To ask if you are a 'housewife' with no children?

[crochetmonkey74]

I know the term housewife is outdated so first off apologies.
I've always wondered about this , I had a great aunt and uncle who never had children but she never worked. I've always been interested in how this would be (been a bit of a fantasy of mine)
Do any of you have this life ? What is it like?

There is this pernicious attitude that only paid work 'contributes'. It's just wrong-headed. And sexist, as much of this kind of work is basically gendered female. And illogical; I've already said this, but people quite routinely pay strangers to provide e.g. cleaning, food, laundry, holiday-sorting, social plans etc. So why if a female partner/spouse does the same is it dismissed as not really contributing?

There is also an attitude, as I pointed out at the beginning that cooking, cleaning, laundry etc only counts as work or contributing to the household if you have children.

My gran had 2 jobs in the 1940s even with 3 kids to look after because she hated this outdated sort of belief that women should look after the home.

Personally I'd be bored stiff if I was sat on my arse or fannying around all day. I think the only way this would be acceptable is if I had so much money that neither of us had to work so my DP was also 'at leisure'. We could just swan around as we pleased then and it would probably be amazing.
It would be nice to have a clean tidy home though .

If one half of the couple make a lot of money (more than is needed) then why would the other half go out to work if they didn’t have something they really wanted to do? To pacify the frothers on MN? If both halves of the couple are happy with the arrangement then who cares.

I feel very sad for people who would be bored because they can’t think of ways to fill their time without work.

@Boood

Honestly, I think anyone who chooses to fanny about “managing the household” while their partner works full time is lazy, spoilt and slightly inadequate. You can paint it how you like, the plain fact is that you aren’t even trying to contribute to keeping a roof over your head, and I personally would find that a bit shameful.

Ah there it is the put down of women who are at home with nasty generalization 🙄

A lot of jealousy and bitterness on this thread

I am, kids flown the nest. I love it. I have several hobbies, do some charity work, go to classes and lunch with my friends. I hate housework, so have help with that.
My life is full on busy, but with happy things.

@CounsellorTroi

There is this pernicious attitude that only paid work 'contributes'. It's just wrong-headed. And sexist, as much of this kind of work is basically gendered female. And illogical; I've already said this, but people quite routinely pay strangers to provide e.g. cleaning, food, laundry, holiday-sorting, social plans etc. So why if a female partner/spouse does the same is it dismissed as not really contributing?

There is also an attitude, as I pointed out at the beginning that cooking, cleaning, laundry etc only counts as work or contributing to the household if you have children.

I took it to mean that this domestic load is likely to be quite light in a household of two adults, and more likely to be enough to fill a day with nothing else if there are kids involved. Kids generate more work 🤷‍♀️

If both halves of the couple are happy with the arrangement then who cares.

No one... while this continues to work. The point is quite often this arrangement breaks down and the half of the couple who has not gone out to work (which is usually the woman) is unable to support herself.

@thepeopleversuswork

Depends what financial measures people have in place to protect themselves.

I suppose I do probably do think that anyone who spends no time at all in the workplace from say their 20s all the way through to their 80s will, by even halfway through that period, have fairly comprehensively lost touch with 'the modern world', and by the end of it be entirely detached. But then so might lots of people who work, especially if their job doesn't bring them into contact with other people, like, for want of a better example, a lighthousekeeper or something. In the end it must come down, I suppose, to what you do with the time.

If “running a household” was genuinely anything even approaching a full-time commitment, then households where everyone worked full time would not be able to cope. They would be walking around unfed, in dirty clothes, permanently terrified because nobody had time to renew the insurance. This is patently not the case.

@Giraffesandbottoms

It does indeed and obviously this is where marriage some protection. But by far the best and safest way for a woman to protect herself in this scenario is not to stop work in the first place.

@loveliesbleeding1

mesanniearebrannies You’re so right, I don’t care what anyone says and the insinuation that I’m going to be destitute if my husband leaves me (which made me giggle,as he knows how lucky he is) just shows how it’s been driven into women that being a Mum/housewife isn’t enough.

oh but no! SAHM is fine.....because women are for making children!

I don't know about being a housewife but I could totally be extremely wealthy and my job is running the big estate we live on.

SAHM is fine.....because women are for making children!

Sheesh, you can't win with some people.

But by far the best and safest way for a woman to protect herself in this scenario is not to stop work in the first place

Sure but equally it’s a bit pointless working in case shit goes tits up, if you are loaded. Better to just get a decent pos-nup in place and enjoy your life.

*post-nup

@DrSbaitso

SAHM is fine.....because women are for making children!

Sheesh, you can't win with some people.

well that's what this thread is about......women without children who don't work outside the home.

I was. But I was unable to work. I filled my time with hobbies.

[quote thepeopleversuswork]@MeSanniesareBrannies

I'm not asking you to "scamper about" doing anything: you accused me of saying paid labour is the only way to achieve fulfilment, I'm simply rebutting this. I have said I think work gives people skills and benefits which are helpful for life, but its by no means the only way to achieve fulfilment.

