Ex forcing himself to my house for Christmas Dinner?

[scorpiogirly]

I have posted two threads under this username about my ex. I am a regular poster but thought I would use this name if anyone would like to check the previous threads for context.

There has been atmosphere between us since the end of October, which became much worse when I organised a babysitter on his non day of seeing our DD.

The interrogation has continued, snide remarks etc. I decided that I thought it best that he didn’t have Christmas dinner here at my house with myself and DD. We barely speak unless he is asking me questions on my private life, or he’s arguing with me in front of our daughter.

I don’t want the atmosphere here that day, he has called me vile names so for that reason, I don’t see why I should cook a meal for him. Of course, I wouldn’t stop him from seeing our daughter on the day, I just don’t want him to come for dinner.

I have tried to bring it up for a while, but I sent a text tonight saying basically as things are the way they are at the moment with the constant atmosphere, I think it would be best to have Christmas Dinner separately this year and that I wasn’t doing it to be mean, but that I just don’t want a bad atmosphere for her.

He replied saying it wasn’t fair, and he doesn’t know why I’m even thinking this. That after all he is going through because of me, he looks forward to seeing dd and he wants Christ dinner with her. He can’t see us getting on like we used to before, but it will be put aside as it’s Christmas.

Our dd is 3.5 and has witnessed far too much already. Being civil and answering with one word answers isn’t really enough, that alone is an atmosphere that she will pick up on.

We have been split for 3.5 years.

Any thoughts greatly appreciated.

Just don’t do it. If he’s speaking to you in monosyllabic answers you don’t want to bring up your daughter thinking this is acceptable for mummy.

And you really don’t want to be serving him!!

Just don’t do it. My ex is also hedging for an invite. I’ve said no, then sidestepped when he put forward some “logical reasons” why he should be here. I’m just not entertaining it.

He is being a classic abuser- manipulation, controlling behaviour, calling you names, threatening to take you to court if you don’t do what he wants. The only way to deal with these types in my experience is to not give in, spend as little time with them as possible and calling their bluff: if he wants to take you to court, let him. If you’re not already, insist on all communication being through email/text. This serves 2 purposes. You have time to think about your reply to him and you have a paper trail of communication, both negative (from him) and you presumably being reasonable towards him.

Op, you are not necessarily weak. In lots of ways, I have resilience to a level that my other family members do not have, but I was very easy to manipulate. My ExH told me the rules (for want of a better term) and I am a rule follower.

I have come to realise as my DC are growing up that it is likely I am neuro divergent. This means that I have to have the parameters for behaving in certain situations. It was no good to me for people to say "he can't treat you like that" or "you shouldn't let him do that" - it left me with nothing to work from.

It sounds like you need an advocate and, in an ideal world, to have a 3rd party communicate with him.

Suggest he comes around for a couple of hours, maybe takes her to the park whilst you have some time to prep dinner, then he goes. That said I had my ex for dinner at first, feel guilty not to invite him this year but not feasible due to distance as I've moved, would be odd but dp gets on ok with him

@KimDeals

Just don’t do it. If he’s speaking to you in monosyllabic answers you don’t want to bring up your daughter thinking this is acceptable for mummy.

And you really don’t want to be serving him!!

Just don’t do it. My ex is also hedging for an invite. I’ve said no, then sidestepped when he put forward some “logical reasons” why he should be here. I’m just not entertaining it.

Who does this?! I’d never invite myself to Christmas dinner and certainly not with an ex! Cheeky cunts.

@NumberTheory

Your Ex is domestically abusing you and he's doing it in front of your daughter - this is bad for you and it's bad for her. He has no say in who you see. He has no say over your arrangements for looking after your DD so long as she is safe and cared for. He has no right to be in your home. He has no right to Christmas dinner. He has no right to see you at all, text you, call you or otherwise insert himself into your life.

You can insist all communication is via email and have a friend vet the emails to ensure they are about contact with your child. Friend can return any abusive emails and tell him he will have to remove the abuse before it will be forwarded. Do not give him any details about your life - where you are going, who you are going with, who you're seeing, etc. You may need to let him know when you are busy and when you aren't to facilitate access, but you don't have to tell him what you're doing - whether you're at work or seeing someone is none of his business. If you go out on a Friday night it is none of his business. If you shag his friend it is none of his business (though the latter might not be wise - moving your life so it bumps up against his less would probably be better for you.

