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What about... Still enjoying Boris' downfall Part 4. The one with the report released?

999 replies

jgw1 · 28/01/2022 17:14

Part 4

OP posts:
LittleBearPad · 30/01/2022 18:36

[quote GreenLunchBox]This article in the Spectator is great if you fancy sine Schadenfreude tonight. Apologies if already posted

www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-real-reason-boris-is-unfit-to-be-prime-minister[/quote]
Bear in mind the Spectator is a Tory magazine.

FatFredsFriedEgg · 30/01/2022 18:37

[quote Clavinova]civil service profligate catering

Some links here:

December 2007
Official figures show almost half a million pounds has been spent by government departments on Christmas festivities in the last five years.

And more than £125,000 of public money has been used for cards, parties and decorations at Whitehall parties in 2007 alone.

www.politics.co.uk/news/2007/12/22/whitehall-xmas-costs-revealed/

December 2008 - although partygoers paid £30 each for their ticket;

Whitehall mandarins in charge of saving Britain from the economic slump drank whisky and danced the night away at the Treasury on the day the recession was officially confirmed.

More than 100 civil servants who work for Scots-born Chancellor Alistair Darling took part in a Burns Night party at the Treasury.

They drank large quantities of white wine and whisky, ate haggis and danced until close to midnight, prompting complaints from other officials who were still hard at work trying to deal with the economic crisis.
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1127273/Knees-Treasury-Britain-plunges-recession.html

July 2009
Loosening our belts at the taxpayers' expense.

The season of drinks and lobby parties is a chance for Whitehall to keep its enemies in the press close – and for the PM's wife to Tweet about it all.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2009/jul/09/bill-blanko-whitehall-summer-parties

spouses/partners in the workplace

September 2009
Sarah Brown, PM's wife, has increasing influence on UK politics.

Future MP? Gordon Brown's wife Sarah has an increasing influence over Downing Street affairs.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2009/sep/20/sarah-brown-fashion-charity-mp[/quote]
Is the PM's DP having an "increasing influence on UK politics" the same as them making a 'work gathering' a criminal offence by virtue of their attendance then?

GreenLunchBox · 30/01/2022 18:38

Roll out. Fastest roll out in Europe. The article below explains why other places have now overtaken us but surely you can agree getting those first vaccines into the vulnerable swiftly was of vital importance?

It was us in the NHS that rolled it out, Janey. You're welcome

DuncinToffee · 30/01/2022 18:39

Were we in lockdown in 2007 and 2009 clavinova?

Notonthestairs · 30/01/2022 18:39

Well in house event/catering at No 10 was certainly busy during the pandemic.

The clearly drank the place dry - thank heavens for the Coop and Tesco's.

Clavinova · 30/01/2022 18:40

FatFredsFriedEgg

I haven't seen Sue Gray's report yet.

GreenLunchBox · 30/01/2022 18:41

Bear in mind the Spectator is a Tory magazine.

That Bozo used to edit too! Grin. He must have been on good terms with them at some point in the recent past because didn't Cummings' wife work for them when the whole Barnard castle thing came out? They were sympathetic to him.

Awesome Grin

Alexandra2001 · 30/01/2022 18:43

[quote JaniieJones]'I didn't say it wasn't, though with the highest death toll in Europe, one has to question where we went wrong?'

Well per million Belgium and Italy have the highest toll and at 2275 sad deaths per million we aren't much different to France and Spain.

www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/[/quote]
No other european country has over 150k deaths though, inc France with a similar pop. and Germany with far more people and around 35% less deaths... why is this?

No good taking the praise for things done well but not addressing things done badly... or is that for yet another inquiry.. sometime never!

Belgium is hardly comparable and Italy was hit first and hardest, we should have learnt from their errors.

cakeorwine · 30/01/2022 18:47

So...

