What kind of fucked-up, dysfunctional workplace is our government operating in?

[noblegiraffe]

Downing Street and the Houses of Parliament? Can't get through the day without a suitcase of wine in Downing Street, drugs everywhere in Parliament? Subsidised bars on work premises?

I guess the fact that they tried to make an exemption for the bars in the Houses of Parliament when introducing a curfew for pubs should have been a warning sign that there's far too much reliance on alcohol in our ruling classes.

There was a lot of talk about standards in public life during the Owen Paterson scandal. Surely not being pissed or high on the job is a basic standard?

Aside from the issue that they couldn't even stop having massive piss-ups during lockdown, AIBU to think that something needs to be done to introduce basic rules like 'If you're not safe to drive, you're not allowed to vote in new laws'?

If you wouldn't be happy with a teacher teaching your kids half-cut and would expect rules to prevent this, why should we tolerate our government ruling the country while making their way through the contents of the wine fridge?

People have been posting 'oh yes, it's always been like this'.

Well it shouldn't be in future.

I assume that an adult trying to have a go on a toddler's swing is why it ended up broken. His other children are past the age of playing on swings.

@WinnersDinner

Surely you can understand that your experiences with private companies are very different to public sector workers paid by taxes.

Have I really just read a post claiming some people are safe to drive over the legal limit?

Fuck me.

Pretty much my thoughts motherrunner.

The Telegraph have a picture of Carrie sitting on a friends knee I. A rooftop bar in September 2020.

At the time, in September 2020, ministers had warned that Britain was facing a second wave of infections. The law prevented people from gathering in groups of more than six, other than for education, work, weddings and funerals.

There’s also strong rumours of parties in the no 10 flats. That’s why Big Dog is hiding they don’t know what else is coming out. She must have known who took the photo too, she clearly knows it’s being taken.

I often used to work in London pre covid as an insurance broker and as a PP said the drinking culture in this industry is rife.

@Covidclaire

‘’They’re not underpaid, as they knew exactly what they were signing up for. Most of them are greedy and are on the gravy boat with the expectation of future riches (sitting on company boards, back handers/brown envelopes, honours from the Queen, book deals, etc, etc, etc…….)

So, why did they not go elsewhere then???’’

‘That same comment could go for nurses.’

It’s very disingenuous of you to not re-post the whole of my paragraph to provide content re. exactly what I meant when I stated that MP’s knew what they had signed up for.

Don’t be ridiculous. Comparing Nurses is not the same! Do Nurses have their expenses paid like MP’s, similar perks of the job, special treatment, opportunities to continue to receive vast amounts of income after leaving the job/retirement?
Do not take people for fools; we can all read 🙄

In addition, I note:
@NefretForth (who I was initially responding to) has responded to you but ignored me - also disingenuous:

“Quite so. People used to say to junior doctors who were working 120 hours a week and falling asleep at the wheel on the way home, 'You chose the hours when you chose the job.'”

Again, not a fair comparison.

Both of you - Please have good, long hard think about another job/profession that would be a good comparison to a job of an MP?
Were you drunk or high on drugs when you wrote your posts?

How much alcohol is deemed sufficient to impair your judgement enough that you are not competent enough to understand what you have read (comprehension)?

This thread is not about City workers or Journalists. They are not paid by the UK tax payer.

Alcoholism (let’s call it exactly what it is) is also rife in Sales, but we’re not talking about Sales. Commission based salaries. Pressure to meet targets.

We clearly have a problem with alcohol consumption/pub culture in the UK.

‘…I'm not surprised that you're more driven by what you can legally get away with though.’

Sounds like Boris 🙄

‘Many people drive perfectly safely after a few drinks

Some even drive safely if over the limit

Having a couple of beers isn't going to impart someone to not be able to raise their hand or work in most office based roles

The bending you and other posters are doing to try and claim this to be true is laughable’

You are definitely wild.

It is such whataboutery to point to other work places with a drinking culture. That kind of Old oy Network/ machismo is what is wrong with so many metropolitan (especially London) workplaces. It leads to a culture where people - largely men- bounce from Bullingdon Club, to the City, or journalism , to Westminster. It is entitlement. It discourages and inhibits people not from that kind of culture working in those places and those workplaces, not coincidentally, are rife with workplace bullying. It mitigates against family life. It shuts out many women . It is obnoxious and exclusive.

When we get it in government, exclusivity, entitlement, drunken behaviour, boorishness, and flagrant rule breaking is everything leadership (especially of the country) should not be.

I don't see how insurance brokers doing the same thing makes any difference. Insurance brokers are not leaders of society.

Lots of workplace had more minor versions of this kind of piss up culture in the 80s and 90s. Most no longer do.

apart from anything else, actively encouraging a drinking culture in any sector is exclusionary. We rely on the Public Sector to lead the way in standards in the workplace. Those sessions are where (albeit informally) decisions are made, connections , networking etc. There will be some that can't be included for religious reasons or because they have caring responsibilities etc. I know it is a old white boys club anyway but how can progress ever be made?

