Anyone join me in being really angry theyre a single parent?

[coodawoodashooda]

Today I have been in such a bad mood and that's why. I can't shake it off. Bastard and his meagre child maintenance that wouldn't even buy a bloody pair of shoes. All the friendships that I have lost. I am so lonely, fed up, skint and angry. Anyone else?

Again, why specifically do your friends think they are paying for single parent families?

Ask them, or read a mainstream newspaper. Single mothers on benefits are about as popular as illegal immigrants. Whinge on mumsnet as much as you like but you aren't going to change anything.

@FanGirlX

Again, why specifically do your friends think they are paying for single parent families?

Ask them, or read a mainstream newspaper. Single mothers on benefits are about as popular as illegal immigrants. Whinge on mumsnet as much as you like but you aren't going to change anything.

No nothing will change because people refuse to look past the benefits bit. Women become single mums on benefits largely because men fuck off and there's no redress, and the men can't possibly be held responsible for their own behaviour and for fucking off and paying diddly squat. Men know the concequences of sex as much as women do, but for some reason they aren't expected to be responsible for their own fertility.

@BirdScaredOfHeights

That's very interesting and what I was wondering. Increasingly older people are living alone, lots of single parents, lots of single people or just people who do not want to cohabit... I wonder what the split is between those and "two adult households". Does anybody know? Because if the majority or even a significant minority make up the first group, then there is a very good case to campaign for change because the tax code as it is is extremely punative to them.

I'd forgotten about older people living alone. Mostly women too, as female life expectancy is longer.

It would be good if activists or charities representing these disparate groups could get together and campaign. I agree that if you add all those disparate groups together, it's a decent proportion of the electorate.

Although I'm not so sure that there are any charities / activists representing some groups. I manage a team of people in their 30s, quite a mixed bunch. Some parents, some not. Some of the non parents are quite open about why they don't want kids - risk of passing mental illness in, environmental concerns, society has changed and there is no obligation to have children anymore. I appreciate this is just anecdotal but I do think it is more common than it used to be.

Was it Karl Marx who said that nothing changes for the working classes until the middle classes start agitating for change? I used the suffragettes as an example earlier - the middle classes agitating for womens suffrage is what got women the vote and it positively impacted on working class women too (eventually).

My dad paid but was largely disinterested, we don't have a relationship now and he doesn't really see his grandchild either.

I saw my mum struggle for years but she will never be alone now and has a wonderful and special relationship with all of her children & grandkids,

She went without for years but her life is full of people who love her.

Jesus. I commented on this thread at first began, to wholeheartedly agree then left the thread as I wasn't in the right mood.

Just returned now and yep, just as I predicted. Court of MN is in session and single parents are once again being cross examined and made to feel guilt and shame.

Barely any mention of those of us who are single parents due to losing our husband/wife. (Husband in my case).
Barely any mention of the b*stards who bugger off. Nope, course not. Let's all hate the one picking up the pieces rather than the one who did the damage

Sorry for hijacking the thread this will be the last post. Statistician here sorry but here’s my summary of the main points of this post

1. economic inequality caused by the male leaving. Solution- harsher penalties for nrp taken from wages, more opportunities to earn more and progress.
2. uneven distribution of labour- the woman is expected/forced to do everything for the child. Solution- tax breaks, better access to higher paid/flexible jobs. Paid childcare from nrp so the woman can have a break.
3. societal disapproval of single mothers- despite them doing the majority of the work. Solution- although I personally am ambivalent about the social credit system- women should get some type of credit/approval for the extra work and the sacrifice.
4. Outrage that men can leave, start new families and do the same with no punishment at all- often doing better afterwards. Solution- wages taken for maintenance, societal disapproval, social credit demerits for “bad” behaviour. If the man had to pay and face disapproval for their actions they would soon change.
5. A lack of understanding of the dynamics of relationships- it is not an accident that 25% of households are single parents. It is not the woman’s fault. Let’s be honest- men are choosing to do this to women. Stop the victim blaming. Also, the government needs to look at the stats and take action.

