To be cranky about the £150 council tax rebate

[Notcontent]

I have been thinking a lot about this. I understand that the government was looking for a way to implement help with energy costs in the easiest way possible and that doing it through council tax bands seemed sensible as for the most part it does target the right people. But only for the most part. For example, in London there are lots of people who live in high value properties that are actually far from luxurious and who will miss out. For example, my elderly neighbour will miss out even though he deserves the help. He doesn’t have a lot of money - bought his house decades ago when the area was very cheap and lives very frugally. I know councils will get some extra money to distribute but that will be for only a small number of people.

These kinds of injustices really get to me, as I think when it comes to public money everyone should get equal treatment.

The confusing bit is using council tax as a means to subsidise heating costs. Its the huge rise in heating that could catch pensioners on a modest fixed income out.

We have a band E, I a small 4 bed from the 1980s. Houses less than 2 miles away are a lower band despite being worth considerably more - the impact of changing fashions, different school catchments and new developments. So yes I agree with OP it's a very clumsy way of assessing anything. Fortunately DH just got his first pay rise in a few years and I am able to pick up quite a bit of overtime when needed so we are fine and can cover rising costs for now.

The council tax bands need a massive overhaul. My 3 bed house is in band F whereas my neighbour's 5 bed is band D. His is an older semi detached property with a massive extension, whereas we are a small but detached new-build. Basing off 1991 values is ludicrous.

What about the fact that the discount is only for those in England op and that the other nations of the uk are excluded?

And if they do similar where I am, those in most rented accommodation will be excluded?

Rather than feeling sorry for your neighbour who owns his house in London outright?

Given how hard it is at the moment for many many people it’s hard to feel that sorry for someone in london who doesn’t get a £150 rebate as their house is just too expensive.

As others have said- If your biggest asset is your home and it’s too big for you you need to downsize.

I think you have to accept the fact that no system would be perfect and people will always fall through the gaps. If he chooses not to apply to a discretionary fund, that’s up to him

It irritates me when people criticise but don’t offer a better solution

How about being in one of the most deprived wards in the country yet paying one of the most expensive council tax. There’s quite a few areas of the country who pay far far more than the expensive London boroughs. For example while those in City of London pay £1049 a year council tax (band D), Wandsworth & Westminster pay even less than that. Kensington & Chelsea is £1331.

My mind is blown by this. A band C house down here in in Cornwall (where the average wage is about 25k) is £1800. £1049 per year is more than I paid 10 years ago on our band A home in a very small flat.

This doesn't make sense. If your (mythical) poor old neighbour's house is in a high band that means it was one of the more expensive properties in the UK in 1991 because that's what council tax is based on. It isn't in a higher band than it used to be because council tax has never been reassessed. Despite houses in some parts of the country increasing in value by 400%+.

So yeah basically OP don't worry. The situation you're talking about is a fantasy.

Could he eat less avocado op? It's supposed to work for young people priced out of the property market so might help for him too

There's a scheme set up so those who don't get council tax rebate can still get help towards elec/gas and food so don't feel bad! End of the day I'm sure his property is worth more than £150

@Timeyime

This doesn't make sense. If your (mythical) poor old neighbour's house is in a high band that means it was one of the more expensive properties in the UK in 1991 because that's what council tax is based on. It isn't in a higher band than it used to be because council tax has never been reassessed. Despite houses in some parts of the country increasing in value by 400%+.

So yeah basically OP don't worry. The situation you're talking about is a fantasy.

^ this.

Yabu

I struggle to feel sorry for anyone sitting on a million pound pile.

@ArtichokeAardvark yes. I'm also in a new build which apparently is worth thousands more than the "sought after period properties" that have loads bigger rooms and gardens. Banding is a right old racket when it comes to new builds and the entire thing is based on fiction so it's impossible to argue against.

Really if council tax is based on 1991 prices then everyone in new builds should be paying £0 because that's what their as yet non existent houses were worth at that time. But instead councils charge us what they would have been worth if they'd existed then or some such utter bollocks. Wankers.

In Wales the £200 energy bill thing is only available if you're on benefits.

No £150 council tax rebate for anyone.

There's never any help for people who work full time 🤬

These kinds of injustices really get to me, as I think when it comes to public money everyone should get equal treatment.

Believe me, if you currently live in London - with its exceptionally well funded schools, excellent public transport systems, museums, galleries etc - you don’t want public money to start being distributed ‘equally’; there would suddenly be much better amenities in the North and far fewer in London.

(Btw for the avoidance of doubt my new build is definitely not worth thousands more than the "sought after period properties" - it would actually go for around £80k less.)

Don't forget he'll already be getting heating allowance. He also probably isn't funding dependents or paying a mortgage/rent. Pensioner income has overtaken working population income in the last ten years
www.google.com/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/pensioner-incomes-overtake-those-of-working-age-10766204

YABU.

It's the people paying high rents, childcare costs etc with no assets or disposable income, unable to save for a deposit to buy a home I feel sorry for.

Not someone with hundreds of thousands of pounds of unearned wealth that he could get a lifetime mortgage on to supplement his income and easily pay his fuel bills etc if he doesn't want to move.

@ToastieSnowy

If he can’t afford it then he needs to sell his expensive home and downsize/ move location just like the rest of us would have to do.

How about being in one of the most deprived wards in the country yet paying one of the most expensive council tax. There’s quite a few areas of the country who pay far far more than the expensive London boroughs. For example while those in City of London pay £1049 a year council tax (band D), Wandsworth & Westminster pay even less than that. Kensington & Chelsea is £1331.

Yet Middlesbrough pay £2104, Gateshead £2145 and County Durham with all the old pit villages about the same.

Let’s start with equality in council tax payments first eh.

Absolutely agree. Londoners have no right to complain about council tax.

Plus he'll be getting free travel

@TheHoleNineYards

These kinds of injustices really get to me, as I think when it comes to public money everyone should get equal treatment.

Believe me, if you currently live in London - with its exceptionally well funded schools, excellent public transport systems, museums, galleries etc - you don’t want public money to start being distributed ‘equally’; there would suddenly be much better amenities in the North and far fewer in London.

This. The spend per head on just about everything is several times higher in London, even though facilities are already much better.

Eg Crossrail. What they spent on that could have gone a long way towards connecting Liverpool and Hull, via Leeds and Manchester with a high speed rail line to take freight pressure off the M62 and provide passenger services that don't take up to an hour and a half to travel around 35 miles between Leeds and Manchester.

For once this is something I'm happy about. We live in an ex council house in London on band C and we're certainly not rich. Makes a change working people actually get something back, it's middle income people who often get screwed over.

He can do some equity release then if it's paid off. You don't have to pay the interest - you can just take it all out of the estate.

Also very low on sympathy here. We are band D in a SW market town and the bill is over £2200.

@Notcontent
"He would not apply to the council as he is just not that sort of person - proud of being self sufficient."

He wouldn't apply to the council because he has no need to, not because he 'isnt that sort of person'. As said he's well protected as a pensioner. Why use him as an example when he wouldn't take whatever is on offer anyway? Many people for the first time ever have found themselves in financial trouble/claiming benefits because of lock down. That doesn't change the sort of people they are. You've given away what you really think about people who have to claim financial assistance.
Allow I do think that it should have been means tested.

@ApricotOeony
Your Sky News link is 5 years old.

Means testing apparently would have cost more than the handout but I don't understand why some people get so bothered when others get a handout - If I had all that internal energy to waste I'd aim it at the furlough fraudsters. As to being unhappy about the council-tax band your home is in, just query it and have it adjusted!