Megan Thee Stallion

[Ispini]

OK I’m showing my age but I have just seen some videos of this ‘musician/singer’, I’m completely stunned. How on earth are our kids supposed to have standards when this crap is being peddled as music.

In the olden days Madonna was a rebel, I feel so sorry for our girls as they see these ‘role models’ daily! Dreadful!

@SaySomethingMan

Right, so despite nobody having said anything remotely like any of that, black women artists are being sexually objectified by white women?

Or is women, both white and black but especially blank women, being sexualised and objectified in crude ways to sell entertainment - random thought here I know - actually down to a whole global history of white male oppression, misogyny and exploitation of women’s bodies?

It’s amazing how far some women will go to blame a culture of toxic sexism on other women rather than address the real source.

I watched an interview with Megan Thee Stallion a few months back and all I could think was what a lovely, cool, intelligent woman she seems.

@Snoozer11

I truly don't understand why all of these pop stars are so sexually charged.

Who is their target market?

Men and boys aren't big on bands like Little Mix. And if they want to see something "sexy", frankly they'd just watch porn.

Grown women will listen to these artists for the music. So they're not interested in their sexual dancing.

So they're doing all of this to appeal to teenage and preteen girls. And what's the point of that?

Please never go into science, you've drawn conclusions out of your ass

It seems that particularly white middle class women who have decided what feminism is have a problem with how black women artist perform

Tracy Chapman - Fantastic

Nicki Minaj- heads explode

Of course I’m sure that there are many black women that feel the same but there is no doubt that overtly sexual black women seem to anger a number of white feminists and they are so a little too passionate about it

And Asian and Muslim women are also expected to be a certain way if not they are down trodden and pitied

@EllaVaNight jimmy saville did a lot of charity work! Its a sad state of affairs when women still feel compelled to perform for the male gaze rather than just be themselves. We are going backwards in terms of female empowerment.

@Eightiesfan pardon?

Little girls were slut dropping

Or just dancing ….

We used to copy Hot Gossip the dancing was very sexualised we had no idea though

I wonder what MTS et al would make of this thread on a British parenting site frequented mostly by moms 🤣

Ladies, reel it in. If you’re upset by MTS you’re already too late. Your kids will be fine, don’t worry.

They are performing full stop. If the male gaze happens to go their way, so be it. They are in control of what happens to them.

I’ve literally just watched the channel 4 documentary about WAP and my female gaze is absolutely astounded by them.

@OhWhyNot

It seems that particularly white middle class women who have decided what feminism is have a problem with how black women artist perform

Tracy Chapman - Fantastic

Nicki Minaj- heads explode

Of course I’m sure that there are many black women that feel the same but there is no doubt that overtly sexual black women seem to anger a number of white feminists and they are so a little too passionate about it

And Asian and Muslim women are also expected to be a certain way if not they are down trodden and pitied

Except....yet again...nobody has said any of this. Where has this stuff about Asian and Muslim women come from?

You don't really seem to be listening to what people are actually saying. Trading on your own sexual objectification to make money isn't feminist when white women do it: it also doesn't become magically empowering when black women do it either.

There are plenty of artists, white and people of colour, men and women, who manage to make music but don't trade on presenting themselves either as sexist and objectifying, or as objects for a sexualised male gaze.

I simply cannot see how you think deliberately occupying the role of body/sex object is a great thing as long as you make your own money out of it. It simply reinforces the structures of a sexist society for everyone else, including other women and girls. That's the issue here. No-one is suggesting we ban Cardi B from putting out WAP. She can do as she likes: good for her and anyone who likes her music. But empowering and feminist it ain't.

My opinions have come from the many threads I have read on here

It’s not up to me or you to tell a women if they feel empowered or not or are they so dim they need others to tell them how they really feel

I find feminism on here very closed minded at times

Feminism is about what liberated girls and women. I don’t happen to feel empowered or liberated by hearing porn terms all over popular culture and I don’t think my 9 y o daughter is empowered by it becoming normalised to hear songs about pussy and videos of women’s arses in porn poses.

Unless - you think that’s super empowering for young women - any women - and has no bearing on the sexualised misogynistic culture we live in where rape convictions are so low it’s barely a crime, and every day we hear about some man who’s battered a young woman to death - has a sexualised porny music culture got nothing to do with that or the atmosphere young women are growing up in these days?

It’s all part of the porny image culture where bodies and being “sexy” and objectified are prized over everything else. That’s not a liberating culture for women, and I’m surprised you think it is.

She can do whatever she wants. It's her job. She really hasn't got kids it mind when she's performing.

And stop treated her like she's one dimensional. Are you defined by your job?

I'm pleased she's doing her thing. Because that's exactly it, it's her thing, not your thing, and certainly not your kid's thing, so what exactly is your problem?!

I thought it was your job as a parent to censor what music, videos, books and media your children consume, not policing grown adult women's choices to be wholesome so they can be "good" role models to your children. They seems um- quite misogynistic to me.

@OhWhyNot

Little girls were slut dropping

Or just dancing ….

