Why does 'wokeness' annoy people so much?

[twwindow]

Isn't it just trying to make the world a better place but making people feel accepted no matter their race, gender etc?

It seems to wind some people up so bad - and it's usually those that are part of a majority group that gets wound up most by it (usually white/men) - is it because they feel threatened?

Whenever anyone stands up for a cause they are automatically called woke - and it's now as if it's a bad thing.

It's sad, I see people fed up with 'wokeness' as code for 'we can't get away with our racist, sexist BS anymore as people are calling us out'.

I wish people who identify as woke would actually wake up and smell the safeguarding issues they are ignoring.

There is nothing kind about threatening rape and violence against women.

There is nothing woke about preventing freedom of speech.

And there is nothing enlightened about rich white men doing as they please.

I mostly see 'woke' people who are 'Millenials' who hate 'Baby Boomers' because they can't get on the property ladder. They blame people who are in their 70's and say it was 'easy' for them. They haven't lived their lives. Never had the hardship of living through the 80's with up to 18% interest rates.
Those people had parents who lived through the 2nd World War. Imagine telling those people that they have no idea about current culture, but shoving your own views down those peoples necks and expecting them to swallow it all. Not allowing them to explain the times they went through, the things they experienced.

If you stop for a second and try and find the things you may find in common, you'll probably find sexism, misogyny and racism. Try and bond over those common issues.

I'm a Gen X with a daughter born in 2011. I actually fear for her generation.

Because it is so unbelievably patronising and narrow minded.

@ItsLoisSangersFault

Please - what is wokeness? It would be really helpful to have a starting point.

I may be wrong as it's not exactly well defined, but being "woke" originally meant (and to many still does mean) being alert to various forms of discrimination or injustice. It was first used to talk about racism in the US I think and then gradually spread.

However, it has now become a byword for a particular type of mainly online social justice warrior. They tend to have particular causes which they focus on at the expense of all others - and at the expense of common sense. They are often all about being performative, cancelling people, calling others out, policing language etc rather than actually engaging in meaningful action.

The sort of person who insists it's discriminatory to encourage "women" to go for a smear test (because not all people they class as women have cervix, and not all people with a cervix are women) and so insist that it should instead be "cervix havers", even though it has been shown that a remarkably high proportion of women don't actually know they have a cervix and so using this language actually causes harm to a far larger number of people than it helps. But that's irrelevant, because it's "inclusive".

@RantyAunty

Because it's so fake.

This and because it allows celebrities to spout drivel to impressionable fools who never stop to question what they are being told

@JohnHuffam1812

Oooh ohhh woke

Lets watch MN decsend into anti trans batshittery that misundertands the process of becoming trans and blames all changes on the Labour party.

Even though the reforms to the GRA were insitigated by the Tories and are being led by a Tory MP. Who also recieves death threats and more from those ever so balanced people just trying to look out for women.

Essentially getting cross at the woke is part of the right wing culture war, they'll stoke whatever issue they want to, and provide loads of misinformation ( see above) and in order to maintain their status quo.

And there, right on cue, is an excellent example of the social media shamer, using lies and smears to make themselves feel super virtuous. Guaranteed that they don’t do a single thing in the real world to help anyone but themselves.

Dinosaur thinkers label anything they're uncomfortable with as "woke", they use it as a put down to make themselves feel better about being racist, sexist, ageist, homophobic, ableist, greedy and all up awful.

Anyone who uses the word woke has self identified as an arsehole.

@BrightYellowDaffodil

Because the people I know who pride themselves on being woke are the ones who are so inclusive they’re utterly intolerant.

This. In droves.

I'm all for inclusivity but not to the point that others are then marginalised. Why is it not ok to for biologically born women to want to be called women not "people who are pregnant" etc? If you're transgender I have no issue. Be who you are and be happy. I truly want people to be able to be who they are. But currently it feels like there is an element of extremism which is excluding those of us who are biologically born female and that's not helping the woke movement at all.

. I dislike the fact I suddenly am meant to be CIS instead of just a woman and things like that. Suddenly it has become too much drama. I just want to be a woman and get on with my life and let others get on with theirs.

Absolutely this!

@GCAcademic

Do try harder eh?

In what way was I shaming? I identified what has already happened and has a history of happening on MN. No lying or anything to make myself feel super virtuous.

The fact that you've responded to my post so nicely just shows the anti woke in such a good light.

The most vocal 'woke' folk seem less interested in being a catalyst for positive change and more concerned about building their protest credentials and thus social standing amongst their narrow like minded peers.

It's often very jarring. When I speak to other black or brown people I know the general consensus is that we're a bit weary of it all. The token BAME person being shoe horned into every possible advert, film or TV series reboot for example, becomes a bit patronising.