What really pisses me off is when I get comments like: oh, if you wanted a career, then you could. I replied: to get a job where I can afford everything, I'd need to be away for at least 12hrs a day, travel, additional stress. As it is, I have no wrap around care for my kids so I've got to be there at the end of school /maximum 5pm.

How can I work full time when my children are so young that they cannot take care of themselves/ I cannot afford the wrap around care to make it worthwhile.

My ex chose to be 8hrs away. He chose to leave the family. My choice is: trying to do the best I can with the hand I've been dealt.

I've had to break it to my eldest that mummy can't afford the same holidays as her daddy because I'm paying for: swimming lessons, school activities, shoes etc.

It hurts me that I'm the boring one and he's the awesome /fun/ Disney dad

Funny how so many on here proclaim to be feminists yet quite happy to stick the knife in further to women who are at a disadvantage.
To the smug ones beware, it could be your partner that struggles with mental health or an addiction, or a brain injury, cancer or suicide. These things can come out of the blue, life can change very quickly.
Single parents are without a doubt the strongest army in the world. l am in awe of their strength, resilience, endurance, courage and determination. It will test you unlike anything else.
This thread reminds me of a comment an older widow said to me not long after my own husband died.
" Its alright for you, your still young"
This wasnt long after l had to take my 7 and 11 yr old sons out of school because my husband had suffered a massive bleed on his brain and was found to be brain dead. l had to ask them if they wanted to say goodbye to their dad, before life support was switched off.
Thats the support an elder widow choose to give to me, so much for solidarity.

@VelvetChairGirl

my ex wanted to see "his son" he demanded it when ever he wanted and of course I had to take our child to him not the other way round because "he works hard, he's tired etc".

I wouldnt let him see our son alone, he refused anyone else being present but me (probably because he couldn't emotionally abuse anyone else).

he made threats to take me to court and have my son taken away so I never see him again, not that he has any interest in keeping him he wanted to dump him on his mother.

the visits were always shit.

then our son told the child psychologist with SS that he didn't want to see daddy anymore and that was the end of that, we don't see the ex because my son hates him, he is referred to as "that arsehole" or "the arsehole" in this house.

@VelvetChairGirl

You and your son refer to his father as "the arsehole?" Honestly, I wouldn't recommend that. I'd worry that, in time, this will be detrimental to your son's well being

@pollyparrot45

My dad paid but was largely disinterested, we don't have a relationship now and he doesn't really see his grandchild either.

I saw my mum struggle for years but she will never be alone now and has a wonderful and special relationship with all of her children & grandkids,

She went without for years but her life is full of people who love her.

This is lovely to hear and I hope my life is like that when I am old. My son (4) told me not long ago that when he is married he will buy a house in our street so he can still see me every day because he'd miss me too much, and will come for sleepovers with his children. 💔

I am well aware he may change his mind as a teenager!

@Jokie

What really pisses me off is when I get comments like: oh, if you wanted a career, then you could. I replied: to get a job where I can afford everything, I'd need to be away for at least 12hrs a day, travel, additional stress. As it is, I have no wrap around care for my kids so I've got to be there at the end of school /maximum 5pm.

How can I work full time when my children are so young that they cannot take care of themselves/ I cannot afford the wrap around care to make it worthwhile.

My ex chose to be 8hrs away. He chose to leave the family. My choice is: trying to do the best I can with the hand I've been dealt.

I've had to break it to my eldest that mummy can't afford the same holidays as her daddy because I'm paying for: swimming lessons, school activities, shoes etc.

It hurts me that I'm the boring one and he's the awesome /fun/ Disney dad

That's so appalling. I am so sorry.