Do we think the report will be out tomorrow?
What time will it be published?
Will it be redacted with black markers or just a slimmed down version?
Will Johnson go to Ukraine on the day it comes out?

derxa · 30/01/2022 18:47

@longwayoff

Derxa posted some of Marina Hyde's 'family tree' on here the other day, supposedly proof that MH is too 'posh' to write a deleterious opinion piece about Bozo. Now Bozo's not posh? Derxa, do you have Bozo's family tree to hand? He's descended from more European aristocracy than you could number and is probably more connected than our royal family. Trampling on the proles for centuries; might be genetic.
Yes he certainly has interesting ancestors. *Johnson is the eldest of the four children of Stanley Johnson, a former Conservative member of the European Parliament and an employee of the European Commission and the World Bank, and the painter Charlotte Johnson Wahl (née Fawcett),[21] the daughter of Sir James Fawcett, a barrister[748][749] and president of the European Commission of Human Rights.[750] His younger siblings are Rachel Johnson, a writer and journalist; Leo Johnson, a partner specialising in sustainability at accountancy firm PricewaterhouseCoopers;[751] and Jo Johnson, ex-minister of state and former Conservative MP for Orpington, who resigned from his brother's government in September 2019[476] and is now a member of the House of Lords. Johnson's stepmother, Jenny, the second wife of his father Stanley, is the stepdaughter of Teddy Sieff, the former chairman of Marks & Spencer.[752] Having been a member of the Conservatives between 2008 and 2011, Rachel Johnson joined the Liberal Democrats in 2017.[753] She stood as a candidate for Change UK in the 2019 European Elections.[754] Johnson also has two half-siblings, Julia and Maximilian, through his father's later marriage to Jennifer Kidd.[755][756] Johnson is the eldest of the four children of Stanley Johnson, a former Conservative member of the European Parliament and an employee of the European Commission and the World Bank, and the painter Charlotte Johnson Wahl (née Fawcett),[21] the daughter of Sir James Fawcett, a barrister[748][749] and president of the European Commission of Human Rights.[750] His younger siblings are Rachel Johnson, a writer and journalist; Leo Johnson, a partner specialising in sustainability at accountancy firm PricewaterhouseCoopers;[751] and Jo Johnson, ex-minister of state and former Conservative MP for Orpington, who resigned from his brother's government in September 2019[476] and is now a member of the House of Lords. Johnson's stepmother, Jenny, the second wife of his father Stanley, is the stepdaughter of Teddy Sieff, the former chairman of Marks & Spencer.[752] Having been a member of the Conservatives between 2008 and 2011, Rachel Johnson joined the Liberal Democrats in 2017.[753] She stood as a candidate for Change UK in the 2019 European Elections.[754] Johnson also has two half-siblings, Julia and Maximilian, through his father's later marriage to Jennifer Kidd.[755][756]

Johnson's paternal great-grandfather was the Ottoman journalist Ali Kemal who was of Turkish origin[757][758][759] and a secular Muslim. Johnson's paternal grandfather, Wilfred Johnson, Ali Kemal's son, was an RAF pilot in Coastal Command during the Second World War.[760] His father's other ancestry includes English, German and French; one of his German ancestors was said to be the illegitimate daughter of Prince Paul of Württemberg and thus a descendant of King George II of Great Britain.[761] This would make him and Elizabeth II sixth cousins twice removed. Through Mary of Teck's connection to Duke Frederick II Eugene of Württemberg, they would in that case also have a closer genealogical link as fifth cousins twice removed. Johnson's mother is the granddaughter of Elias Avery Lowe, a palaeographer, who was a Russian Jewish immigrant to the US,[762] and Pennsylvania-born Helen Tracy Lowe-Porter, a translator of Thomas Mann.[763] Referring to his varied ancestry, Johnson has described himself as a "one-man melting pot" with a combination of Abrahamic religious great-grandparents.[764] Johnson was given the middle name "Boris" after a White Russian émigré named Boris Litwin, who was a friend of his parents.[20] An episode of Who Do You Think You Are? explored the German origins of his middle name Pfeffel.[5][765][766] Through this family line, Johnson is a descendant in the seventh generation of Anna Catharina Bischoff, whose mummified corpse was found in 1975 and identified in 2018.[767][768] Johnson's paternal great-grandfather was the Ottoman journalist Ali Kemal who was of Turkish origin[757][758][759] and a secular Muslim. Johnson's paternal grandfather, Wilfred Johnson, Ali Kemal's son, was an RAF pilot in Coastal Command during the Second World War.[760] His father's other ancestry includes English, German and French; one of his German ancestors was said to be the illegitimate daughter of Prince Paul of Württemberg and thus a descendant of King George II of Great Britain.[761] This would make him and Elizabeth II sixth cousins twice removed. Through Mary of Teck's connection to Duke Frederick II Eugene of Württemberg, they would in that case also have a closer genealogical link as fifth cousins twice removed. Johnson's mother is the granddaughter of Elias Avery Lowe, a palaeographer, who was a Russian Jewish immigrant to the US,[762] and Pennsylvania-born Helen Tracy Lowe-Porter, a translator of Thomas Mann.[763] Referring to his varied ancestry, Johnson has described himself as a "one-man melting pot" with a combination of Abrahamic religious great-grandparents.[764] Johnson was given the middle name "Boris" after a White Russian émigré named Boris Litwin, who was a friend of his parents.[20] An episode of Who Do You Think You Are? explored the German origins of his middle name Pfeffel.[5][765][766] Through this family line, Johnson is a descendant in the seventh generation of Anna Catharina Bischoff, whose mummified corpse was found in 1975 and identified in 2018.[767][768]*
My point is that Marina and Boris are cut from the same cloth. Self interested and talented journalists who know how to write for their particular audience. I don't think either of them have a strong social conscience or altruism

