To ask how important is your career

[LifeIsWhat]

The thing is, I like my work, it gives me a sense of satisfaction, financial security, belonging and I am quite good at it. However, I also worried that I hide behind it to make up/ignore the other missing part of my life, for example, a patter, kids, family, which are also important but I am less capable of obtaining.

What is your experience and please share your thoughts and advice.
Thank you very much.

[quote Corbally]@twinkletoesbluesky, with respect, let me suggest you’re seeing largely imaginary distinctions between types of language development and ‘manners’. Surely if you WFH, your three year old is in childcare? I can’t imagine doing any significant work from home if not.[/quote]
No my child isn't in childcare, I am able to WFH and look after my child at the same time. She's 3 years and 4 months and doesn't go to nursery either. We teach her at home and look after her between myself and OH who also works from home. She is well behaved. I work in a financial role and am able to complete 'meaningful' work as you call it.

No my child isn't in childcare, I am able to WFH and look after my child at the same time. She's 3 years and 4 months and doesn't go to nursery either.

That is absolutely bull shit, it is simply not possible to work and look after a child of that age and be doing both things well, either your job is very basic or you're not giving her enough attention. There is a very good reason most employers do not allow childcare in WFH policies and I'm extremely surprised by your brazen admission.

Unless you and your DH are able to tag-team in terms of you working 8 till 4 and him doing 4 till midnight (or you’re both part-time), I genuinely don’t see how you can WFH and look after a small child and do either properly.

I mean, we’ve all managed it in emergencies, or for very short term periods — DH and I combined full-on FT jobs and homeschooling in a tiny Airbnb after moving countries just before the first lockdown — but it wouldn’t have been at all feasible longterm.

Sorry, that was to @twinkletoesbluesky

@U8976532

No my child isn't in childcare, I am able to WFH and look after my child at the same time. She's 3 years and 4 months and doesn't go to nursery either.

That is absolutely bull shit, it is simply not possible to work and look after a child of that age and be doing both things well, either your job is very basic or you're not giving her enough attention. There is a very good reason most employers do not allow childcare in WFH policies and I'm extremely surprised by your brazen admission.

It may not be possible for you, but my child is cared for to a very high standard and all my work tasks are completed to a very high standard, in good time with good accuracy. It just shows that people can't multitask. On top of all that, she is highly developed and flourishing from being with her parents. I do have help from my OH with looking after her during the day too so it's not just me on my own. I'm sorry you find it hard to believe and 'brazen' but you are completely ignorant if you think that it's not possible. Perhaps if my DD was constantly naughty or didn't listen then I'd agree with you but that is not the case at all.

@Corbally

Unless you and your DH are able to tag-team in terms of you working 8 till 4 and him doing 4 till midnight (or you’re both part-time), I genuinely don’t see how you can WFH and look after a small child and do either properly.

I mean, we’ve all managed it in emergencies, or for very short term periods — DH and I combined full-on FT jobs and homeschooling in a tiny Airbnb after moving countries just before the first lockdown — but it wouldn’t have been at all feasible longterm.

My OH has flexibility with his work so is not working full on from 9-5, it's as and when BUT we are both WFH and caring/teaching our child so it is possible. We do work together very well and support one another to facilitate this.

@twinkletoesbluesky

I'm a bit confused about what your argument is here tbh: on the one hand you are saying that having a career (as opposed to a "job") is detrimental to the development and mental health of children (citing anecdata based an an n of 2). You identify another mother (who is on her own so probably doesn't have any choice) as an example of what goes wrong when women have a career.

On the other hand by your own admission you work without childcare and therefore however efficient you may be there is by your own standards some dilution of the quality of your focus on your child because you are doing two things t the same time.

Are you therefore arguing that its better to balance a low paid and uninteresting job while you do your own childcare than a well paid and more stimulating one? I can't really see the logic of that to be honest.

If we assume for the sake of argument that you are able to juggle both of these at the same time and I'm not saying you're not because I have done it then why would it be preferable to have a poorer job than a better one?

Also final question: what would you suggest I do? I'm a FT working (from home) single mother. I have a good and well-paid career that supports my DD. I don't have any other source of income so stopping work is not an option for me. Should I chuck in my well-paid and fulfilling career for a less well paid, less fulfilling one just so I can reassure myself I have a "job" rather than a career? Would that make me a better mother?

@twinkletoesbluesky you're taking absolute bull shit, I can't believe you think it's better for your child's development to be passed around two parents with other commitments than being in a child centred setting, with qualified staff and children her own age to play with. You are completely delusional to think that is appropriate, you're just trying to kid yourself when you just don't want to pay for childcare,

I'm really concerned parents think post Covid that WFH is a viable alternative to appropriate childcare.

