To be cranky about the £150 council tax rebate

[Notcontent]

I have been thinking a lot about this. I understand that the government was looking for a way to implement help with energy costs in the easiest way possible and that doing it through council tax bands seemed sensible as for the most part it does target the right people. But only for the most part. For example, in London there are lots of people who live in high value properties that are actually far from luxurious and who will miss out. For example, my elderly neighbour will miss out even though he deserves the help. He doesn’t have a lot of money - bought his house decades ago when the area was very cheap and lives very frugally. I know councils will get some extra money to distribute but that will be for only a small number of people.

These kinds of injustices really get to me, as I think when it comes to public money everyone should get equal treatment.

@sopsmum that was how the old poll tax worked. That system didn't go down well at all!

@sopsmum

I don't really understand the basis of council tax and what it has got to do with the value of your property in 1991. Surely council services should be provided on a per person basis. I've got the same size bin as my neighbours, same number of children in school etc etc

A lot more transparency around taxes is needed I think. If you live under a wasteful council you can be paying many more ££££ a year.

Mrs T tried that and the poll tax was not popular…

There's definitely major problems with the council banding. Here a 12 bedroom multi million mansion with a ton of land is a band E and a 3 bedroom bungalow is band G. The entire village is very random bandings. It certainly isn't a fair tax. We are also band G, a 4 bed house. Plus it's so expensive at over £3,000 a year. When we moved here the council tax was affordable, not now, it's trebled since 2002.

Certain elderly people get winter fuel payments etc that no one else gets.

@phishy

Well I’m in a band E for a tiny little terrace whilst the massive 1930s semis down the road are band D, so forgive me if I have little sympathy.

Surely if you already knew this information, you could have appealed to the council about it in the past. Why wait to complain when there is an announcer about a rebate?

@ilovebrie8

I think they should give it to everyone it’s unfair ...bandings are not a great benchmark! It’s poor as £150 is woefully small ...it’s the furlough/bounce back loans that is all wrong...lot of dodgy people/scammers were literally given tens of thousands and treasury has written it off ...the figures are mind boggling ...wrong on every level ...and people arguing here over £150. There is a bigger picture it’s shocking ...

Would you prefer lots of very wealthy people gain 150 pounds whilst others still have to use food banks and have to cut down on heating anyways?

It's a way to claim that they are serious about their levelling up agenda as there are more people in the south affected by this. I was shocked that bands A-D account for 80% of households tbh It's a crude way to apply this discount but it makes sense

My mum lives in a house that for some reason falls into band E - she's been trying to get the Valuation Office out to resolve it for 2 years - she's the same as houses on either side that are in band C

We are in band D and can honestly live without the rebate. I am going to transfer ours to her

@phishy @biscuiteater if you think your band is wrong you can challenge it www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/council-tax-bands-change/

@ArtichokeAardvark

The council tax bands need a massive overhaul. My 3 bed house is in band F whereas my neighbour's 5 bed is band D. His is an older semi detached property with a massive extension, whereas we are a small but detached new-build. Basing off 1991 values is ludicrous.

My flat is a band D. It's a tiny 2 bed, dated same carpets kitchen and boiler that were put in when it was built on the 80's, but if shared grass, there are a couple of these blocks of 4 flats squirrelled away at the bottom of a street full of detached homes with private gardens so I assume we are being changed because other more wealthy people happen to live near us

Struggle to feel too much sympathy for pensioners living in properties that are too large and expensive for them, to be honest. If the £150 would make that much of a difference, I would advise they bite the bullet and look at downsizing to release some capital.

@mum2jakie

Struggle to feel too much sympathy for pensioners living in properties that are too large and expensive for them, to be honest. If the £150 would make that much of a difference, I would advise they bite the bullet and look at downsizing to release some capital.

Many elderly people are too physically and/or mentally frail to move.

And also, not in every area of course, but many parts of the country have a severe shortage of smaller properties - particularly suitable for people who might have mobility needs.

And it's not just something affecting the elderly. It's a huge problem for many younger disabled people.

On a related note. Street homelessness is on the increase. One of the (various) reasons why is that 1 and 2 bedroom socially rented homes have all been taken by bedroom tax downsizers.

We want people to downsize? We need better availability of suitable homes for people to downsize to - in both the owner occupier and social rent sector.

Many elderly people are too physically and/or mentally frail to move.

And also, not in every area of course, but many parts of the country have a severe shortage of smaller properties - particularly suitable for people who might have mobility needs

A family sized property isn't likely to be suitable either but if they don't want to move they also have the option of equity release via a lifetime mortgage.