Alexandra2001 · 30/01/2022 18:47

@JaniieJones

and deaths per million we aren't much different to France and Spain

The difference between France and the UK is over 20k deaths, now 20k people dying may be nothing to you...

jgw1 · 30/01/2022 18:49

@cakeorwine

*The jobs one is interesting - when you look at the underlying stats, it's clear that it's not that Johnson and his Ministers are misleading people

Clear they are misleading people.....

Johnson misleading people surely not?

When Rishi and Boris' tax rises come in, plus the changes to the cap in energy fuel prices no amount of spouting off about some cherry picked statistics is going to be very convincing.

OP posts:
jgw1 · 30/01/2022 18:50

[quote Alexandra2001]@JaniieJones

and deaths per million we aren't much different to France and Spain

The difference between France and the UK is over 20k deaths, now 20k people dying may be nothing to you...[/quote]
But Keir Starmer had a beer at work.

OP posts:
BewareTheLibrarians · 30/01/2022 18:51

On Gordon Brown and speeches and “here’s what you could have won”.

“Only those that have held the office of prime minister can understand the full weight of its responsibilities and its great capacity for good.
I have been privileged to learn much about the very best in human nature and a fair amount too about its frailties, including my own.
Above all, it was a privilege to serve. And yes, I loved the job not for its prestige, its titles and its ceremony - which I do not love at all. No, I loved the job for its potential to make this country I love fairer, more tolerant, more green, more democratic, more prosperous and more just – truly a greater Britain. […] I have always strived to serve, to do my best in the interest of Britain, its values and its people.”

amp.theguardian.com/politics/2010/may/11/gordon-brown-resignation-speech

Food for thought for Boris, if he wasn’t already so full of cake.

FatFredsFriedEgg · 30/01/2022 18:54

@Clavinova

FatFredsFriedEgg

I haven't seen Sue Gray's report yet.

You don't need to see it. If anyone was present that wasn't 'reasonably necessary' to be there for work purposes then everyone present at the 'gathering' (on June 19 2020) was committing a criminal offence. That's what the law says.

Whatever any report says, or indeed whether the Met or CPS choose to act, is immaterial. The law is quite clear.

Clavinova · 30/01/2022 18:55

Germany with far more people and around 35% less deaths...why is this?

Germany only had 10,000 deaths in the first wave - now they have 118,000. Germany did 'fence in' some housing estates with foreign workers in the first wave; 2,000 people 'fenced in' here - not something I would recommend:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53177628

Peregrina · 30/01/2022 18:58

My point is that Marina and Boris are cut from the same cloth. Self interested and talented journalists who know how to write for their particular audience. I don't think either of them have a strong social conscience or altruism

I didn't know that Marina was an MP, let alone the Prime Minister. I don't doubt that she's well paid, but her columns are funny and she is probably sensible enough to stick to that.

