To ask if you are a 'housewife' with no children?

[crochetmonkey74]

I know the term housewife is outdated so first off apologies.
I've always wondered about this , I had a great aunt and uncle who never had children but she never worked. I've always been interested in how this would be (been a bit of a fantasy of mine)
Do any of you have this life ? What is it like?

@DickMabutt73962

Feminism is for all women and don't bring the "mostly white, middle class" trope to bear. If you want an example of the archetype of white middle class motherhood, its being supported by your husband while you "potter" or volunteer or whatever.

Try not chucking out hoary old stereotypes and playing the class and race cards, if you don't want them thrown back in your face.

It's hardly ben thrown back in my face. As a black woman (in a domestic role, might I add, definitely not MC) I've been rolling my eyes at the references on this thread harking back to the times when women didn't work and what an effect it had on them and how fulfilling work is...when black women and working class women ALWAYS worked. The feminist movement wasn't a movement for us.

But I also know better than to expect an understanding of my experiences and point of view.

I don’t think the sort of person who uses terms like ‘playing the race card’ is ever really open to any dialogue about class or race, or in any way willing to entertain alternative points of view. She’s decided what feminism is and what it isn’t, what’s fulfilling and what’s not, which choices are right and which aren’t. And woe betide you if you disagree.

As a Black woman who has just been described as the ‘archetype of white middle class motherhood’, I’m now highly amused by this thread.

@Blossomtoes

I think having done that all my life I would look back and think "what a waste". I watched my mother do exactly this. I can only speak for myself but I stand by this.

To Have Succeeded

To laugh often and love much:
To win respect of intelligent people
And the affection of children;
To earn the approbation of honest critics
And endure the betrayal of false friends;
To appreciate beauty;
To find the best in others;
To give one's self;
To leave the world a little better,
Whether by a healthy child,
A garden patch,
Or redeemed social condition;
To have played and laughed with enthusiasm
And sung with exultation;
To know even one life has breathed easier
Because you have lived...
This is to have succeeded.

--Ralph Waldo Emerson

Every time I read that I think of my mum who stayed at home for 60 years. That doesn’t look like a waste to me.

Do you think that people who have jobs don’t do those things?

@MarshmallowSwede

And I find the “but what if he leaves you” mode for justifying why women should work as stupid. So what if he does leave… do people assume women don’t know how to legally protect their interests in a marriage?

You assume all married women don’t have safeguards in place for this? And if my husband did decide to leave I still would be fine not working.. because guess what. I have safeguards in place for that.

It’s extremely sexist to assume women are mindless and can’t look after ourselves if the man leaves. Men leave all the time. I still don’t want to work and so in a few weeks I’m leaving. I’m not going to do something I don’t want to do because he “might leave”. Ok. I’ll help him pack and I’ll still expect the house and living expenses to be covered. Because that’s how legally protected and financial interests work in marriage.. safeguards.

A man leaving doesn’t scare me enough to work to prove a point. I would have left work a long time ago but as we were living abroad I felt it was a good way to get out of the house. And some of us no matter how high our salary, do not place our sole identity and value to society on working.

On my deathbed no one from my company will be there to hold my hand. Not a single colleague will be there when I cross over. I won’t feel bad for not placing too much weight on paid labour I’m doing for someone else. It’s reciprocal and I can opt out any time.

If a woman wants to work and place her value on that then go for it. My issue is the judgement towards other women who choose not to do this.

As usual it’s always other women coming down on the heads of women who aren’t doing what they feel like is the “feminist ideal” way of doing things.

It’s nothing wrong with being financially dependent on your husband. If you can’t trust your spouse then you should not have married him in the first place. And I would hope should he leave you will be able to look after yourself in the worst case scenario.

People work for money. Your elf identity should be tied into who you are as a person and being a good person inside. So what you have a “high powered career”. What kind of person are you inside? Are you kind? Do you value nature and others? Are you kind to animals? Are you kind to children? My high salary means nothing in the scope of life other than I have a job that pays well. It doesn’t mean I’m better or anything. So much emphasis on something that in the scope of life enables you to buy things, but it does not mean you as a person are a good person. It doesn’t make you a better woman than a woman who stays at home.