Morning @Piggywaspushed!

You always say it so much better than I can!

winners, your list , obediently provided , doesn't make things better. At least three of those companies treat their most junior employees like shit. The fact that they are boozing away at the top whilst they would sack a warehouse worker for drinking is part of the problem with corporate culture. The fact that corporate , boys' club culture still dominates parliament and government is not a good thing . Your attempts to spin it are rather laughable.

Morning orange. I wasn't going to say anything but I despair of people normalising and excusing this behaviour!

@Piggywaspushed

winners, your list , obediently provided , doesn't make things better. At least three of those companies treat their most junior employees like shit. The fact that they are boozing away at the top whilst they would sack a warehouse worker for drinking is part of the problem with corporate culture. The fact that corporate , boys' club culture still dominates parliament and government is not a good thing . Your attempts to spin it are rather laughable.

Agree. I’m sure the press would be very interested if there is documented evidence that Deliveroo and Amazon have these ‘go slow Fridays’ and 4.30 drinks trolleys during the working day.

Meanwhile the vast majority of people manage to separate drinking and working and drinking and driving.

• Deliveroo and Amazon management.

Surely the reason for the insistence from some that drinking alcohol at work is perfectly normal is so that it can be claimed that the gathering was a work meeting, despite other indications to the contrary?
“Yes there was alcohol. But alcohol is normal at work, therefore it was a work event.” - even though a child could see through this spurious logic.
In fact it’s clear as day that the gathering broke the rules in place at the time when many people were working at least as hard and probably far harder than any in Government and carefully following the rules as responsible citizens, as well as being prevented from seeing ill or dying relatives and friends.

noblegiraffe
As for 'MPs are only having one drink' there's this story.
"In July 2010, a newly elected member of the U.K. Parliament (MP), the aptly named Mark Reckless, issued a public apology after he missed a late-night vote because he was too drunk to take part.*
“I remember someone asking me to vote and not thinking it was appropriate, given how I was at the time,” Reckless said.*

You could have chosen this story from 2012;

A Labour MP was dragged away in handcuffs after going berserk in a House of Commons bar and headbutting a fellow MP.

"There was blood spilled - it was like the Wild West in there," said one stunned MP. Police were called but it apparently took five Commons security officers to restrain Mr Joyce, 51.

A glass door was smashed as they dragged him away, still struggling.

"Poor Stuart [Tory MP for Pudsey, Stuart Andrew] was just having a quiet pint and minding his own business and Eric headbutted him.

Mr Joyce then allegedly returned to Mr Andrew and headbutted him a second time. Mr Andrew is understood to be pressing charges but tweeted today: "I'm OK."

www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/mp-goes-berserk-in-commons-bar-brawl-7446095.html

More recently - November 2021;

An MP who allegedly had to be taken out of an airport in a wheelchair after getting drunk on a flight to an Armistice Day commemoration event today blamed a reaction to medication.

Labour MP Charlotte Nichols and the SNP’s Drew Hendry and David Linden have been accused of getting drunk while travelling from Heathrow to Gibraltar.

They were among 15 MPs taking part in the Armed Forces Parliamentary Scheme, which aims to give politicians an insight into military life.

www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/charlotte-nichols-labour-mp-drunk-armistice-day-gibraltar-b965640.html

And where does Keir Starmer fit into this drinking culture at work?

22 April 2021
Keir Starmer drinking a pint of beer in Wrexham - work trip.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9501261/Sir-Keir-Starmer-sups-pint-visit-Welsh-beer-maker.html

The following day - 23 April 2021
Keir Starmer drinking a pint of beer in Hartlepool - work trip.

www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2021-04-23/prime-minister-and-labour-leader-visit-hartlepool-as-by-election-nears

30 April 2021
Keir Starmer drinking beer at a 'work event' in Durham (one beer in hand - a second bottle on the windowsill);

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10406839/Tories-demand-probe-video-showed-Covid-hypocrite-Keir-Starmer.html

So you agree with me, Clav, the subsidised bars in the Houses of Parliament need to go.

So you agree with me, Clav, the subsidised bars in the Houses of Parliament need to go.

I agree with you that some MPs drink too much. I didn't see you criticising Keir Starmer on the other thread when I posted the same links - in fact you defended him.

There is no evidence that Sir Keir was drinking to excess or present at piss ups. No one has managed to unearth suitcases of beer yet. And I am sure they are trying.

@Clavinova

So you agree with me, Clav, the subsidised bars in the Houses of Parliament need to go.

I agree with you that some MPs drink too much. I didn't see you criticising Keir Starmer on the other thread when I posted the same links - in fact you defended him.

You didn't post the same links, you have removed the link that I was laughing at you about. The one that said Keir had been thrown out of a pub in Bath as if it had anything to do with drinking.

I see that even you realise it was a bit desperate.

Just because other politicians are drunk at the wheel (one drink does not make you drunk but a suitcase load does) it doesn't make it right for the PM’s staff to break the Covid rules. Not at all. No10 was making the rules and Boris was telling us we must follow them.