@Joined4this

Sorry for hijacking the thread this will be the last post. Statistician here sorry but here’s my summary of the main points of this post

1. economic inequality caused by the male leaving. Solution- harsher penalties for nrp taken from wages, more opportunities to earn more and progress.
2. uneven distribution of labour- the woman is expected/forced to do everything for the child. Solution- tax breaks, better access to higher paid/flexible jobs. Paid childcare from nrp so the woman can have a break.
3. societal disapproval of single mothers- despite them doing the majority of the work. Solution- although I personally am ambivalent about the social credit system- women should get some type of credit/approval for the extra work and the sacrifice.
4. Outrage that men can leave, start new families and do the same with no punishment at all- often doing better afterwards. Solution- wages taken for maintenance, societal disapproval, social credit demerits for “bad” behaviour. If the man had to pay and face disapproval for their actions they would soon change.
5. A lack of understanding of the dynamics of relationships- it is not an accident that 25% of households are single parents. It is not the woman’s fault. Let’s be honest- men are choosing to do this to women. Stop the victim blaming. Also, the government needs to look at the stats and take action.

Agree with much of this but "social credits" 😬 that's all a bit Chinese and authoritarian. BUT we should absolutely make it so that it's massively looked down on for a man to have abandoned his kids. Societal values: that we raise daughters to give such men a swerve! I shall certainly make sure my daughter is very suspicious of any man who is an absent father.

Also think we need a US style system for enforcing proper child maintenance and it should cover 50% of the cost of housing and raising kids. How is it we can imprison people for not paying a TV license but not for non-payment of raising their children?!?

@Bluntness100

I think it’s actually quite disgusting that you’d come onto a thread where single parents are discussing their difficult circumstances and tell them that there must have been red flags that led them there. You aren’t a single parent are you? Why would you think that your opinion is of any use on such a thread, unless just to take the chance to stick the boot into a load of women already having a tough time? Shameful.

“Also think we need a US style system for enforcing proper child maintenance and it should cover 50% of the cost of housing and raising kids. How is it we can imprison people for not paying a TV license but not for non-payment of raising their children?!?”
Absolutely agree within this. My ex spends his life actively avoiding paying maintenance and he is self employed so declares whatever he wants and is meant to pay peanuts but doesnt. It is really unfair.

I agree. I often agree with @Bluntness100 on things on random threads and think she often makes insightful comments but I have been here long enough to know that her situation os that she has a lovely husband, very comfortable home and an adult DD. She has never been a single parent, according to her posts, and has no personal experience of how hard it is, or how these circumstances can turn your life upside down out of nowhere even if you have done everything the "right" way and had no reason to expect your husband to vanish.

I'm just entering this now, and I'm furious and sometimes want to just give up. I can imagine he would be quite reluctant to swap roles and let me live the single life and just dip in and out of parenting when it's convenient for me and doesn't interfere with my social life, sport, boozing, and women.

I am 'luckier' than many women in my situation in that my ex (haven't called him that before!) is paying more than CSA would require but we live abroad and legally I don't have a leg to stand on if he stops paying. I have already lined up a second job and looking at a third in case he fucks me over, as I am determined to stay in the house we are in with friends and neighbours who are lovely and supportive. I have neighbours who have spent substantially more time with my children in the past 6 months than their father has.

I am also feeling trapped because legally I can't move country with the children without his permission, even if he abandons them entirely and plays no role in their lives. Of course he could leave whenever he wanted without consulting me. I don't want to move right now but we never intended this to be a permanent location, and now unless he deigns to give me permission I will have to stay another 16 years. And if I did choose to leave, I would be the one to blame for taking the children away from their dad. God knows what would happen if I lost my job as I would also lose my visa and my kids' school places (paid by my employer).

@CiaoForDiNiaoSaur I am hopeful that my children will also one day be aware. They are small now (7, 4, 1.5) and super excited whenever he visits. But the oldest has seen more than she should and knows he has behaved very badly.

I am also dealing with the ever-so-common issue of having children who are unsettled, poorly-behaved, overtired etc after they see him as his visits are inconsistent and he has apparently forgotten how to parent and provide boundaries etc, despite having seen me do all this for years and years. He didn't buy them anything for Christmas and then when he felt bad he bought them some coloured pens. What a fucking gent.