Pretty bloody minded to struggle along in a large property and not put the value of use if short of cash to pay the bills.

Street homelessness is on the increase. One of the (various) reasons why is that 1 and 2 bedroom socially rented homes have all been taken by bedroom tax downsizers.

Bedroom tax downsizers who are freeing up a larger home which was desperately needed for a family (who can't really go and get a flat share or sleep on relative's sofas like a single adult can).

But way to change the subject.

We're not talking about the homeless, we're talking about a single man living in London who is going to struggle without £150 a year CT rebate but not to the extent he should possibly think about selling his million pound home.

With a million pound budget your argument about shortages falls flat on its face. And if they are so frail they cannot possibly move, how would they manage if they had to go into a care home? Do you not think people have any responsibility to think about this? Or do we just give council tax rebates to millionaires... because? Because?

Surely every £150 going to people in million pound houses is £150 less going to those at risk of homelessness. You can't have it both ways (or are you arguing for a world where everyone can have everything?)

Surely banding is based on local areas so a 500k house in one area will be a different band to one in another area.

@ToastieSnowy

If he can’t afford it then he needs to sell his expensive home and downsize/ move location just like the rest of us would have to do.

How about being in one of the most deprived wards in the country yet paying one of the most expensive council tax. There’s quite a few areas of the country who pay far far more than the expensive London boroughs. For example while those in City of London pay £1049 a year council tax (band D), Wandsworth & Westminster pay even less than that. Kensington & Chelsea is £1331.

Yet Middlesbrough pay £2104, Gateshead £2145 and County Durham with all the old pit villages about the same.

Let’s start with equality in council tax payments first eh.

Labour council = high council tax.

I live in Wandsworth and vote Conservative for a reason.

Bedroom tax downsizers who are freeing up a larger home which was desperately needed for a family (who can't really go and get a flat share or sleep on relative's sofas like a single adult can).

Particularly once they get to a certain age, single adults need and deserve the privacy and dignity of their own home. I mean, men too, but for single women there's the added safety aspect (relevant because single women over a certain age are a minority - and therefore would face having to share with strange, potentially predatory, men).

And, it's not always so easy for single adults to get a room. Many are disabled or long term ill. Certainly a safe room isn't always easy to find for people on disability benefits (I won't include slum beds in shed type HMOs).

But also, like I said, many people needing a smaller home, including a lot of elderly, have mobility needs. There is a serious shortage of accessible homes.

No I don't feel very sorry for a person thst lives in a house worth £1m but needs a £150 rebate.

@DaphneBasset

From the sounds of it, your neighbour's house has hugely appreciated in value. He may have little in the way of cash but it sounds like he has decent wealth. He can downsize anytime he wants. No, I don't feel sorry for him!!

Funny how all these people think home owners should sell up, but thought the spare room subsidy "bedroom tax" was unfair when arguably the people in a house too big for them could've just downsized

I've lived in both Conservative and Labour run London councils. Both high council tax. (I once nearly moved to the Wandsworth bit of Putney because of the c tax - but ended up moving elsewhere, to nearer where my boyfriend at the time was).

@Tealightsandd fair, there are expensive Tory areas too.

@HobnobsChoice

The council tax band is based on property value in 1991 when London property prices were significantly less insane. I live in a Band B property in the North West and have just discovered I pay more Council tax than someone in a D property in a number of London boroughs.

I don’t understand how they work it out either.

My house is a tiny mid terrace 2 bed, no front garden. We pay £1570 a year thereabouts.

My dad lives in a bigger house (easily 3 times the size of mine) huge garden / drive etc and pays £200 a year less. Makes zero sense to me!

@Viviennemary

No I don't feel very sorry for a person thst lives in a house worth £1m but needs a £150 rebate.

The house can be 'worth' whatever somebody wants to pay for it, but that's fuck all use to the person or family living in it, who for various reasons need to stay in their home. It's not their fault other people have made money out of an essential need - housing.

And wrt London, like I said yesterday it has a huge amount of deprivation (some of the worst in the country, as per the link I posted). And often poor public services for those in need of support.

I'm sure there's an Age UK study knocking around that found London pensioners were the poorest in the UK. I must have a look.

Low tax has consequences. The post above mentioning Kensington and Chelsea. Yes, the borough of (very poorly maintained) Grenfell.

[quote roarfeckingroarr]@Tealightsandd fair, there are expensive Tory areas too. [/quote]
@roarfeckingroarr

I don't know if it's relevant at all but they were both safe constituency seats?