Let him take you to court.

Talk to the police again and let them speak to him.

Stop feeling sorry for him. Stop trying to make peace. It's bad for you. It's bad for your daughter.

This is spot on. Please take note and protect yourself and your daughter from this toxic behaviour.

Huh? He's not invited! You just tell him that.

Tell him when he can collect dd and when you need her back. Do NOT let him set foot in your house.

You sound like a classic abuse victim, pandering to her abuser because she's used so used to living in his world she has no idea who she is, as a separate human being.

Well you are separate now. You're exes. Live your life, be a person. Hard work sometimes but rewarding.

@Bunnyfuller

Sounds like you are trying to keep ties between you and him.

No it really doesn't. It sounds like he's a manipulative person. Don't victim shame.

Op you can do this. Just say no and tell him what he can have eg DD from 3pm or something.

I just can't work out why there is 2% who can't see that this is ridiculous.
Stick to your guns, OP.

Can you arrange for you and DD to have dinner at someone else's place this year to break his expectations?

Op the reason you gave us and the reason you gave him are worded very differently.
It sounds like you're afraid of upsetting him and you're apologetic to him.
He's an abuser - you need to be more assertive and do not apologise or make excuses. You don't need an excuse not to have someone over for Xmas- you're an adult.

To add- tell him the doors will be locked and if he does try to force himself into your house you shall be calling the police immediately.

It sounds like you have some issues here yourself op.
He is manipulating you and you are allowing far too much.
Please get help with your boundary’s. It’s not normal to spend Xmas with your ex nor should you be made to feel bad for saying no more.

@PandorasMailbox

How long are you going to let this continue? Until she's 10, 12, 15 18?

This is giving your daughter a false sense of your relationship with her father. Stop this charade right now. You owe him absolutely nothing.

He didn't want commitment and you certainly don't owe him any.

I've not read your backstory OP but I think that @TurkeyRoastvBubbleandSqueek 's comments are very wise iindeed.

As to 'how long could this continue'.
My Ds is 17, my dd 14.
My (now) ex was hopeless with them when little so I ended up 'doing it all'. They have ASD so I couldn't work as ex wouldn't share the load)
5 years ago I left him. Moved 50 miles away. He visited them at my house as they hated 'going back' to visit (ASD so not just re him)
This summer I moved back to the area (NOT HIM!). He now lives 8m away from us. Has he, even x1 , had them for tea / Sunday lunch? No.
Guess where he 'expects' to have his Christmas Meal this year?
Knock it on the head now. It's much harder when there is a pattern set didn('t separate until kids about 10/12 then visiting re reasons above)
Then you can be portrayed as 'mean Mummy' not letting us have our Lovely Christmas Meal Together when actually there is an atmosphere unless you are skivvying & missing time with your child.

@gogohm

Suggest he comes around for a couple of hours, maybe takes her to the park whilst you have some time to prep dinner, then he goes. That said I had my ex for dinner at first, feel guilty not to invite him this year but not feasible due to distance as I've moved, would be odd but dp gets on ok with him

Why suggest OP has an abusive man to her house? I don’t get it.

I've skimmed both other threads and read this one, OP.

What an abusive, controlling bastard he is. I started typing them out in a list but got a sore hand so deleted again.

I sincerely hope for you and your DD that 2022 is the year you starr to break free.

As other OPs have said, what do you think would help you achieve this? Do you have good family support? What can we do?

I have been through similar.

In no particular order the following were necessary to get my life back

Police reporting harassment every time.
Courts with court order
Therapy (talking to the samaritans regularly at one point really helped)
The freedom programe re my own boundaries
No contact
Intermediary for hand overs
Blocked on everything

No to the Christmas Dinner and no to coming round to see her open presents if that's his plan, tell him he can pick DD up after lunch and take her to his dad's for a few hours. (that'll give you a couple of hours to clean up, watch a movie with a glass of baileys and a box of chocs 😉)
Also stop facilitating access in your home, cut him loose, don't let him intrude into your home life with DD, he can pick her up on a Saturday at the door. Then grey rock him unless it's an issue with DD, access etc, ignore shitty texts (but save them), don't engage with him, your life is absolutely nothing to do with him, he doesn't get to dictate Christmas or access to your home just because DD lives there.
Get an access plan in place but be prepared to have to share holidays (Christmas etc) & birthdays.
If you don't act now this will be your life forever.
You can't change people but you can change how you react or how much they can effect you, be strong, put your foot down, grey rock him

This is all about control over you and nothing about your daughter.
Text him just saying that you will be having Christmas dinner without him this year . Don't dress it up, make excuses etc just stick to the one liner .
Please change your mobile number and create a new email address through which to communicate through.
This is not healthy for your daughter .
Please please start to stick up for your self and take back all the control he seems to have over you.