Rich of you to say considering you’re jumping into housewifery from working & earning a high salary (with, I presume the savings to match). Most housewives aren’t in that position and for them, even working part time, is essential in protecting their state pension should they be widowed/divorced later in life.

@Boood Nobody is saying that people who have jobs don’t do those things. We’re saying that having a job isn’t a prerequisite for doing those things.

The Tory attitude is very much you’re not a decent person unless you Work Hard. Apparently that’s how you get a sense of pride.

It’s a very blanket message that’s filtered into the people.

@MarshmallowSwede

And I find the “but what if he leaves you” mode for justifying why women should work as stupid. So what if he does leave… do people assume women don’t know how to legally protect their interests in a marriage?

You assume all married women don’t have safeguards in place for this? And if my husband did decide to leave I still would be fine not working.. because guess what. I have safeguards in place for that.

It’s extremely sexist to assume women are mindless and can’t look after ourselves if the man leaves. Men leave all the time. I still don’t want to work and so in a few weeks I’m leaving. I’m not going to do something I don’t want to do because he “might leave”. Ok. I’ll help him pack and I’ll still expect the house and living expenses to be covered. Because that’s how legally protected and financial interests work in marriage.. safeguards.

A man leaving doesn’t scare me enough to work to prove a point. I would have left work a long time ago but as we were living abroad I felt it was a good way to get out of the house. And some of us no matter how high our salary, do not place our sole identity and value to society on working.

On my deathbed no one from my company will be there to hold my hand. Not a single colleague will be there when I cross over. I won’t feel bad for not placing too much weight on paid labour I’m doing for someone else. It’s reciprocal and I can opt out any time.

If a woman wants to work and place her value on that then go for it. My issue is the judgement towards other women who choose not to do this.

As usual it’s always other women coming down on the heads of women who aren’t doing what they feel like is the “feminist ideal” way of doing things.

It’s nothing wrong with being financially dependent on your husband. If you can’t trust your spouse then you should not have married him in the first place. And I would hope should he leave you will be able to look after yourself in the worst case scenario.

People work for money. Your elf identity should be tied into who you are as a person and being a good person inside. So what you have a “high powered career”. What kind of person are you inside? Are you kind? Do you value nature and others? Are you kind to animals? Are you kind to children? My high salary means nothing in the scope of life other than I have a job that pays well. It doesn’t mean I’m better or anything. So much emphasis on something that in the scope of life enables you to buy things, but it does not mean you as a person are a good person. It doesn’t make you a better woman than a woman who stays at home.

Amen!

@FabriqueBelgique but many of the tories don't work hard! They are independently wealthy. Its ok if you are rich apparently

This always makes me laugh: ZacvGoldsmith travelled throughout the world with the International Honours Programme (courtesy of his uncle Edward Goldsmith),[15] including to Thailand, New Zealand, Mexico, Hungary and Italy.

Yep they mean - plebs work hard and make us wealth.

@Giraffesandbottoms

If one half of the couple make a lot of money (more than is needed) then why would the other half go out to work if they didn’t have something they really wanted to do? To pacify the frothers on MN? If both halves of the couple are happy with the arrangement then who cares.

I feel very sad for people who would be bored because they can’t think of ways to fill their time without work.

This ^^

@FabriqueBelgique

The Tory attitude is very much you’re not a decent person unless you Work Hard. Apparently that’s how you get a sense of pride.

It’s a very blanket message that’s filtered into the people.

Yes, exactly this. A very neo-Lib attitude that says one’s worth as a human equates to one’s worth in the market economy. Meanwhile people who claim to be feminists are on here describing women who don’t work outside the home as both serfs and spongers, somehow.

@Boood

Honestly, I think anyone who chooses to fanny about “managing the household” while their partner works full time is lazy, spoilt and slightly inadequate. You can paint it how you like, the plain fact is that you aren’t even trying to contribute to keeping a roof over your head, and I personally would find that a bit shameful.

What a spiteful view to have. I am certainly not lazy, spoilt or inadequate in any manner I can assure you that.