Peregrina · 30/01/2022 19:00

BewareTheLibrarians - I don't doubt that those are views that Major, and May would also subscribe to.

Cameron - ??? Blair also ????

itsgettingweird · 30/01/2022 19:01

[quote Clavinova]Germany with far more people and around 35% less deaths...why is this?

Germany only had 10,000 deaths in the first wave - now they have 118,000. Germany did 'fence in' some housing estates with foreign workers in the first wave; 2,000 people 'fenced in' here - not something I would recommend:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53177628[/quote]
I think the fencing in was abhorrent.

But I do t think those 2000 fenced is made the difference in death rates.

Alexandra2001 · 30/01/2022 19:02

[quote Clavinova]Germany with far more people and around 35% less deaths...why is this?

Germany only had 10,000 deaths in the first wave - now they have 118,000. Germany did 'fence in' some housing estates with foreign workers in the first wave; 2,000 people 'fenced in' here - not something I would recommend:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53177628[/quote]
So despite having a pop. some 20m MORE than the UK they have 35k LESS deaths...

We locked students in their 'halls, using fences and private security guards, sent infected CV patients into CH's killing '000s of our elderly.

Normally poeple, seriously ill, left at home.

So please take your Whataboutery else where.

FatFredsFriedEgg · 30/01/2022 19:02

[quote Clavinova]Germany with far more people and around 35% less deaths...why is this?

Germany only had 10,000 deaths in the first wave - now they have 118,000. Germany did 'fence in' some housing estates with foreign workers in the first wave; 2,000 people 'fenced in' here - not something I would recommend:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-53177628[/quote]
My godson was 'fenced in' with security fences and guards on a UK university campus.

Of course, in general, we didn't fence people in. We just forbade them to leave the house except for most purposes and had the police enforce the restrictions beyond the law.

BewareTheLibrarians · 30/01/2022 19:04

@Clavinova In the UK, under this government, asylum seekers have been routinely “fenced in” in ex-barracks that have been legally deemed unfit for use for asylum seekers (for fairly obvious reasons, even on top of the unsuitable living conditions giving rise to a dangerous spread of covid cases.)

If it’s not OK for Germany to do something similar temporarily, I’m sure you’d agree it’s not OK for the UK to do on a more permanent basis.

cakeorwine · 30/01/2022 19:05

Just to remind people

hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2021-12-01/debates/A0E282CF-039D-4F26-8F16-946B8C6E2ABC/Engagements

As millions of people were locked down last year, was a Christmas party thrown in Downing Street for dozens of people on 18 December

The Prime Minister

What I can tell the right hon. and learned Gentleman is that all guidance was followed completely in No. 10. May I recommend that he does the same with his own Christmas party, which is advertised for 15 December and to which, unaccountably, he has failed to invite the deputy Leader of the Opposition?

Keir Starmer

Nice try, but that won’t work. The defence seems to be that no rules were broken. Well, I have the rules that were in place at the time of the party. They are very clear that

“you must not have a work Christmas lunch or party”.

Does the Prime Minister really expect the country to believe that while people were banned from seeing their loved ones at Christmas last year, it was fine for him and his friends to throw a boozy party in Downing Street?

Johnson then goes onto lie about 40 new hospitals.

I think that was the first revelation. More followed.

BewareTheLibrarians · 30/01/2022 19:06

@Peregrina

BewareTheLibrarians - I don't doubt that those are views that Major, and May would also subscribe to.

Cameron - ??? Blair also ????

Yes, I’d agree with Major and May, and would imagine possibly Cameron and Blair having flashes of feeling the same.

But Boris? Even if he could say those words absolutely none of it applies to the way he thinks, or, more importantly to the way he runs the country.

derxa · 30/01/2022 19:07

@Peregrina

My point is that Marina and Boris are cut from the same cloth. Self interested and talented journalists who know how to write for their particular audience. I don't think either of them have a strong social conscience or altruism

I didn't know that Marina was an MP, let alone the Prime Minister. I don't doubt that she's well paid, but her columns are funny and she is probably sensible enough to stick to that.

Do you think I believe BJ shouldn't have done the same?
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