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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

DS Last one picked in PE

483 replies

GoldenLightNights · 09/02/2022 22:32

AIBU to contact the teacher with regards to this:

DS is 9, he’s a wonderful child, great at all things science and maths related but not so much at sports. He plays football outside of school for one of the lower ability teams and sort of enjoys it, he isn’t forced to play or anything like that.

Anyway today at school he had PE, we’ve never had any issues before but today for some reason the teacher let two boys pick teams and my son was the last to be picked. He is quite upset especially as one of the boys doing the picking is a close friend.
Anyway I find the idea of letting other children pick teams horrendous and if not my son some child will be picked last. I actually thought this method of choosing teams was done away with years ago!
I want to contact the teacher to ask if he would consider adopting a new approach to team selection. My husband says I’m jumping the gun and to wait to see if it happens again…… so what do you think?
He was properly upset this evening 😢

OP posts:
starrynight87 · 11/02/2022 11:54

I don't think this that shocking, in the real world you wont always be picked first for everything.

Quincythequince · 11/02/2022 12:03

Agree Juniper

That can of course happen, but there is no suggestion that that’s what has happened here.

And this peer selection has happened once to OPs son.

Because people are saying they don’t think it’s a problem, the whataboutery of bullying has come into play.

Once.

Northernparent68 · 11/02/2022 12:06

@thing47

Picking teams on ability for an inter-school match, or an inter-house competition is OK (OP says her DS plays competitive football outside school so I'm sure he understands the concept of relative ability).

Doing the same for a class PE lesson is totally unnecessary. That is an all-ability class, presumably, so the emphasis should be on enjoyment and exercise and in that case it's much better if the teachers sorts it out.

DS coaches sport to primary age children and would approach the all-ability class sessions in a completely different way from the teams playing competitively.

This.
MarshaBradyo · 11/02/2022 12:09

The op’s dc was upset - not because op made a big deal out of it beforehand but at the time he felt bad

What’s so great about that - when it’s so easily avoided?

If it’s just once then why even do it at all. He’d know where he fitted with sports teams without this extra part. And is fine with where he stands. He knows

If it is just once then too late as it has happened already but a pity they bothered with it at all

SleepOhHowIMissYou · 11/02/2022 12:19

@Quincythequince

So if you used to put in the minimum effort required, that’s on you! Just because you don’t give a crap if your team wins or loses, why shouldn’t others.

You’ve just partially reinforced and explained exactly why under these circumstances, teams are chosen the way they are.

If you’re meant to be playing a game with a view to point scoring, why would anybody choose you if you don’t give a crap about playing properly.

I sure as hell wouldn’t. I would chose a lower ability person who actually tried, every single time, than someone who didn’t try.

You really are struggling with this aren't you?

I DID get picked. That's the point.

Despite putting no effort in, I was picked third or fourth because of how I looked. I looked athletic. I was also an attractive teenager who hung out with a "popular" set.

That's why I got picked. Not because I was good at sport but because of how I looked and my social status.

Hope that helps.

Appleandoranges · 11/02/2022 12:22

Being subject to being the last out of the class to be picked for a team does not teach you any resilience or independence or any important life lessons. It's just a very painful and humiliating experience for a few children, especially if it's done on a regular basis. Being picked last is a completely different experience and a million times worse than not being picked at all. It's different from not being picked for school football team/play/even coming last in a test which can be very disappointing but is not as hurtful. What is the point of it? What are the benefits? Who wants their unpopularity rubbed in their face? Why doesn't the teacher just pick the teams? I would just write an email to the school saying you noticed this happened. It was upsetting for your child. Can't there be another method of picking teams which doesn't make children feel bad? I don't think you would need to dress it up like a complaint - more like this is what you think. And hopefully that will make the teacher think again. All in all, writing an email saying you don't like that way of choosing teams or just talking to the teacher about it would be sticking up for those children "picked last" now and in the future. And I think someone's got to stick up for them...