It would be fine it was really just about being open and accepting and kind and making the world a better place.

But it's not. It very quickly becomes about controlling the views people express or even think. It quickly becomes at odds with free speech. People end up being ostracised for expressing differing opinions, even if their opinion was politely expressed. It promotes a very black and white view of the world whereby you're either with them 100%, without any reservations or qualms, or you're a racist homophobic terf, which is very unhealthy. It promotes a view of people and ourselves that focuses excessively on labels and which identity boxes you fit into, which I don't believe is healthy, especially for children. Certain labels and identities tend to be implied as having less value, e.g being "cis" is implied to be less important or as having less social capital, because "cis" people "aren't oppressed". It focuses excessively on quite superficial and simplistic things like whether you publicly assent to a particular movement or concept (e.g trans rights), and not enough on the actual nitty gritty details and nuances (e.g the implications of giving transwomen exactly the same legal standing as women).

Pretentious claptrap.

@user1745

It would be fine it was really just about being open and accepting and kind and making the world a better place.

But it's not. It very quickly becomes about controlling the views people express or even think. It quickly becomes at odds with free speech. People end up being ostracised for expressing differing opinions, even if their opinion was politely expressed. It promotes a very black and white view of the world whereby you're either with them 100%, without any reservations or qualms, or you're a racist homophobic terf, which is very unhealthy. It promotes a view of people and ourselves that focuses excessively on labels and which identity boxes you fit into, which I don't believe is healthy, especially for children. Certain labels and identities tend to be implied as having less value, e.g being "cis" is implied to be less important or as having less social capital, because "cis" people "aren't oppressed". It focuses excessively on quite superficial and simplistic things like whether you publicly assent to a particular movement or concept (e.g trans rights), and not enough on the actual nitty gritty details and nuances (e.g the implications of giving transwomen exactly the same legal standing as women).

Very eloquently put. And I agree 100% with what you've said. Thank you for saying what i couldn't write so well.

@ItsLoisSangersFault

You have had so many people comment on the intolerance of "woke"

I'm assuming you are waiting for a certain answer. My example is a post the other day.

Op " What is cultural appropriation? I don't think it's a real thing"
Woke " Well you're a racist! I hate people like you. I can't believe in this day and age you think it's right to even ask this!!"

I say this as someone from an incredibly racist and mysoginist background. I'm learning everyday, I'm now trying to educate my parents. Sometimes it ends with a disagreement, but I never scream stupid insults. I make little progress,but way more than the woke make with them, they just piss them off!

I'm all for inclusivity but not to the point that others are then marginalised. Why is it not ok to for biologically born women to want to be called women not "people who are pregnant" etc? If you're transgender I have no issue. Be who you are and be happy. I truly want people to be able to be who they are. But currently it feels like there is an element of extremism which is excluding those of us who are biologically born female and that's not helping the woke movement at all.
100% agree. And the thought of a trans man(or do i say woman!?) who is identifying
as a " woman" but still has a penis being able to use femail loos and changing rooms actually makes my stomach turn

I completely can't keep any more.
I'm a working class woman with no education beyond school and I stood up against apartheid, and spoke up for Palestine, and joined the struggle for women to have safe women only spaces.
I don't really say much about anything nowadays very often because I might use the wrong language, or not understand history, or not be educated about the right things.

I think most people support social justice and equality but it doesn't feel as if that is what being "woke" is about. I agree with PP, woke people are some of the most aggressive intolerant and authoritarian people I've ever met and they manage to be incredibly unpleasant whilst being absolutely convinced of their own moral superiority.

I'm not bothered about people being woke. What bothers me is this people forcing those views onto me.

The David Baddiel documentary the other week was great. They were talking about how cancel culture reduces everything and distills it to one action, one mistake and then cannot, will not allow for forgiveness or redemption.

This is bad news for humanity and progress is true, which I fear it may well be.

The meaning of woke has shifted. The original meaning is still there and has authenticity and meaning but it's become a short hand metaphor for a kind of vapid value signalling. It's a modern version of being politically correct and similarly, attracts people on both sides of the political spectrum in both performing it and decrying it. It's too simplistic to say leftys are woke and it's a right wing dog whistle.

Sorry, I meant can't keep up any more.

Thank you @FactsAreNotMean

However, it has now become a byword for a particular type of mainly online social justice warrior. They tend to have particular causes which they focus on at the expense of all others - and at the expense of common sense. They are often all about being performative, cancelling people, calling others out, policing language etc rather than actually engaging in meaningful action.

So an online social justice warrior. There is a huge array of people promoting many versions of social justice online. You say they have particular causes they focus on. Which causes are they?

Also, can a person be woke if they're not engaged with online discussion of their views?