by parents to get an education and to make the right CHOICES to ensure we didn't end up on benefits. Over and over we were told education was the key

@sst1234

OP is basically congratulating herself in this post by telling people how well off she is, being funded by others having children she cannot afford, nor the father/s will pay for. Well done OP, you win the prize for goady post of the day.

@sst1234 seriously are you blind? Are you cheeseonpost reincarnated or something? How is having £73 left for the month, well off? Please use your brain

I think it's because there are a lot of stereotypes surrounding people on benefits but to be honest you are playing up to them with having 2 kids and no father on the scene. You are the stereotype of a benefits claimant.

I work full time and still get £900pcm in UC as I need to claim in order to pay for childcare for my son. My rent is only£400 pcm as I managed to find a housing association property but if I was in private rent my UC amount would be higher.
Even without childcare i’d get £250 per month in UC. That’s with a take home pay of £1550. With the work allowances and taper rates, a lot more people are entitled to UC but don’t realise it.

I did the calculations and I worked out full time work is the most beneficial for us. I got blasted for going back to work full time so my son is in nursery but if I didn’t go back full time I’d just be claiming more UC.

You’re damned if you do, damned if you don’t. A lot of benefit bashers have never been on benefits or they assume it’s a life of luxury.
It’s a support system in place for those that need it, blame low wages and high cost of living, not those that are claiming.

@000YourMum000

I chose to get a university education so that I could work towards financial stability. I made absolutely sure I didn’t get pregnant. I will be paying for this decision for the next couple of decades; every month a chunk of my earnings go to the student loans company. This is despite earning less than the OP gets per month for, essentially, having (presumably) unprotected sex - twice - without any substantial savings.

All the education in the world doesn't prevent disability. Everybody is only one car crash or Long Covid type illness away from being unable to work. And unless you're very wealthy, savings only last so long.

Separately, short of sterilisation, it's difficult to completely guarantee against an unplanned pregnancy. Particularly but not only in cases of rape.

Then there's the many people (with one, two, or three degrees) working often full-time in jobs that are essential to society but low paid. Or, increasingly, not so low paid but simply unable to keep up with the spiralling far out of control house prices.

Oh and the absolute top a disabled person can claim is £1402 per month. That includes full PiP.
Water bill
Council tax
Utilities
WiFi package
Phone package

Extra clothes
Pre prepared food
Smaller milk cartons

Can you see how it goes?

I get full PIP unfortunately. I am unable to work. Full PIP is about 506 per month, over half of that goes to motability for my car. Which means I have £234 pm to live on.

I, and no one else I know, gets any of the things on your list above. Please, please can you ask your MIL how she does and report back?

Oh, I do get free prescriptions now because I'm turned 60 but that might not last either so any help she can give me would be gratefully received.

How do you expect to pay for yourself in old age?

With minimum work contribution you'd have a very poor state pension (or none at all) and I don't think you've mentioned a private pension pot?

@Twinkle19

Its a kick in the teeth when you work full time miss out on so much time with your kids and I take home a grand less than you. Im sorry its not right at all. You shouldn't be on so much more money not working. Not your fault just the messed up system we live in.

@Twinkle19 When I'm on maternity leave again, I get that money due to SMP plus UC. UC pays my rent which is £1200 and my bills. It isn't just given for fun and as someone has already explained, I get such a high amount because of my rent and the fact that I'm working. I wouldn't receive anything near this if I simply didn't work however that's the way of the sytem. When I go back to work I'll be back on my horribly low wage

It is a support system for those that need it but having 2 kids with no father around is a "want" not "need"