[quote thepeopleversuswork]@twinkletoesbluesky

I'm a bit confused about what your argument is here tbh: on the one hand you are saying that having a career (as opposed to a "job") is detrimental to the development and mental health of children (citing anecdata based an an n of 2). You identify another mother (who is on her own so probably doesn't have any choice) as an example of what goes wrong when women have a career.

On the other hand by your own admission you work without childcare and therefore however efficient you may be there is by your own standards some dilution of the quality of your focus on your child because you are doing two things t the same time.

Are you therefore arguing that its better to balance a low paid and uninteresting job while you do your own childcare than a well paid and more stimulating one? I can't really see the logic of that to be honest.

If we assume for the sake of argument that you are able to juggle both of these at the same time and I'm not saying you're not because I have done it then why would it be preferable to have a poorer job than a better one?

Also final question: what would you suggest I do? I'm a FT working (from home) single mother. I have a good and well-paid career that supports my DD. I don't have any other source of income so stopping work is not an option for me. Should I chuck in my well-paid and fulfilling career for a less well paid, less fulfilling one just so I can reassure myself I have a "job" rather than a career? Would that make me a better mother?[/quote]
No I personally think, that if there was a choice IF being the operative word, a child is much better off with their parents. I understand that some people aren't/can't do this for whatever reason and have to make suitable arrangements. I don't think those that do that are bad parents but I do think that a child is better off with their parents than with strangers. I don't care if they are 'qualified' that doesn't mean I trust their judgement or skills. There are crazy people out there. I am not delusional and my child is absolutely priority. I think it's narrow minded to think that just because our situation works for us then I'm completely bat shit crazy. The whole point of the original post was having a family vs work, all of this other stuff is irrelevant

[quote U8976532]@twinkletoesbluesky you're taking absolute bull shit, I can't believe you think it's better for your child's development to be passed around two parents with other commitments than being in a child centred setting, with qualified staff and children her own age to play with. You are completely delusional to think that is appropriate, you're just trying to kid yourself when you just don't want to pay for childcare,

I'm really concerned parents think post Covid that WFH is a viable alternative to appropriate childcare.[/quote]
I am definitely not delusional. My child doesn't get passed between 2 parents, we both have her absolute best interest at heart. I would pay for childcare if I truly thought it would benefit her but for me my reasons are:

1. why would I send her to strangers when I don't have to?
2. Are they going to teach, love and care for her the same as me or her dad?
3. I don't get why people have children if they don't want to be around them and spend time with them.
4. I could send her to Nursery for FREE but I choose not to because I don't believe they can look after her better than we can
5. She gets lots of social interaction with other children
6. I also plan on home schooling her when the time comes

I don't get why people are SO judgemental. I understand people's positions financially are varied and they have to do what's right for them but that doesn't mean my situation is wrong at all

My job is who I am, it’s my identity. I’m in a very competitive field of the performing arts industry and it’s just not something you can switch off from at 5pm. You go home and are still spending your free time doing some parts of your job, doing online research or watching other people do what you do and trying to learn more from it. Sorry can’t be more specific without saying what the job is

I do try to separate it from my private life somewhat, but it’s very difficult to maintain relationship or even friendships, with someone who doesn’t ‘get’ it. It’s just not something you can switch off from just like that.

I’m still very young, but my direct manager has 5 children and was up and ‘doing’ some of her job at home within weeks. She came back to work at 3 months postpartum after each child. She’s an amazing mother and she loves her kids and her family, but she’d be lost without doing what she does. That’s how most people in our industry work. And subsequently, their children It’s not something that doesn’t influence your life, when you’ve been doing it since you were four years old.

@twinkletoesbluesky

Sorry, but you're the one who's coming off as judgemental.

3) I don't get why people have children if they don't want to be around them and spend time with them.

This is an ignorant insult which is just thrown out to hurt and there's so many things wrong with this its hard to know where to start:

• People who have careers also manage to be around and spend time with their children.

• Millions of children thrive in paid childcare with trained professionals. There is no reliable longitudinal evidence whatsoever that children in good quality childcare have poorer outcomes than those whose parents remain at home

• Lots of people don't have a choice and are forced to work to support their children. I didn't intend to work as much as I do: I have to because I can't rely on anyone else for money. Does that mean I should have my child removed?

• Also your own logic on this is flawed because on the one hand you say people shouldn't have children if they don't want to spend time with them but on the other by your own admission you are working when you are looking after your children.

If you're going to accuse other people of being judgemental you might want to check yourself first.

