Page 24 | Aibu to not like drag Queens?

Draggedalong1 · 2022-01-01T12:04:22+00:00

And why don’t I? To me there is something intimidating and scary in the make up, and harsh glamour, parodied until it’s ugly and I think, aggressive. I remember going to drag shows long again in the 90s and they seemed to be a bit of fun and almost innocent compared to whatever it is about ru Paul et al. Nothing wrong with a bit of dame Edna from what I remember as a kid. What’s the reasoning behind this new style I wonder, and aibu?

SueSaid · 02/01/2022 16:46

@SpankyPankhurst

Dame Edna was funny.

Yes it wasn't sexualised like all the 'fishy' crap from Ru Paul's trashy show was it.

So, the problem isn't the colour of anyone's skin @VladmirsPoutine more the misogynistic sexual content. I do hope that helps.

DynamiteFilledRadish · 02/01/2022 16:51

@Notimeforaname

Ah Draineddraineddrained

I came on here because I wanted to. To give my opinion and it's making you so annoyed. I wish for you that you learn to live and let live.

I respect you and your thoughts.

You are so utterly disingenuous. Parroting the same phrases like a robot. It's bizarre.

Giggle giggle child abuse and miscarriage drag names are like sooooo funny giggle giggle. Pat me on the bum boys, I'm a cool girl. It's quite sickening.

ClaudiaJ1 · 02/01/2022 16:54

@DynamiteFilledRadish Well said, that poster is either a troll or enjoying some game of gaslighting.

DynamiteFilledRadish · 02/01/2022 16:54

@Notimeforaname

DickMabutt73962

Its actually getting funny now. Very trolly indeed.

Colour me surprised that you're agreeing with the only man on the thread!

You show him how you're not like those boring feminists. He might throw you a crumb or two from the table if you're really good! Giggle giggle.

hangonamo · 02/01/2022 17:03

Some women don't see it as offensive as they are so used to it, so conditioned to it, so desensitised to it, we can see that on this thread. They are completely unable to see that it is blatant misogyny.

Or they may simply have a different opinion that's just as legitimate as yours?

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 02/01/2022 17:04

@DickMabutt73962

Something that a PP said really stuck with me - I’m paraphrasing but it resonated with me so I’m adding in my own feelings- that she felt uncomfortable watching pantomime dames with her brother at a young age, because she’d considered herself equal to her brother but suddenly they were both being forced to laugh at women. Her sex. Immediately putting her below her brother.

Yes I'm sure a young child has such deep thoughts.

It's really not that hard to realise that the group you belong to is being mocked and othered.

Children often pick up on people being unfair even if they can not articulate it clearly at that point. Would you express such belief if someone disabled described the feelings of discomfort they'd had when watching a tv show in which disabled people were mocked?

Notimeforaname · 02/01/2022 17:22

You are so utterly disingenuous. Parroting the same phrases like a robot. It's bizarre

You are entitled to believe that, it wont bother me in the slightest. I understand its difficult for you to understand that I enjoy something you dont. But that's just how it is.

I am no more parroting the same phrases as the rest on here. We disagree on something.

I understand you have formed your own thoughts and beliefs on drag by yourself and respect that but you cant understand that I formed mine by myself. Jys frustrating for you.

That's life. You dont have to prove anything to me nor I to you.

Notimeforaname · 02/01/2022 17:26

You show him how you're not like those boring feminists. He might throw you a crumb or two from the table if you're really good! Giggle giggle

I just have my own opinion on drag and you have yours.

You've imagined all sorts of things about me and my life and who I am...because I enjoy drag.
It's a bit much but I do understand your frustration. Some people find it very difficult to accept different views.

RedBonnet · 02/01/2022 17:36

Elvis was a big hit because he sounded like a black singer and sang black songs. Black singers weren't allowed on stage and weren't played on radio and couldn't record their songs. (I'm talking mainstream - black artists did play live and record songs but only in their own communities). They weren't allowed to due to Jim Crow etc. So Elvis was a white man bringing the excellent black music to the masses, but he was white and therefore acceptable. The black and white minstrels were doing the same thing, except dressing up as black men. All as an excuse to play black music in an 'acceptable' way.

Drag similarly started because women were not allowed on stage to act in plays. So men used to dress as women to play female roles. Shakespeare took advantage of this for comedic effect, particularly in Two Gentlemen of Verona.

So similar reasons for the start of blackface and drag.

AppleJane · 02/01/2022 17:42

Excellent post @RedBonnet

hangonamo · 02/01/2022 17:48

Amazing to see nastiness towards other women on this thread about drag. All for having a different opinion.

VestofAbsurdity · 02/01/2022 17:52

@TrishM80

Being a gay man was a criminal offence in the UK until the 1960s, being a woman was never a criminal offence!

Marital rape was legal up until 1994.

OhWhyNot · 02/01/2022 18:04

Blackface started to be popular when black people were slaves in the US it was cruel it was not celebrating black culture. Elvis certainly wasn’t portrayed as celebrating black culture it was taking black culture and making a pretty white guy with a good voice and marketing it to a white audience

Women were not allowed on stage they had little rights but it was not mocking the cruelty

Minstrels celebrating black culture what like My Mammy oh yes that certainly is something to celebrate

VestofAbsurdity · 02/01/2022 18:07

Yes I see it on so many threads here. Basically telling people you are WRONG and your opinion is wrong.

