DNR order on kids with disabilities

[2021s]

Sorry about the daily mail link but this is too shocking not to share. DNR orders placed on teenagers with learning disabilities during pandemic in England.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10346479/GPs-offered-teenage-patients-learning-disabilities-not-resuscitate-orders.html?fbclid=IwAR2Moljqum74qgnOkCbldVPCng0tUA9IWfUs6loTQQXdZBX_x9wGNk844jo

This is terrifying that it would ever be considered.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10346479/GPs-offered-teenage-patients-learning-disabilities-not-resuscitate-orders.html?fbclid=IwAR2Moljqum74qgnOkCbldVPCng0tUA9IWfUs6loTQQXdZBX_x9wGNk844jo

And the subject of this thread.

@sashh my first thought was about how hard it is mentally and physically on your body to have survived a resuscitation.

People never really consider this though do they? Just instant anger.

[quote Lifeisnteasy]@IcedAbstinente I understand your upset. However, it isn’t unreasonable to be upset at losing your business/home/education/mental health/relationships in order to protect strangers.[/quote]
well I was talking specifically about people being cross about wearing facemasks. To protect strangers. The bare minimum tbh.

[quote Lifeisnteasy]@IncompleteSenten

I wouldn’t call tanking the economy and restricting basic freedoms an ‘inconvenience’.[/quote]
Brexit did both of those things and plenty of people eagerly voted for it.

@IcedAbstinente it isn’t the bare minimum. Wearing face coverings is irritating. Wearing them for a couple of years is more than enough. Would you have people wear them for life?

[quote Lifeisnteasy]@IcedAbstinente it isn’t the bare minimum. Wearing face coverings is irritating. Wearing them for a couple of years is more than enough. Would you have people wear them for life?[/quote]
Thanks for demonstrating exactly what i was talking about.

They believe a child with disabilities isn't worth saving apparently. It's disgusting and needs investigating throughly and people need punishing!

This is not true and pushing this message about what is a really complex issue is very dangerous.

@IcedAbstinente I don’t think you quite understand. Do you think we should ban people from eating nuts in public, because of those who suffer allergies? After all, the right to enjoy such food in public is tiny compared to the possible consequences for nut allergy sufferers, isn’t it?

Slightly reeling from the results of this …. Do such a massive chunk of mumsnetters really have such disregard for the disabled?

Airborne virus that can be partially mitgated my mask wearing is analogous to some people eating nuts in public?

You are more than welcome to break that down for me.

@IcedAbstinente

Airborne virus that can be partially mitgated my mask wearing is analogous to some people eating nuts in public?

You are more than welcome to break that down for me.

Well, I will if you can’t.

The fact is that a restriction that seems very minor to an individual is not minor collectively. Every single person in the country wearing a mask to prevent (not that it does) a virus that is not serious for 99% of the population is an overreaction.

Context is important.

At the time the nation was facing a very real need to choose who should be left to die when hospitals became unable to cope. Providing care preferentially to those most likely to benefit where a system is unable to provide care to all, those likely to get better fastest with the least care required, is not and never will be controversial.

@Asdf12345

Context is important.

At the time the nation was facing a very real need to choose who should be left to die when hospitals became unable to cope. Providing care preferentially to those most likely to benefit where a system is unable to provide care to all, those likely to get better fastest with the least care required, is not and never will be controversial.

Yikes!

we will have to agree to disagree then. I personally think that if those who can wear masks indeed wear them then it is a good thing for wider society. Knowing what we know now. In the situaiton we are in now.

That is actually derailing the nuts and bolts of the thread which is about how disabled and vulnerable people are viewed by wider society. Quite alot of these people would like the extent of their inconvenience to be limited to the irritation of mask wearing.

The issue is (as somebody who has a disability), our relationship with ‘healthy’ people isn’t one which is equal and opposite. We ‘need’ then in a way that they don’t ‘need’ us. ‘‘Twas ever thus. It’s upsetting, and generally I would say society is quite good at accommodating disabled people, although the benefits are pitiful. But it’s natural and normal for people to prioritise themselves, that doesn’t just apply to disabled people.

40% of MNers think it's okay to have a blanket sweep of DNR on disabled kids? Bloody heck!

It really does make me so sad to see how people view our neurodiverse family.

Ffs I despair at the intelligence of the British public. The Daily Mail really has mastered the art of pushing your buttons for maximum froth. There is inevitably going to be way, way more to this and immensely more detail and complexity than the click bait headlines.

It's not just children with disabilities. Organizations like Saga have reported that elderly patients, even those with dementia or quite severely ill, so it was questionable if they understood, had DNRs added to their files. My father fell over and was in hospital for 24 hours for observation. When my mum checked he had DNR added to his file, and no recollection of anyone asking him.

Luckily my mum is his carer with permission to check his records, so she was able to get it corrected. But how many people have had this done without their families knowing?

Anyone with a vulnerable operation in their care should check this if they've been into hospital. It seems to be a widespread and deliberate policy.

40% of MNers think it's okay to have a blanket sweep of DNR on disabled kids? Bloody heck!
Really? Is that what you think there is? Blanket DNR on disabled kids?

Is that what you think there is?

That's how it is coming across in the varying articles and various posters' experiences on this thread too.

It is certainly making me think I should check my son's record (and maybe mine too!)

@lenaperkins do you understand what resuscitation does to your body and how hard it is to recover from it?

There are horrendously poor outcomes for people with LD and the actions of the medical professionals (and wider society) absolutely play a role.

[quote Staryflight445]@lenaperkins do you understand what resuscitation does to your body and how hard it is to recover from it?[/quote]
I know and I also know that an otherwise healthy 16 year old with an LD deserves the same opportunity of medical treatment as any other 16 year old.

Even if it’s deemed as cruel to put them through it?

@Mickarooni

I’m quite saddens people would think doctors do this willy nilly.
It would 100% be in their best interests.

People who don't believe this or that there is more to it - it's true, follow disability charities on twitter and find out for yourself
It's also one of the things I find so enraging about the conspiracy theories swirling around covid - there really were decisions made about the value of the lives of young disabled people that we should all find truly shocking (one man given one due to not being able to communicate - he's deaf an would need an interpreter). This is a real ongoing scandal but not sexy enough for marches/shouting in the street/defending freedom?