@Growbean A pp described it as ‘shameful’. Some very odd, clearly deep seated concepts as to what constitutes a person’s worth have been aired on this thread. The language being used is also quite bizarrely melodramatic.

@Blossomtoes

I think having done that all my life I would look back and think "what a waste". I watched my mother do exactly this. I can only speak for myself but I stand by this.

To Have Succeeded

To laugh often and love much:
To win respect of intelligent people
And the affection of children;
To earn the approbation of honest critics
And endure the betrayal of false friends;
To appreciate beauty;
To find the best in others;
To give one's self;
To leave the world a little better,
Whether by a healthy child,
A garden patch,
Or redeemed social condition;
To have played and laughed with enthusiasm
And sung with exultation;
To know even one life has breathed easier
Because you have lived...
This is to have succeeded.

--Ralph Waldo Emerson

Every time I read that I think of my mum who stayed at home for 60 years. That doesn’t look like a waste to me.

thank you! I hadn't seen this and yes it says it all.

I always thought I would hate this but when I had a few months off between jobs I absolutely loved it! I pottered around, learned so much guitar, gardening, saw friends. I kept wondering how I had time to do a job 😆 sadly back in full time employment now (although I do love my job!)

It does indeed and obviously this is where marriage some protection. But by far the best and safest way for a woman to protect herself in this scenario is not to stop work in the first place.
I don't think anyone doubts this is the safest option. Life isn't as clear cut though. We don't always take the safe option. People take risks all the time, buying a house, starting a business, investing.

@AllThePogs

That is a very condescending post. 'Bumbling around'

I have had a high flying career and been a SAHM and once the children had left home a SAHW. All by choice, at various stages of our lives as a happily married couple. I enjoyed them all. We made choices that suited us.

I am now early (very early!) retired, and busy.

We have a cleaner, a gardener, and an ironing lady. My DH is a high flyer currently working from home after a long career with international travel.

I volunteer with the CAB, I attend the U3A, I lunch with friends, I visit my elderly MIL, visit our children for lunch or dinner, I exercise, I am learning two new languages. I paint a little and I did a second degree in Creative Writing, now I write with some minor success. I mentor in my previous field of work. I cook recipes that I never had time for previously, and I/we travel a lot.

I couldn't do most of the above when working due to time constraints.

So, not sure if any of that constitutes 'bumbling around'?

@CheltenhamLady bumbling is not an insult. It is the local word people here use for pottering. It means exactly the same thing.

@MeSanniesareBrannies at the description! I do quite like Black Mumsnet as it seems a world away from some of the things here and I do not despair; then again I didn't expect a conversation on a woman choosing to stay at home going this way

@AllThePogs, 'pottering; is still quite dismissive though isn't it? There is a definite subtext.

It implies that the things you do are unimportant, even aimless. That isn't what I do every day.

[quote AllThePogs]@CheltenhamLady bumbling is not an insult. It is the local word people here use for pottering. It means exactly the same thing.[/quote]
I don’t think @CheltenhamLady is pottering either. That’s a very full and busy life.

[quote AllThePogs]@CheltenhamLady bumbling is not an insult. It is the local word people here use for pottering. It means exactly the same thing.[/quote]
So, you’ve started an entire new thread about passive aggressive and veiled middle class insults because you didn’t like how people were speaking to you on this one…but are still here telling women who stay at home that they are ‘bumbling’ and ‘pottering’? And we’re supposed to be fine with that because you (the arbiter of what is and is not insulting) have decided so?

This is truly too ridiculous.

[quote DickMabutt73962]@MeSanniesareBrannies at the description! I do quite like Black Mumsnet as it seems a world away from some of the things here and I do not despair; then again I didn't expect a conversation on a woman choosing to stay at home going this way [/quote]
If it weren’t for BMN, this site would be unbearable, sometimes. And, yes, this thread has gone in a wholly unexpected direction! 😂

@MarshmallowSwede

Fantastic post

I'd love to be a housewife. I currently work two days and that's two days too many. Some of you must seriously be lacking in imagination if you can't think of anything better you could fill your time with than sitting in the office all day. The possibilities are endless!
Doubt there are many people who look back on their life and wish they had spent more time at work.