I think misogyny is wrong, you obviously don't. I, and other posters who agree with me, will continue to argue it is wrong you will continue to argue it is right.

You keep saying drag is legal to shore up your argument, so what? The Black and White Minstrel Show was legal, widely watched and enjoyed, Jim Davidson's comedy was legal, widely watched and enjoyed, does that make either of those things any less offensive or wrong?

DeeCeeCherry · 02/01/2022 18:15

Its interesting how so mant women feel the need to bandwagon/co-opt Black people's oppression in order to make a point, and flatly refuse to listen when told No, 'Womanface' is not the same as 'Blackface'.

It smacks of men who close their ears to womens' rights and sexism with a 'yes dear' attitude. You sound the same.

I don't see why anyone should listen to you anyway when you're busy playing 'yeah but' oppression olympics, instead of having focus re what it is about drag queens that offend you.

Perhaps its a roundabout way of having a dig at Black people and if that's the case you don't really want a voice in the drag queen debate you just want to be racist, and that trumps all.

Racistface.

ArabellaScott · 02/01/2022 18:17

Someone suggested 'womanface' was an MN thing. Here are a few articles using 'womanface'

standpointmag.co.uk/blackface-is-evil-why-isnt-drag/

(Also contains this Judith Butler quote which someone may find illuminating, idk: '“Parodic proliferation deprives hegemonic culture and its critics of the claim to naturalised or essentialist gender identities.”')

yvonnevandongen.medium.com/stop-with-the-womanface-c345d7a220f9

4w.pub/the-myth-of-woman-face/

VestofAbsurdity · 02/01/2022 18:18

@OhWhyNot

Blackface started to be popular when black people were slaves in the US it was cruel it was not celebrating black culture. Elvis certainly wasn’t portrayed as celebrating black culture it was taking black culture and making a pretty white guy with a good voice and marketing it to a white audience

Women were not allowed on stage they had little rights but it was not mocking the cruelty

Minstrels celebrating black culture what like My Mammy oh yes that certainly is something to celebrate

Drag is certainly not celebrating female culture, for a start it is done by men who by dint of their sex haven't got a fucking clue about female culture. Drag is nothing more that the use of over exaggerated stereotypes of women in order to mock, belittle and demean them.

Drag artists using names such as Anna Bortion and Miss Carriage is certainly something to celebrate.

VestofAbsurdity · 02/01/2022 18:22

I don't see why anyone should listen to you anyway when you're busy playing 'yeah but' oppression olympics, instead of having focus re what it is about drag queens that offend you.

Posters on this thread have been abundantly clear about what it is about Drag that offends us, it is misogynistic to the core, demeans, belittles and mocks women. The use of the repulsive term fishy to describe women because, according to them, women's vaginas smell, could that be any more repellent? Do you think it would be acceptable to describe any other section of society as having a particular repugnant smell?

AlfonsoTheGoat · 02/01/2022 18:24

@VestofAbsurdity

I don't see why anyone should listen to you anyway when you're busy playing 'yeah but' oppression olympics, instead of having focus re what it is about drag queens that offend you.

Posters on this thread have been abundantly clear about what it is about Drag that offends us, it is misogynistic to the core, demeans, belittles and mocks women. The use of the repulsive term fishy to describe women because, according to them, women's vaginas smell, could that be any more repellent? Do you think it would be acceptable to describe any other section of society as having a particular repugnant smell?

Well put.

OhWhyNot · 02/01/2022 18:24

I said it was not mocking the cruelty as blackface was …

AlfonsoTheGoat · 02/01/2022 18:25

@OhWhyNot

Blackface started to be popular when black people were slaves in the US it was cruel it was not celebrating black culture. Elvis certainly wasn’t portrayed as celebrating black culture it was taking black culture and making a pretty white guy with a good voice and marketing it to a white audience

Women were not allowed on stage they had little rights but it was not mocking the cruelty

Minstrels celebrating black culture what like My Mammy oh yes that certainly is something to celebrate

No, it wasn't. It started in the early 20th century with the Black and White Minstrel shows and vaudeville.

OhWhyNot · 02/01/2022 18:30

No it was not it was very popular in the civil war

I think you are talking about the black and white minstrels and then Al Johnson

PurpleCarpets · 02/01/2022 18:36

Marital rape was legal up until 1994.

At a time when gay men were not allowed to marry, were being thrown out of their conjugal homes because the surviving partner had to pay inheritance tax (because they weren't married) and were dying in huge numbers because politicians and medics did not prioritise disseminating information on the "gay plague" or finding a treatment for it

Please do not pretend that women have been more oppressed then gay men, that's ridiculous.

AppleJane · 02/01/2022 18:37

Perhaps its a roundabout way of having a dig at Black people

If you genuinely believe that you should re-read the whole thread.

It's so offensive to tell women that because this group over here are more oppressed than you over there you should shut the fuck up. Unbelievable.

AlfonsoTheGoat · 02/01/2022 18:43

@AppleJane

Perhaps its a roundabout way of having a dig at Black people

If you genuinely believe that you should re-read the whole thread.

It's so offensive to tell women that because this group over here are more oppressed than you over there you should shut the fuck up. Unbelievable.

I do love a bit of Oppression Olympics, myself. As an observer, I hasten to add.