We used to copy Hot Gossip the dancing was very sexualised we had no idea though

Not dancing, they were literally just doing the slut drop repeatedly. Granted they had probably seen in on YouTube or TV and not really thought anything other than they’d practice at the school disco. It was horrible to watch. It might be because I have 2 boys and have no idea of what little girls are interested in or how they like to dress when going out, but it completely destroyed my rose tinted vision of little girls in party dresses listening to Taylor Swift!

I recently watched the documentary series on All 4 about the Spice Girls. Clearly they were tame in comparison. But they were always being lectured by the press: they were bad role models, their brand of feminism wasn’t serious enough, they were irritating, too rich/ too poor/ too fat/too thin/too pregnant/too sexy/ not sexy enough and therefore having a negative influence on teenagers... It just felt so misogynistic. They were products of their time, place, economic system and culture- and they were treated like shit for it. I’m not a massive fan of the faux feminism empowerment stuff and I’m not going to claim it’s a major societal good, but I also think female artists can’t win.

@dratsnotyouagain

I thought it was your job as a parent to censor what music, videos, books and media your children consume, not policing grown adult women's choices to be wholesome so they can be "good" role models to your children. They seems um- quite misogynistic to me.

Rubbish - I don’t care about role models. I do care about it becoming normal for a porn aesthetic to be everywhere. You think it’s my job to censor the world for my daughter but it’s okay for young men to grow up thinking women are just objects who think only about sex, tits and pussy? That sounds far more misogynistic to me - like going back three centuries and expecting mothers to provide chaperones to protect the young ladies before they got married. Why can’t we just have music without constant porn?

There’s a line where appropriating something becomes pretty much indistinguishable from the original thing. If you’re appropriating a porn aesthetic but the end product is pretty much just porn aesthetic, does it matter who’s doing it or who’s ending up with the cash?

It’s by no means just black female artists either, Britney/Christina/Miley etc. etc. have all been doing this for years.
I feel equally uncomfortable about Lady Gaga, who I really wanted to like, but in the end her postmodern porn aesthetic schtick is still just inhabiting the same space that it’s pretending to subvert.

@foxgoosefinch

" If they are so ground breaking, why are other black women subject to misogyny and racism?"

You expect black female rappers to be able to remove misogyny and racism globally? Many countries across Africa are still very misogynistic etc. That would be an impossible task. A lot of women of colour enjoy shaking their arse because they are now celebrated. They can feel comfortable in their own skin. I'm mixed heritage, I've always had big thighs and butt. The messages all around me was that my body shape was wrong. Did Billy Eilish sell out? or did she do what a lot of young women do, wake up sexually and start to enjoy their body.

" I don’t think my 9 y o daughter is empowered by it becoming normalised to hear songs about pussy and videos of women’s arses in porn poses."

Your 9 year old shouldn't be watching those videos. She shouldn't have online unsupervised access. Does women singing about sex on their terms feed into the rape culture? The countries with the worse rape cultures are those were women can't be sexually open. Again are they just porn poses, or are they a mix of sex poses and dancing? Again there is a level of racism when critiquing twerk type dancing. Not every culture wants to ballroom/ tea dance.

"You think it’s my job to censor the world for my daughter but it’s okay for young men to grow up thinking women are just objects who think only about sex, tits and pussy? That sounds far more misogynistic to me - like going back three centuries and expecting mothers to provide chaperones to protect the young ladies before they got married"

That's what has to happen in those cultures were these videos wouldn't be watched. It's only the threat of getting a beating from the woman's male relatives that keeps them safe. I don't think that female rappers doing their thing are even adding to rape culture.

You must be joking, my 9 year old has never seen anything like that. But boys her age in her school have, and so has her 10 year old male cousin. And that’s the culture kids grow up in now.

Have you spoken to any young women lately? They fucking hate it. I teach 18-22 year olds and the women hate it, they hate the crappy porn aesthetic that is everywhere, and they pretty much all have some kind of mental health or body image or self harming issues and far too many of them tell me they have been sexually assaulted and that there is a culture of constant low level sexual harassment in schools and universities from the young men. I feel desperately sorry for them and pretty anxious for my own daughter growing up to navigate a world where the messages she’ll get is that she’s just a bum and a “pussy”.

But yeah, sure, constant porn imagery in popular culture has nothing to do with that

@VladmirsPoutine

You and anyone else who thinks this is a black vs white issue is deluded.

It's not a 'black' vs 'white' issue. It's a specific form of misogynoir white women are exceptionally skilled at perpetuating. If I had a penny for every time I'd witnessed it IRL and/or online I could probably pay the country's energy bills till 3033. Just look at how this thread has gone. Even the OP states that Madonna was merely a rebel but apparently Megan is ruining the children. That's right Megan is abusing the innocence of children - what an evil black woman. It's always the same schtick and no the 'My mother's best friend's neighbours dentist once walked passed a black man' defence isn't going to cut it. I'm half white - I don't care; white women are the issue.

@VladmirsPoutine 👏🏻 to everything you're saying

@PamelaDoov

They are performing full stop. If the male gaze happens to go their way, so be it. They are in control of what happens to them.

I’ve literally just watched the channel 4 documentary about WAP and my female gaze is absolutely astounded by them.

Ooooh, there’s a documentary on Channel 4? What’s it called.

LOVE Meghan Thee Stallion. She’s a real one. So is Cardi B.