COW

[Suzi888]

chooseveg.com/blog/documentary-cow/

Anyone watched this… I can’t bring myself to watch it, but it’ll be coming to cinemas shortly.

What is the best milk substitute you have tried? Specifically when added to tea, I don’t mind the substitutes in cereal but my tea tastes grim without milk.

Have been dairy free for a long time now. Have probably tried every alt milk going. Oatly Barista is good but questionable company. I now get a case of 6 cartons delivered every fortnight from Minor Figures. Their organic barista oat milk is the best I’ve tried.

[quote twinkletoesimnot]@shedevill
Why not ask the abbatoir / factory farm?

Don't generalise. There are some good farms and farmers around, who incidentally are trying their best against all odds.

[/quote]
'some' - yes, some. Hugely in the minority. I don't have the figures to hand and I don't want to lose this thread, but intensive pig factory farming in the UK is 90-plue percent, same with chickens, to the very best of my recollection. Vast majority is a very fair basis for your so-called generalisations!!!!!!

@Scrowy lmao what predators in the UK go for cows? In the US where there are actually animals that go for cows the number of deaths are really really low.

Only 20 years ago so can't think things will have changed too much since then

Well they have. Why not do a little research before posting?

[quote Croissantly]@Scrowy lmao what predators in the UK go for cows? In the US where there are actually animals that go for cows the number of deaths are really really low.[/quote]
maggots

Any supermarket unsweetened soya milk for tea. Long life, whatever. Aldi is cheap and cheerful.
Oat milk is better for coffee

@HikingforScenery

I’ve been drinking non-dairy milk for about 13years, the quality was pretty grim but I got used to it. These days there is so much variety. I’ve simply lost enjoyment for meat also. I’m not sure how it happened. It just tastes ‘dead’. I can’t explain it. DH thinks it’s rather silly because of course it’s dead

Once the cognitive dissonance melts away and you realise it's decaying flesh then yes it tends to not taste quite the same.

Oatily barista in coffee and tea

My stats were a bit off after research, but only 3% of pigs live their entire lives with outdoor access. Generally speaking, now over 70% of all UK animals are reared in intensive/factory systems. It's nice and cuddly to talk about old McDonald's 5-cow neighbour's farm, but it is not reflective of reality.

@Rupertpenrysmistress

Thank you for this. I did not realise this was how we got milk. I feel physically sick now. I do use almond milk alot but have never found a good alternative for tea. I was not overly impressed with the alpro cuppa but perhaps I need to persevere. I will try to remove dairy from my diet after this.

I don't eat much meat and try to get free range and organic but might consider going vegetarian.

Any other good suggestions for tea,I do love my cuppa.

@Rupertpenrysmistress try Oatley Barista long life, in the UHT section in the supermarket. The grey one. It's lovely in tea and coffee.

Oatly barista is best for tea

Cheese wise - I’d avoid all non dairy cheese for a month or two and then try some of the ones that are nut based rather than coconut oil. Ones like Nush cream cheese is excellent and their are some amazing brands on the vegan kind supermarket.

Thank you for this thread. I became vegan when I breastfed my daughter and suddenly realised that cows only have milk because they have babies stolen from them - I’ll never touch it again.

@derxa

not but heifer and fresian cows A heifer is a young cow and we don't have many Friesian cows any more. My grandather was one of the first farmers to import Friesians from Holland in the 1930s. Before that it was mainly Ayrshire cows in this country.

Of course. I mean Holstein. I grew up on a dairy farm, I should know better!

@Suzi888

chooseveg.com/blog/documentary-cow/

Anyone watched this… I can’t bring myself to watch it, but it’ll be coming to cinemas shortly.

What is the best milk substitute you have tried? Specifically when added to tea, I don’t mind the substitutes in cereal but my tea tastes grim without milk.

I finally got used to almond milk in my tea. It took a while, but power through. I can't bear cow's milk in tea now.

[quote UpintNorth]@Lovemylittlebear thanks for your note on cheese. This week we are trailling 2 types of plant and oat miles in our house and I’ve already cut out cows milk in tea and coffee. Gave up beef months ago.

Is there such a thing as a diary free alternative to cream does anybody know?[/quote]
There's a plant based elmlea and alpro do a soya single cream. Both are awful though in my opinion.

Out of interest what do you think the highlight of the day would be for a free roaming wild cow?

.... didn't get eaten by a predator again, perhaps?

This is the issue, humans assuming cows being milked 2 x a day somehow have a boring/ unfulfilled/ forced life.

The reality is they are mostly safe and warm in a shed, have feed and water on tap and get any ailments treated.