AssignedBlobbyAtBirth · 11/02/2022 12:26

Shame comes from humiliation not resilience
Resilience comes from being encouraged to try, accepting failure and learning new ways to try

HunkyPunk · 11/02/2022 12:31

Surely anyone with half a brain knows that this is appalling practice

I’m afraid that it has the potential to get much worse in secondary schools, where some PE staff are positively Neanderthal in their practices.

In a year 8 school report his dickhead games teacher declared that ds3 was ‘not blessed with a great deal of physical prowess’. He was never going to be in the school’s pride and joy rugby ‘A’ team, no, but was average at and enjoyed having a go at most sports. This remark dented his (already shaky) confidence in any sporting ability he had or might have developed, so much, that he gradually withdrew from anything which wasn’t compulsory, left his junior football team, and now does little in the way of physical activity despite encouragement from us.

If only all teachers were aware of the benefits of positive reinforcement and the potential impact of their throwaway ‘clever’ comments. Especially PE/Games teachers, some of whom don’t seem to realise that part of their remit is to facilitate an enjoyment of sport and physical activity for all their pupils, not just the chosen few. It’s a really important role, when sedentary pastimes are so prevalent.

Quincythequince · 11/02/2022 12:32

Yes sleep I did get it.
That’s not what happened here - that’s my point!

AnEpisodeOfEastenders · 11/02/2022 14:16

I'd like to give everyone on this thread a participation medal in recognition of their contribution. You're all losers.

SleepOhHowIMissYou · 11/02/2022 14:21

@AnEpisodeOfEastenders

I'd like to give everyone on this thread a participation medal in recognition of their contribution. You're all losers.
😀
Somethingsnappy · 11/02/2022 14:45

@AnEpisodeOfEastenders

I'd like to give everyone on this thread a participation medal in recognition of their contribution. You're all losers.
And you will be picked first among them! Grin
SleepOhHowIMissYou · 11/02/2022 14:45

@Quincythequince

Yes sleep I did get it. That’s not what happened here - that’s my point!
Well quite. The opposite happened didn't it?

And you think this a good thing?

andysgirl22 · 11/02/2022 14:52

@Petsop that is an important point i feel. If it were picking who to partner up with for an academic project or something there could also be issues of those picked last but it seems there isn't the same outrage. I say this as someone with numerous disabilities who was always always picked last for sport. I was never shocked by it and it didn't ever upset me. They were picking who was most talented at sport i was definitely not that of course i was picked last. That is reality we are not all good at everything. I was horrendously bullied and abused by students and also staff so i am not coming at this of an angle of not understanding what bullying etc. Can do to a person. I am genuinely sorry for your son being upset though OP but i think it would be better to try and work on his resilience not necessarily because this way of picking is right but more because being resilient is an overall needed life skill. Maybe try to explain to him that we are not all good at everything and that is just the way of the world, it does not need to be a negative or sad thing.

imagen · 11/02/2022 15:29

[quote andysgirl22]@Petsop that is an important point i feel. If it were picking who to partner up with for an academic project or something there could also be issues of those picked last but it seems there isn't the same outrage. I say this as someone with numerous disabilities who was always always picked last for sport. I was never shocked by it and it didn't ever upset me. They were picking who was most talented at sport i was definitely not that of course i was picked last. That is reality we are not all good at everything. I was horrendously bullied and abused by students and also staff so i am not coming at this of an angle of not understanding what bullying etc. Can do to a person. I am genuinely sorry for your son being upset though OP but i think it would be better to try and work on his resilience not necessarily because this way of picking is right but more because being resilient is an overall needed life skill. Maybe try to explain to him that we are not all good at everything and that is just the way of the world, it does not need to be a negative or sad thing.[/quote]

But this is the whole 'I had it worse, so deal with it' mentality. I admit, I can be like this sometimes too when I hear other people complain. I think, I had way more than that and I coped.

But we need to do better. This isn't the right attitude to take to things. If we go through hardship we should be more understanding, not less.

