None of the other kids cried or screamed like that

[Roundandroundthejardim]

Just want to check if my DD, 3.5’s behaviour seems normal and how you’d react if it was your child.
Took her on one of the those remote control cars at the shopping centre.
She had great fun and really enjoyed it…until it ended. Her dad reversed her into the car part and we said how fun it was, she was great at driving etc and it had finished now and we were off to get some nice lunch.
She screamed like I’ve not seen her do before, I had to get her out of the car, whilst she shouted and cried and proceeded to bite my shoulder. She then did the same as we were walking around a shop and she wouldn’t put a soft toy back, she has plenty of treats and it’s just been Xmas etc. Dp had to pick her up as she wouldn’t co operate, again she shouted and cried and tried to bite his shoulder.
Worth noting she was tired, but is that normal?! None of the other children reacted like that. Lately she just seems to be shouting so much and isn’t that pleasant to be around. We love her dearly, but it’s such a struggle, she’s so strong willed.
Is this normal behaviour and how would you deal with it? Is she being spoilt, do we need to be stronger/stricter (Dp thinks so) or is this just her age etc?

So much is written about the terrible 2's but I found 3 to 4 so much worse. My god the tantrums. Distraction doesn't work. And tiredness makes it a million times worse. DS2 (now a chilled and pleasant 10) used to trash his room at 3.5. Books off the shelf, bedding on the floor, the whole works. It will pass, but you still need to be clear about what's acceptable and what's not. But for your sanity, watch the tiredness, it's a killer.

Her behaviour is normal, but so is your frustration! If I’m honest, I really didn’t enjoy about 1-5-3.5 for similar reasons. But there’s some good advice I’ve read about empathising with them, “I can see you’re upset about getting off the ride.. it’s sad when fun things end,” while still having boundaries around behaviour, “I’m not going to let you bite me, so are you going to get down and walk, or sit on my shoulders.” When I first read it, I did think it sounded a bit wishy-washy, but actually helping them identify the emotions, and showing you understand and are listening to them, fits with what we now know about child development. I think it all comes under the idea of respectful parenting.

It’s not good behaviour obviously but it’s not abnormal at all. I often find tantrums breed tantrums too - once they’ve had one they’re in that ‘tantrum’ mindset.

Does she have good language/comprehension? I would be looking at speaking to her about biting/teeth are not for biting type thing because in my experience that tends to be common in younger children 1.5-2.5 before they have good speaking skills. If you can speak to her when she’s calm and maybe read the teeth are not for biting book it gives some good strategies - it’s a picture book you read with the child.

Other than that I’d just make her aware that she won’t get what she want. Screaming and biting doesn’t get the toy in the shop/stay longer at the play area etc, and eventually she’ll cotton on that she can’t get toys from the shop by screaming. Eventually it will pass. It will feel like it’s taking about 5 years, but it will pass.

@ChaosMoon But how to *lovingly enforce them when she’s screaming and shouting me down (or attempting to) 😅

And I also wouldn’t worry about the fact that all the other kids didn’t scream and cry. They were just giving your daughter her turn to do it.

I worked in childcare for years, and believe me they all have their moment in the spotlight! Every other parent there would have been thinking oh thank god it’s someone else’s child.

Sounds horribly familiar OP. It's very wearing indeed but very normal for her age.

I have a nearly 3 year-old and he was a nightmare in the shopping centre over the weekend. I hired one of those trolley cars so he can sit in but he just got bored easily. I just needed to nip in for a refund and he had his snacks, already had napped and wasn't hungry. I nearly cried yesterday as I saw soo many happy toddlers in their car trolleys with parents pushing and shopping at the same time whereas mine just went mental and I wasn't even shopping like the other parents. I strategically planned carefully to go in by entrance closest to the store and get the refund and come back out but also wanted him to be entertained by hiring that car trolley as he loves cars. I guess my shopping days are over for a while.

@Kanaloa She has great language and comprehension, just a bad temper 🙈the last few months its been worse, she gets really frustrated when she can’t do something now and shouts, she didn’t before

Thanks everyone 🙏it’s reassuring!

Absolutely normal. DC2 at age 3 often lay down on the ground, screamed and kicked when I tried to hold their hand crossing the road. Even now, age 8, has a terrible temper and tantrums all the time. I worry they aren't 'happy' but I think its part of their temperament. I sympathise as its exhausting.

It's normal for occasional tantrums.

Stick to clear boundaries and expect to reinforce them for what feels like forever.

Mine push boundaries in different ways, but I still have to say regularly to my 12 year old and teen:
"It's not all about you"
"Actions have consequences"
"No"

I think you got lucky with your others. Sounds totally normal to me. I used to go completely out of my way in the town centre just to avoid mine even seeing those rides when they were toddlers, because as someone else said, one is never enough. I'd avoid the soft plays that had coin machines too. I admit to becoming more and more strict with mine and it didn't help a bit, strong willed kids will not be broken by you.

My DD1 was like that (still can be) but is now mostly lovely. She used to scratch DH.

She's 5 now and is so well behaved at school but if she's over tired at home can still completely lose it. Definitely normal!

Sorry OP, I’m going through this right now! DD is nearly 3.5 and fuck me, she’s become a nightmare. She’s mostly absolutely adorable and bubbly, but she’ll just turn and scream, tantrum etc at the drop of a hat. It does pass, just in time for them to go to school and then you miss them all day.