In comparison to a wild cow who, eats all day, if they can find food, drinks, i they can find water then goes to sleep and hope nothing tries to eat them at some point?

why do people not get that being “wildlife” is hard. However grim you think an abattoir is it’s got to be nicer than starving to death or being eaten alive.
Also where are wild cows going to live exactly. Who’s paying for the vet when they get into trouble or even keeping an eye on them. The the kind thing to do is put them down at the end anyway. So humans decide their death anyway.
Vegan cheese is made from foreign oil in factories. How is that more in tune with environment. It’s a step away from the natural world. The farmers out in all weathers everyday are way more in tune with life and nature. It’s why they farm

@Scrowy

I'm not going to get more involved in this because I'm so tired of debating with people who's only experience of farming is something they have watched on YouTube.

Go to an actual farm. See for yourself. Open Farm Sunday is on the 12th June this year.

I grew up on a dairy farm. We had a large herd of milk cows. We treated them really well. BUT we did remove hours old calves from mother's, we did send bullocks to slaughter. You cannot deny that both those things are normal in a large scale milk farm. My parents sold up when things started getting worse for farmers but I can't imagine practices have got much better since then - and nothing I've heard from the farmers I still know has me thinking differently.

I personally would rather not exist than be bred into existence to be brutalised, have my babies stolen year after year and then have my throat slit for someone’s pie.

So I’m not worried about farm animals’dying out’ as they are literally born to be killed.

Not all vegan cheese is made from foreign oil - and you can easily make it at home from nuts

@Scrowy

or months at a time because it’s too much trouble for the farmer to round them up, when the weather gets colder

You having a laugh! Farmers love summer, its easy peasy. Cows outside, eat grass, drink water, check them once a day. Lovely.

Cows inside for winter - absolute ball ache. Feed in the morning with silage. Smelly, job, hard work. Then muck cows out. If its dropped below zero unfreeze all the pipes and break the ice on the water trough. Spread the muck back onto the fields once a week. But only in certain weather conditions. Check during the day, not fine, one stuck in cubicles, the bulls tried to jump the gate to get to a cow that is bulling. Check again throughout the day, feed again at night. Every day, 7 days a week. FOR MONTHS

Where do people dream up this absolute crap from?

This is directly opposite my house and I talk to the farmer, plus I see other farmers some of which who let them cows out in nicer weather and have food for them outside.

I have been in this barn as we have taken over water when his supply runs out and helped fix this barn when the metal sheets fall in.

It’s a dark prison for months of the year and not a great existence for them and as for checking multiple times a day.... once a day if they are lucky and I know this as I work from home and with no passing traffic I hear the tractor. The old muck goes on the fields after the cows get put into the barn in October time so once a year.

And a lot of the black plastic that is used to wrap the bales is picked up my myself or DH and put in our bin before it ends up blowing from the road to the fields.

These are the same cows that when they are in the field have worked out how to escape as the gate is tied together with string and trample my garden if I forget to shut our gate.

I may not be a farmer but this is opposite my house and I herd up his stray sheep and cows and put them back on his fields to keep them safe.

I get the alpro soya 50g of Protein one. I drink coffee and it makes it taste stronger/thicker. Can’t describe it but I have always drunk instant coffee and I don’t mind it (I find I love the smell of fresh coffee but it always seems to have a strong but then watery after taste)
When I make my coffee only every so often did I think that the coffee I had made was just right.
Bought the added protein soya milk a few months ago and now every cup tastes perfect.

Is there such a thing as a diary free alternative to cream does anybody know

There's an Alpro single cream (I think either near the cartons of soya milk or UHT)
And if you want a whipped cream substitute , tinned coconut milk, chilled , pour of the watery but and whisk it . Takes a while but you get a very nice (though very high fat) 'cream'

I tried oat milk , needs a good shake but I found it was very watery so had to add the oatmilk to boiling water then add coffee gradually .
I use Alpro soya in coffee/tea/hot chocolat ( Hotel Chocolat do a vegan one)
Not keen on nut milks in hot drinks , they taste 'off' to me .

I use Oatly Barista for my coffee - I don’t drink tea - and supermarket own brand unsweetened soya milk (for it’s nutritional qualities) for cereal/porridge/custard etc.

Almond milk is nice in Earl Grey.
I used to drink pea milk but it does have a strong taste so not for everyone.

Oatly is actually quite bad for the environment- hemp is better. Never almond milk either- that’s bad for bees.

Is there such a thing as a diary free alternative to cream does anybody know?

Alpro single cream, Elmlea, Oatley whipping cream, Flora plant cream & Food Heaven whipped cream.

We either buy Alpro or Elmlea. I also love the whipped cream.

I drink almond milk as really struggle with the others. However, almond milk is the least sustainable so I feel bad! Any alternative to almond? X