@Velvian

To be fair, I think OP saying you can't come for Christmas lunch is her starting to follow the advice she has been given. It is incredibly hard to see the wood for the trees when you are being manipulated and controlled by your child's father. You can never cut contact entirely.

My ExH always had back up on his pronouncements about what I should be doing. His parents "thought the same", so and so was "shocked" that I "didn't put DC first"...

I still don't know if he is entirely out of my head nearly 2 decades later.

@scorpiogirly, he is the reason your DD doesn't have a mum and dad together, he did not want to commit, he now needs to live with the consequences of his actions. Stay strong, you are right not to have him over for Christmas dinner.

Yes I agree. Just wanted to post a message of support to OP.

It probably is difficult from the outside to see what a hard situation it is.

I've been ina very similar situation for many years- plus therapy for 4 years. So it is quite hard to urgently get boundaries as some previous posters have advised.

Basically I spoke to Women’s aid quite a lot- that was a big mind shift for me- as I thought as I'd already left him I didn't need support with domestic abuse, but I did.

Then when I tried to put boundaries in place about him not coming to my house- he obviously ignored them, and that escalated quite quickly to a non molestation order. Now we're on the brink of going to court for a custody arrangement.

So I suppose I'm saying it can be a long road to what seems like a no- brainier to other people.

But saying things like 'grow a backbone' etc are not helpful- getting abused by others for already being abused by an abuser does not help you get out of a situation.

Freedom programme is a great idea.

Breaking free is clearly really hard for you. But the hardest things to do are often the best for us.
I would work out what time you are happy for him to collect DD and send him a message telling him that. Then block him until half an hour before that time on xmas day. If he comes round call the police.
Then next year look at changing all your arrangements. Make 2022 the year he never enters your house. You will be happier and so will DD. Don’t you want that??

Absolutely not!! Me and dd's dad get on well, we recently spent a day out together with dd and our partners and we definitely would not have Christmas dinner together! I also have dd every year for Christmas Dinner, I do 99% of the shit work/bad cop all year and that's one day I won't give up. Dd goes to her dads around 6pm Christmas day.

I don’t think you realise the relationship dynamics at play here @scorpiogirly, this man is a controlling arsehole, he’s tried to control you over and over and you’re not shutting it down.

The Christmas do thing, that was a block and ftfo moment.

he has no right to dictate ANY part of your life. None of it

Not your social life, not your work life, not your parenting, nothing.

Can you get a new phone number? Migrate everyone else to the new number and just leave the old number for him? Or tell him that you will allow him access on certain days/times and he is only to contact you regarding your dd, anything else will be ignored.

He won’t be crossing your threshold again, and no, he doesn’t have to like it, your home is your business and he’s not welcome in it.

He can either accept this or not. If not, there will be no contact and he will have to go to court. He’s using access to try to control you through your daughter. From now on, contact etc is all on your terms.

Putting an Order in place (via court) for the DCs was the best thing my OH and his ExW ever did.

You obviously don’t just walk into court, you’re required to try mediation first. But that won’t be forced on you. My OH and his ExW were NO WHERE NEAR as f*cked up as you and your ex, but with only a gentle steer from the solicitor, the mediator recommended that the parties should not go through mediation.

The court set all the terms of the order, which I think were really very reasonable.

Christmas - the DCs to spend alternate Xmas day with the parents. And it expressly says that the DC may not move between houses on Xmas day.

It wasn’t horrendously expensive either. I want to say about £2k? That might be excluding court fees. It was an invaluable investment to stop the arguing between the parents and give the DCs routine and certainty.

It doesn’t solve the other problem - you need to find out how you can begin to say no and set boundaries in place.

No is a complete sentence. Say no to everything, don’t have him in your house, he can take u to court and set up proper visitation for him that doesn’t involve him sitting his arse in your house expecting you to cook his Christmas dinner. No!