Would you be saying this if a child was being excluded at playtime. Well we can't all be friends in the real world, so go play by yourself! No, because that's mean and it's not building resilience, it's crushing for a child - same as bi-weekly PE humiliation.

Quincythequince · 11/02/2022 15:40

Sleep I don’t think it’s good or bad!

You being picked for being pretty is way more ridiculous than a kid not being picked because he’s less able!

I wouldn’t have picked you based on your looks, and especially if you didn’t even try.

The whole point here - in this thread - is that it’s happened one time.

It’s not that big a deal.

mogsrus · 11/02/2022 16:50

@starrynight87

I don't think this that shocking, in the real world you wont always be picked first for everything.
True very true. Trouble is,these days kids cannot get their heads round it,that life will never deal a winning hand all the time
twominutesmore · 11/02/2022 17:36

Nearly 500 posts and no update from op. I'm beginning to wonder whether it happened the way she was led to believe.

llansannan21 · 11/02/2022 18:24

Once should be just forgotten about, several times perhaps worth a conversation.

Terfydactyl · 11/02/2022 18:41

@AndAnotherNewOne

It is unfair but I think you are massively over reacting. "Ritual humiliation"? No, it really isn't, just poor practice.
It really is humiliating. I was always the last or nearly last to be picked. Between that and other issues I simply stopped going to school entirely, but especially pe days. I've never done a single sport of any kind since those humiliating days. It put me off for life. You would think in 2022 things would have changed.
llansannan21 · 11/02/2022 18:52

@Terfydactyl hence my drawing a difference between a one off and what you experienced.

Hyenaormeercat · 11/02/2022 19:01

At school I was one of the last to be chosen, because they didn't play the sport I was good at. It was a 'boys sport' Hmm
The 'girls' sports I wasn't particularly interested in either.

IME school sports are for kids showing off sports they do out of school. The sports are not 'taught', they rely on kids doing sports out of school then parading those kids.

I now play a team sport, the one I wasn't allowed to play as a child. Even the coaches don't pick teams in training the way the OP described. It's 1, 2 or even 1,2,3,4..then 1 and 4 together..
It stops any moving places to get picked to a particular team. Everyone is 16-60!
And as for the chance to shine mantra, there will be a proportion of the top sporty kids who are also academic and its just another vehicle for their superiority.

SleepOhHowIMissYou · 11/02/2022 19:38

@Quincythequince

Sleep I don’t think it’s good or bad!

You being picked for being pretty is way more ridiculous than a kid not being picked because he’s less able!

I wouldn’t have picked you based on your looks, and especially if you didn’t even try.

The whole point here - in this thread - is that it’s happened one time.

It’s not that big a deal.

You're ignoring the social aspect. When I was picked, I then picked someone from my friend group, regardless of whether they were good at that sport or not. To deviate from this was social suicide.

Now, if the less able kids were made team captains instead of the same old sporty kids then there may well have been some fairness in this process. But, during my years at school, this never happened. Not once. Therefore, the same kids were left cringing against the wall every PE lesson.

It's a brutal way to treat people.

Talkwhilstyouwalk · 11/02/2022 21:35

Gosh, this is a heartbreaking. I was always one of the last to be picked!! I'd mention it, but sadly I don't think they are doing anything out of order allowing them to pick their own teams. It's just life and we all have our strengths and weaknesses....

Wishihadanalgorithm · 11/02/2022 21:50

I haven’t seen this practice in schools for decades. It’s archaic - for many reasons.

OP, I’d contact the head of faculty and deputy head in charge of PE and just say your DC was very upset and you know that this practice is not used in schools today. I’d suggest the PE teacher requires some training in this aspect of teaching and you don’t expect to be dealing with an upset child again.

I’m a secondary teacher and trust me I do think children need to be more resilient but this really isn’t a way to create resilience. At best it’s poorly trained teachers not understanding the shame and humiliation this causes. At worst, it’s a bullying PE teacher who likes to see ‘weak children’ get a taste of the real world.

I’d email in and request a response.