His parents (who he has not been honest with about the details of our separation AT ALL) have advised him to take legal advice to make sure I don't stop him seeing the children. Ironic, given that in an 8 week period of a totally open-door policy for visits, including overnights if he wanted, he never spent a full day with them. I also particularly resent him saying, 'I'll come early tomorrow' when he means 9am, which is FOUR HOURS after they fucking wake up!

Rant over. I'm sure it will get better and I will stop feeling so resentful when I have more control over my life etc. But I am expecting things to get very toxic. (He has already threatened that if I tell the woman he's had an affair with that we were still together for the first several months of their relationship, he will cut me off financially).

BUT we should absolutely make it so that it's massively looked down on for a man to have abandoned his kids

One of the biggest issues, and very much 'hidden', is the fact that self-employment/owning a company allows men (usually men) to hide their incomes within legal parameters and pay next to nothing (or in my ex's case, nothing at all but he's not legal, just tax dodging) in maintenance. At the same time, these men will see their children regularly and are therefore assumed by those around them to be doting fathers. The law doesn't allow children to be 'pay per view' (and I agree 100% that this is correct) but the assumptions here are always that no maintenance = never seeing the child and for many of us, that simply isn't the case.

Societal values: that we raise daughters to give such men a swerve! I shall certainly make sure my daughter is very suspicious of any man who is an absent father

How about we raise our children of either sex/gender to be good, decent parents who grow up understanding what their responsibilities will be towards their future children? How about we stop accepting shite behaviour from men and actually shun them from our lives and society as a whole? I have said it many, many times on these threads: abandonning your children either financially and/or physically needs to be as socially acceptable as drink driving and smoking over new born babies. Only then will we begin to see a shift in attitudes.

Saying 'I'll teach my daughter to avoid men like that' is utter bollocks. They don't come with it written on their foreheads or a pinned on badge. My ex is a charming, charismatic man who would tell you, if you met him socially, that not supporting children is a terrible, terrible thing to do. He would also tell you how he would never do such a thing and how he gave me 'everything' to ensure that his children could live their best life. My question to you is - how would you know he was lying? What is it about a middle-class professional man in a suit, buisness owner, with a fancy car and a nice house that screams 'child abandonment'? Why do you think it could never happen to you? Because very clearly, many, many women posting here about their negative experiences didn't marry men who said 'fuck it, if you ever get pregnant I'll leave you and the child and not pay a penny'.

@BirdScaredOfHeights

I agree. I often agree with *@Bluntness100* on things on random threads and think she often makes insightful comments but I have been here long enough to know that her situation os that she has a lovely husband, very comfortable home and an adult DD. She has never been a single parent, according to her posts, and has no personal experience of how hard it is, or how these circumstances can turn your life upside down out of nowhere even if you have done everything the "right" way and had no reason to expect your husband to vanish.

Maybe bluntness should try not blaming the women for choosing an arsehole (and not being psychic, missing red flags or whatever) and start blaming the men who are the arseholes here!

Same here. Not one penny from that bastard since I left, to be fair though he didn't really contribute financially before I left, apparently I can get my new boyfriend to pay for them, what new fucking boyfriend? His giant ego can't cope with the fact that I left him because of him. We have 3 children, he only really sees one, that's his golden child, but even then it's only a few hours. Meantime we're stuck living in a rental house that costs twice as much as the mortgage on the 4 bed house that we co own and the kids have to share bedrooms in the rental. Karma is coming you bastard and she's called onetrauma....
Rant over. But it's cathartic so thank you op.

also many men can not square the lover/mother triangle, their attitude towards the family they thought they wanted changes when faced with being parents and the cognitive dissonance they have between the societal image of a desirable woman and the image and stereotype of a mother. the "catch" suddenly becomes the "ball and chain" in their minds.
This is very true. All single mothers in my circle have roughly the same story:

• Met at work, someone in a similar career / seniority / earning level.
• The guy tried really hard to get with her, the catch or the office and the belle of the ball.
• A relationship starts and goes on for a few years. Both were building their careers, supportive of each other and generally happy. All things very equitable financially.
• A baby (or two in quick succession) comes when the mother is mid 30s.
• The father cannot reconcile himself to the fact that (a) he suddenly becomes the sole earner (b) nursery fees eat up all the free fun money (c) babies suddenly demand ridiculous mental resources both from him and the mother. He starts working late and the mother returns part time and still runs herself into the ground.
• A new belle of the ball joins the office, and "understands" him oh so well. One business trip later, there's a happy couple and a single mother.

