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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Threatened with losing my job

205 replies

Finallylostit · 19/01/2022 22:49

Yesterday, I got a letter and a delightful email in my work email telling me I am going to lose my job unless I get vaccinated.

Yes I work for the NHS.

This is insulting and rude when those in power think to threaten people without getting their data /facts correct.

May 2020 - I received my first vaccine as part of the first vaccine trial in the world. By the end of June 2020 I had my second dose. In June 2021 - I had a new trial booster.

Problem is if you had your vaccine as part of the trials that helped move the world back to normal - then the systems do not recognise it as being had. The NHS app will give me a covid pass and says i have had it but it is not considered the real thing that everyone else got after being tried on people like me.

I have to email my proof to them to prove ~I have had it. 3 emails later and I have had to send in passport details, vaccine trial details, this detail that detail etc etc.

Today 'i got invited to a meeting with my manager to discuss the implications of my refusenik beliefs and to inform me that as of April 1st I will not be employed by the NHS. That said person could not see how frustrating it is for someone who has been vaccinated all along but systems do not recognise it and still asked me for proof - just pushed me over the edge today.

Whilst I appreciate this is adminstritative it really is insulting that they can not get this right. I and many of my NHS colleagues volunteered blindly into a trial not knowing what the hell would happen to help the world.

our thanks for helping move the world on - threatened with the sack. Thoroughly pissed off Vax volunteer.

OP posts:
NeedAHoliday2021 · 20/01/2022 12:06

@WindInTheWillows7 so you think employers should have full access to their staff’s medical record? She just has to apply for an exemption certificate via 119 but she hasn’t done that - which is fine as there’s time but no need to be furious about a generic letter.

SarahBop · 20/01/2022 12:11

I think you can apply for medical exemption based on this. Phone 119 for advice.

rainrainraincamedowndowndown · 20/01/2022 12:21

Wow, that sounds horrible. After you have volunteered for greater good for society, being treated like this is unacceptable. We all owe you great people who did sacrifise yourselves for trials on new vaccine so we can have safe vaccine. Thank you.
Even though it's just an error, whoever sent the email should apologise to you profusely.

Sallydimebar · 20/01/2022 12:23

“People should get the vaccine to protect themselves not others as it doesn't work for that”.

How vaccines work :
(shouldn’t really need explaining to people who work in the NHS )
When someone is vaccinated, they are very likely to be protected against the targeted disease. But not everyone can be vaccinated. People with underlying health conditions that weaken their immune systems (such as cancer or HIV) or who have severe allergies to some vaccine components may not be able to get vaccinated with certain vaccines. These people can still be protected if they live in and amongst others who are vaccinated. When a lot of people in a community are vaccinated the pathogen has a hard time circulating because most of the people it encounters are immune. So the more that others are vaccinated, the less likely people who are unable to be protected by vaccines are at risk of even being exposed to the harmful pathogens. This is called herd immunity.

This is especially important for those people who not only can’t be vaccinated but may be more susceptible to the diseases we vaccinate against. No single vaccine provides 100% protection, and herd immunity does not provide full protection to those who cannot safely be vaccinated. But with herd immunity, these people will have substantial protection, thanks to those around them being vaccinated.

Vaccinating not only protects yourself, but also protects those in the community who are unable to be vaccinated. If you are able to, get vaccinated.

NanFlanders · 20/01/2022 12:24

It is infuriating, I agree. I was really cross when I got a letter about my daughter's poor attendance at school, when the only time she'd been absent was when she was legally obliged to self-isolate. The trouble is that we have lots of new regs coming in all the time, and automated systems are not flexible or nuanced enough (and admin staff must be under the same huge pressure as the rest of the NHS - I also work in the health field). Do try not to take it personally - and thank you for both for volunteering and all your service in the pandemic.

chocolateisavegetable · 20/01/2022 12:37

I am fuming on your behalf OP!

Lovelyricepudding · 20/01/2022 12:37

You say you were in the trial and had two jabs. Did you have the covid vaccine? If it was part of a randomised control trial then half the participants wouldn't have got the covid vaccine (I think they were vaccinated for something else). Did they unblind it and tell you which you got?

Dogshitduty · 20/01/2022 12:42

@Luredbyapomegranate

It’s just an admin error.

They are dealing with millions upon millions of vaccinations. Errors are bound to happen. Don’t waste time personalising it.

This
vivainsomnia · 20/01/2022 12:44

This is a classic symptom of our overly bureaucratic health service
Or symptom of a generation that makes everything personal and would rather waste time and energy moaning and getting people feel sorry for them then doing what is required to sort out the problem.

People experience frustrations with administration every day. High annoying? Definitely? Worth seeking sympathy in the papers? Mmmm

Dogshitduty · 20/01/2022 12:45

@vivainsomnia

This is a classic symptom of our overly bureaucratic health service Or symptom of a generation that makes everything personal and would rather waste time and energy moaning and getting people feel sorry for them then doing what is required to sort out the problem.

People experience frustrations with administration every day. High annoying? Definitely? Worth seeking sympathy in the papers? Mmmm

Agreed
Pythonesque · 20/01/2022 12:46

This story makes me think that the numbers of unvaccinated staff in the NHS could well be a lot fewer than existing estimates ...

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 20/01/2022 12:50

@3scape

So .... Do what most of the volunteers have done, get more jabs.

What's your point exactly? Propoganda?

The vaccines need to be going to unvaccinated people, @3scape - not to someone who has already had the vaccine. Don't you think it is a waste of money, staff time, (including @Finallylostit's time) and vaccines to give the vaccines to staff who were part of the clinical trials, and are therefore fully vaccinated?