"Full potential" is hard to define and everyone's definition will be difficult. You may or may not get fulfilment from working in Tesco depending whether you like your job. But you will at least know you can support yourself.

For me the absolute central point here is financial autonomy. You can't be free if you are entirely dependent on your husband's money. That trumps all other considerations for me.

On a slightly unrelated matter, the point of the OP was to ask whether people enjoyed being a housewife. Lots of people have piled on to say they think running a household is a valid choice for a woman. This is a silly argument because everything is a "valid choice" if it works for you. Personally I wouldn't find it fulfilling, because I think having done that all my life I would look back and think "what a waste". I watched my mother do exactly this. I can only speak for myself but I stand by this.[/quote]
My comment, to which you responded - I did not tag you or seek you out, said that it was sad that some women didn’t realise that other women wanted different things. Your response was that all choices weren’t equal, women had had fought (and died) for the right to work and that being a housewife did not allow women to explore their ‘full potential’ (your term, not mine, so perhaps you should define it).

My rebuttal is that you do not get to decide the validity of other women’s choices and that stating that all employment offers a level of fulfilment beyond that achieved by all women who choose not to work is utterly nonsensical.

You are now attempting to move the goalposts to ‘at least you’ll be supporting yourself’ and financial autonomy. That may be important to you, it’s not important to all women.

If you personally wouldn’t find it fulfilling, that’s grand. Don’t do it. Nobody is trying to make you. I certainly haven’t stated that you should. Nor have I ‘piled on’ about anything, I’ve directly responded to what you’ve said to me. Yes, you can only speak for yourself, which is what you should do. This exchange is happening because you decided to pass judgement on the validity of others choices and the fulfilment they derive from said choices, and that’s both foolish and close minded.

@DickMabutt73962

Have you even thought about what you’re saying? Is working the till at Tesco ‘developing women to their full potential’? Of working in a call centre? No? So, is it only middle class professional careers that women should be aiming for to explore ‘the full extent of their capabilities’? Nothing else will do?

That's exactly the tone I got from the PP as well. Once again shining a light on the fact that 'feminism', as expressed by Mumsnet, is a very narrow lens seen through the eyes of middle class mostly white women

Honestly. It’s a deeply myopic world view and they’re not self aware enough to realise it.

@Imyourvenus

I just can’t fathom why anyone would want this. I’d be bored shitless.

Being able to do whatever I want, when I want, I'd never be bored!

I think having done that all my life I would look back and think "what a waste". I watched my mother do exactly this. I can only speak for myself but I stand by this.

To Have Succeeded

To laugh often and love much:
To win respect of intelligent people
And the affection of children;
To earn the approbation of honest critics
And endure the betrayal of false friends;
To appreciate beauty;
To find the best in others;
To give one's self;
To leave the world a little better,
Whether by a healthy child,
A garden patch,
Or redeemed social condition;
To have played and laughed with enthusiasm
And sung with exultation;
To know even one life has breathed easier
Because you have lived...
This is to have succeeded.

--Ralph Waldo Emerson

Every time I read that I think of my mum who stayed at home for 60 years. That doesn’t look like a waste to me.

And I find the “but what if he leaves you” mode for justifying why women should work as stupid. So what if he does leave… do people assume women don’t know how to legally protect their interests in a marriage?

You assume all married women don’t have safeguards in place for this? And if my husband did decide to leave I still would be fine not working.. because guess what. I have safeguards in place for that.

It’s extremely sexist to assume women are mindless and can’t look after ourselves if the man leaves. Men leave all the time. I still don’t want to work and so in a few weeks I’m leaving. I’m not going to do something I don’t want to do because he “might leave”. Ok. I’ll help him pack and I’ll still expect the house and living expenses to be covered. Because that’s how legally protected and financial interests work in marriage.. safeguards.

A man leaving doesn’t scare me enough to work to prove a point. I would have left work a long time ago but as we were living abroad I felt it was a good way to get out of the house. And some of us no matter how high our salary, do not place our sole identity and value to society on working.

On my deathbed no one from my company will be there to hold my hand. Not a single colleague will be there when I cross over. I won’t feel bad for not placing too much weight on paid labour I’m doing for someone else. It’s reciprocal and I can opt out any time.

If a woman wants to work and place her value on that then go for it. My issue is the judgement towards other women who choose not to do this.

As usual it’s always other women coming down on the heads of women who aren’t doing what they feel like is the “feminist ideal” way of doing things.

It’s nothing wrong with being financially dependent on your husband. If you can’t trust your spouse then you should not have married him in the first place. And I would hope should he leave you will be able to look after yourself in the worst case scenario.

People work for money. Your elf identity should be tied into who you are as a person and being a good person inside. So what you have a “high powered career”. What kind of person are you inside? Are you kind? Do you value nature and others? Are you kind to animals? Are you kind to children? My high salary means nothing in the scope of life other than I have a job that pays well. It doesn’t mean I’m better or anything. So much emphasis on something that in the scope of life enables you to buy things, but it does not mean you as a person are a good person. It doesn’t make you a better woman than a woman who stays at home.