I heard the same story, with little variation, probably a dozen times over.

@Jokie

What really pisses me off is when I get comments like: oh, if you wanted a career, then you could. I replied: to get a job where I can afford everything, I'd need to be away for at least 12hrs a day, travel, additional stress. As it is, I have no wrap around care for my kids so I've got to be there at the end of school /maximum 5pm.

How can I work full time when my children are so young that they cannot take care of themselves/ I cannot afford the wrap around care to make it worthwhile.

My ex chose to be 8hrs away. He chose to leave the family. My choice is: trying to do the best I can with the hand I've been dealt.

I've had to break it to my eldest that mummy can't afford the same holidays as her daddy because I'm paying for: swimming lessons, school activities, shoes etc.

It hurts me that I'm the boring one and he's the awesome /fun/ Disney dad

Yep. My particular favourite that someone said to me was 'I would love to be a teacher, only I can't because I have a husband'. Fuck off, love. Just fuck off.

I have heard it all - my poor children being the first ones dropped off, last ones picked up and never having me there at school events, the persistent reminder that other people's children became more important than mine own, the constant juggling and who knows what else. I did my best and continue to do so. My kids are generally happy and have done well/are doing well in school.

We are all doing our best with the hands we were dealt with. It is galling when people judge that to be inferior from their point of view as 2 parents with double the choices.
'

@Bluntness100

I am surprised people are posting that they had wonderful relationships before kids with no red flags, living with generous loving men who when the baby arrived fucked off and then lied so they didn’t have to pay. This will happen but there is no doubt many of them were cunts before hand.

This is true to a large extent, the problem is that having a baby is such a major shock to all systems that (in my opinion) there are no reliable early predictors as to how someone would behave in a situation like that.

The hard truth is that women's reproductive interval is quite short (compared to the overall lifetime). If you want more than one child, it would be prudent to start having children no later than early 30s. You could be in a committed relationship for several years with the candidate father by then (say, from mid 20s, after kissing a few frogs), but still not observe how he reacts in extreme circumstances, if it has been all smooth sailing. So he can be a perfect good weather husband, but you have no idea what he's like after three months of sleep deprivation (as an example), or when there's not enough money in the house for his hobby.

@Bluntness100

I am surprised people are posting that they had wonderful relationships before kids with no red flags, living with generous loving men who when the baby arrived fucked off and then lied so they didn’t have to pay. This will happen but there is no doubt many of them were cunts before hand.

I was with ExH 8 years (married for 5). Just before we went to hospital he put his arms around me, stroked my pregnant belly and said "I can't wait to meet you at last son". And he meant it.

He was completely different at his first visit. He even looked different. I initially thought I might have PND, but no, in the space of a few hours he had changed. Fuck off with your ignorance and judgement of single mothers. Save it for the men who ruin their families.

Article in the Sunday Times today, a woman becomes a single parent after a 20 year relationship when her husband becomes secretly addicted to online trading during the pandemic and they lose everything financially.

Hardly the story of a feckless Tinder addicted woman and a bad-boy gone wrong.

@BirdScaredOfHeights

That's very interesting and what I was wondering. Increasingly older people are living alone, lots of single parents, lots of single people or just people who do not want to cohabit... I wonder what the split is between those and "two adult households". Does anybody know? Because if the majority or even a significant minority make up the first group, then there is a very good case to campaign for change because the tax code as it is is extremely punative to them.

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/families/bulletins/familiesandhouseholds/2020