Yup ! I never had the terrible twos with mine , luckily tantrums were rare but when they happened ( full on kicking legs bawling eyes out etc etc ) it was age 3-5 😭

It is incredibly normal to feel frustrated because she is growing up but is still limited within that

Clearly defined boundaries all the way. Set out what is going to happen if you think it will help. Pick your battles give her choices etc

But once she starts shouting/screaming leave her stop trying to reason with her that time has passed. However awful they look or seem they are her trying to regulate her emotions and come to terms with it.

She was sad the ride ended - as an adult we are aware the ride is limited (was she) and we accept and move on. Her process at 3 is different but in order to get to the point we are at she needs to learn which is this stage. Hunger and tiredness make this much worse

I’ve had the same experience as beneaththeradar and found that difficult toddlers/preschoolers are way easier teens. One of my kids was perfectly behaved throughout her childhood, she’s 15 now and SO rude and argumentative 🙄

I also have a v challenging 3 year old who has BIG feelings and find that verbalising her feelings really helps. e.g. “I know you’re feeling angry because you wanted a chocolate coin but mummy won’t let you have one”. You don’t have to agree that she’s right, just acknowledging what the feeling is helps. A hug always helps too.

I read the beginning of a v helpful book years ago, “How to talk so children listen”. I think I’m going go back and read the whole thing.

Most small children are a nightmare in shops - just don’t do it if you can possibly avoid it.

Normal behaviour ime. Make sure you never give in to the tantrums no matter how tough it is. If you do she’ll know that she just has to have a really bad tantrum to get her own way. She has to learn they never work. Also you and DH need to be absolutely consistent with each other. Set boundaries and stick to them.

Oh and don’t lie to her and say rides are broken or you haven’t got any money on you. She needs to learn that you can’t always do what you want or get what you want. Boundaries need to work both ways.

This too shall pass. The days are long and the years are short. Label her emotions and talk about yours. Occasionally just sit down and wait while she expresses herself, just be with her and her feelings, don’t be embarrassed as other parents are honestly just glad it’s not their child and I always feel empathy and sympathy!

I found this really helpful - consider how you would feel if you overheard someone describe your child as ‘x is so obedient’?

I found the idea of obedient being the only thing people thought to say about my child horrifying

Normal! Especially if tired.

A car like that is thrilling, gives a shot if dopamine …..then it ends. Very difficult to deal with at any age in some ways.

Yep normal. Just calmly remove her from the situation. With my daughter I had to calmly carry her somewhere quiet (preferably a corner) when she got like this as being observed by passers by made her feel worse and she struggled to calm down.

Absolutely normal at the age. When ds did it he was put on the bottom step of the stairs (or somewhere convienent) until he calmed down. He needed to learn to calm himself down when he got angry, no amount of cajoling or discussion worked for ds, if anything it made him worse. After he calmed down and sat for a couple of minutes then we could talk.

Basically the good old naughty step, but we never called it that, just told him it was somewhere to calm down then we would talk.

That and being consist when out. No means no every time, saying no and sometimes saying yes just confuses them at that age.

In all honesty, no, my 3.5yr old son would never bite me. He may cry if he has to stop doing what he loves sometimes but it's rare and never a full-blown meltdown luckily.

Even if he's sad, I'd never accept him biting. He's well old enough to know not to do that now.

Forgive me if I'm wrong but it sounds like she's been quite spoilt lately, Christmas doesn't help. Perhaps she's trying to keep the status quo and hasn't realised that's just a treat time of year.

This is a great learning opportunity. Explain clearly BEFORE that kind of thing but it lasts X minutes and then we're going to XYZ. Afterwards, tell her you're going to XYZ but if she doesn't come nicely, there will be a consequence and follow through.

If she knows you mean business she'll likely not repeat too often (unless there's a developmental delay/issue obviously)

Oh and in situations where you know they will have difficulty tearing themselves away, give them a 5 minute and 1 minute warning that it will soon ending. That prepares them so it’s not such a shock it suddenly finishes.

@HardbackWriter

None of the others cried or screamed like that right then.

The other day a stranger told me that my three year old was amazingly well behaved in a coffee shop - and he was indeed just acting perfectly. I preened smugly and thanked them. 20 minutes later he was screaming and writhing about on the pavement in a tantrum - so that showed me for being smug!

An essential rule of parenting is that at the exact moment yours are acting their worst every other child will suddenly behave beautifully, making yours look even more feral. She isn't unusual - most of them have their mad tyrant moments and the few that don't usually have some other issue (won't eat or won't sleep, can't bear to be away from mum, etc etc etc) that drives their parent wild with worry.

Agree with this. I'll never forget being 8 months pregnant with twins and as big as a house. My normally calm, sweet natured two year old cherub and I walked past those blasted rides(they should be banned) and joined the queue in a busy Costa Coffee where she proceeded to throw herself around the floor in red hot fury because she wanted to go out to rides and I didn't agree.. I was too big to get down to floor level to lift her or calm her and there was no way she was going to listen to me. I swear I overheated as I stood staring at her in a complete panic wondering what I could do as I got judgemental stares and tuts from all around.