It's not 'propaganda' to think that a massive healthcare organisation like the NHS should be able to deal with staff who were vaccinated in clinical trials, without resorting to multiple meetings, screeds of documentation, and threats of unemployment!

User1isnotavailable · 20/01/2022 12:55

It sounds like one of those admin/computer doesn't recognise glitches. I hope you sort soon.

As for unvaccinated working with the most vulnerable in our society Hmm there you go. A nurse on Jeremy Vine yesterday was spouting all sorts of nonsense about the rushed through, untested vaccine that is not better than her own immune system.... say no more. Shows nurses/doctors etc can also be dim and believe YouTube video sharing and end up down the rabbit hole. The next viewer to ring in found her offensive, I felt sad for her ignorance.

User1isnotavailable · 20/01/2022 12:56

@Pythonesque

This story makes me think that the numbers of unvaccinated staff in the NHS could well be a lot fewer than existing estimates ...
Good point if a large number did the vaccine trial. Hopefully they will add those to the already vaccinated list soon since how annoying when they have done their bit already.
Whichjab · 20/01/2022 12:57

I find this terrifying. Not just the Op's situation now but the fact that it will make her, and many like her, think twice before going on another trial.
I stressed over which vaccine to have, I am not brave enough to be a test subject but I am eternally grateful for those that are.

Thanks for doing it op, plus I do understand why it is personal, how anyone can think being threatened to lose your job, especially after you have spoken to them, isn't personal I don't know.

Summersdreaming · 20/01/2022 12:59

I am gobsmacked someone thinks you should have SIX covid vaccines to tick a box on a bloody to keep your job. I am up in arms that carers were sacked and NHS workers will be next. Not RTFT but what can I do as a bystander to this shitshow?! Write to MP/Petition/protest??

BoredZelda · 20/01/2022 13:01

The virus is being passed on by vaccinated people just as much as unvaccinated and to let this happen is crazy

Incorrect. Whilst it is true you can still contract and pass on the virus, the likelihood is much reduced in vaccinated people, something which is reflected in the fact that the booster campaign at the end of last year is starting to show through in the massive decrease in numbers over the last couple of weeks.

It is important to reflect the actual facts that being vaccinated has been shown to reduce the risk of catching the virus by about 65%

BungleandGeorge · 20/01/2022 13:04

@Lovelyricepudding

You say you were in the trial and had two jabs. Did you have the covid vaccine? If it was part of a randomised control trial then half the participants wouldn't have got the covid vaccine (I think they were vaccinated for something else). Did they unblind it and tell you which you got?
Yes of course they did so that those who hadn’t had the vaccine would know to get it, they’d have never got the trial through the ethics committee otherwise🙄
BoredZelda · 20/01/2022 13:08

Problem is if you had your vaccine as part of the trials that helped move the world back to normal - then the systems do not recognise it as being had

This is also incorrect. That your particular manager hasn't done what they should is different from saying the systems don't recognise trial vaccine status.

LatteLady · 20/01/2022 13:12

Union and formal complaint.

Theluggage15 · 20/01/2022 13:13

The vaccine effect only lasts a few weeks in reducing transmission with omicron so unless they’re suggesting boosting medical staff every few weeks the whole no jab no job is nonsense.

Nowayoutonlydown · 20/01/2022 13:17

What about your union? Can't they help you?
I think you need some legal advice.
You've been vaccinated, you've proven time and time again. If they sack you, surely that's unfair dismissal.

Pissed off for you. Common sense isn't prevailing here.

Derbee · 20/01/2022 13:45

I don’t want to point out the obvious, incase you’ve done it already. But you haven’t mentioned where you have actually called 119, asked for the exemption form, and filled it out completely/correctly? That’s an obvious first step if you haven’t…

OniferousWasp · 20/01/2022 13:55

@Theballoonsinthesky

Why are people not up in arms that in 2 weeks time 90k NHS staff will be served notice? They've worked the deadliest part of the pandemic with no protection and as we are coming out of the pandemic they will lose their jobs for standing up for body autonomy? The virus is being passed on by vaccinated people just as much as unvaccinated and to let this happen is crazy. I work for the NHS and have had 3 vaccines but I just can't believe we have come to this. I could understand if it was impossible to pass the virus on if you're vaccinated but like I said the transmission rate between fully vaxxed is off the charts so how is a dr any more of a risk to a patient if they're not vaccinated? People should get the vaccine to protect themselves not others as it doesn't work for that.
Some people are. Organisations are supporting those who have made that choice.
Lemonyfuckit · 20/01/2022 14:01

Can I ask what trial it was OP (and whether the vaccine has now been approved)?

The reason being because my DH also took part in a trial, and works for the NHS. We are still facing administrative issues with trying to go on holiday (his trial vaccine has only recently, finally been approved in Europe, not yet in US, and with all the delays to approval and not knowing when that would be the trial lists were advised to get further vaccines, so he's now had two does of trial vaccine, which is now approved here, plus one of Pfizer - so he's had the equivalent of two doses plus a booster, but I'm not sure whether his paperwork correctly shows that for the purposes of travel, it's not been an issue in this country. He prob won't have a further Pfizer plus booster if it can be helped as he has an autoimmune condition so actually gets really bad symptoms and is very ill when he's had each of these doses). But he hasn't had any issues with his workplace not recognising he's been vaccinated.

TL:DR DH also took part in a trial and works for NHS - numerous administrative issues as a result of being a triallist, but workplace recognising he's been vaccinated not one of them.