@twinkletoesbluesky but you can't be there for your child, you are working!! It's completely selfish to your employer and child. Childcare providers aren't strangers and they can actually focus on your child, I can't believe you're throwing your own judgement around when you're in such a ridiculous situation.

It's not the point of the thread so I will leave it there for the OP's sake.

It changes. 25 years ago it was my everything. I’m now closer to 60 than 55 and counting the months (years 😟) until retirement.

@twinkletoesbluesky, but your employer isn’t paying you to ‘multitask’, presumably — they are paying for your whole attention and concentration during work hours, and if you’re concurrently caring for a small child, then your employer is paying you to spend some significant portion of your working week doing something of no benefit to them. It’s puzzling why any employer would allow this situation, let alone two. Or why you think that being at home with two working parents who plan to homeschool her once she’s of school age is of benefit to your child, rather than a childminder, nursery or preschool, and then school.

You sound incredibly suspicious of other people who might potentially be in your child’s life.

My career used to be important to me. I always wanted one and never really found my feet in my 20's, just did shit jobs. I went to uni, then took another shit job while I had my first DC I moved into what felt like a job with some progression, but got unexpectedly pregnant again with my DC who is 3.

I am on my arse now tbh. Feel very burnt out, more with working through the pandemic and brining up my son who hasn't been an easy child and most likely has SN. I've often been dumped with the kids when they are ill (I wfh) and have still had to work. My OH still went to work during lockdowns, so I had to homeschool too. I don't live in the biggest place and would say we are a bit overcrowded, and just feel surrounded by mess and chaos while I'm trying to work. It has really knocked my confidence to be honest. I'm quite down about it all. I'm just hoping I get my mojo back soon.

My job isn't very highly paid,just average, it isn't the most demanding and I don't often need to do OT, but I really need a bloody break. If I had to work out of the home, at least I can focus better. It's like my mind refuses to engage with work anymore. I hope a break over Christmas sorts me out. Sadly, due to feeling like this, I don't feel like I can step up and take on a more challenging role, but I feel that boredom and despondency it what is making me feel like this, so it's catch 22.

So I guess in summary, normally my career is important to me, but I'm starting to wonder if it is all worth it as I feel like a failure as a mother and I don't feel great at work either. I hate the feeling like I'm crap at everything, which I feel is part of trying to do too much as FT working parent.

@Corbally

My work is consumingly important to me, and this has never wavered through different jobs and different life stages — I’m 49, and happily married with a nine-year-old. I don’t think I’ve ever used work to ‘hide’ from anything — it’s not some kind of shield from life for me, it’s a central part of my life. I think it’s psychologically healthy to find deep satisfaction in your work, and am slightly uneasy that the OP may be getting the message from the thread that work is important chiefly when you’re young and/or don’t have a family. I mean, I’m not dismissing people’s lived experiences, but I wouldn’t like the OP think that work necessarily falls away as a priority depending on your age or status as parent/spouse. It certainly hasn’t in my own case, and I would say that many of my friends, like me, have found the constraints parenthood puts on your time makes for more productivity.

OP, why is it you think you ‘hide’ I work from other aspects of your life like relationships or parenthood? Are you saying your job literally leaves you no time to date, for example?

Absolutely this. I am also 49, highly educated and with an interesting and intellectually stimulating career. I work for myself which is something I have built over 15 years. Family and home life are important but I am the main earner and would not be without the validation my work brings. This thread is interesting as it shows the choices that women have these days but I’d also argue that having children later, when your career is established, gives you the most choices in life.

I like mine and think a good career is useful to have as part of a balanced life.

However it cannot be your whole life - if you want a partner/family, then you have to take action eg start dating.

@Luredbyapomegranate

I like mine and think a good career is useful to have as part of a balanced life.

However it cannot be your whole life - if you want a partner/family, then you have to take action eg start dating.

But comparing to find love, career is much easier and give you fair return. ...

Was very important to me in my twenties and glad I got it well established before I had children because that changes everything in terms of progression and pay (PT hours etc). Took some time out after baby number three as lost parents too and just wanted to enjoy last baby rather than putting them in nursery to scream at handover which made me feel like shit. I think managing a career and a family is an incredibly difficult thing to do as there are just so many demands coming at you from every direction. I like aspects of my job and it gives me a sense of satisfaction but the main thing is I’ve got a career to fall back on of my husband died or fucked off or I needed to leave him. For me that’s why it’s important. Everyone no matter how wonderful at their job is replaceable - you aren’t replaceable to your family.. so for me that’s where my priority will always be.

I used to think career was really important but now consider it a means to do what I want in life -ie provide money, sometimes it’s interesting but not a passion.

My passions are my identity, you’re very lucky if your career is your true passion/will

I think I was probably the same when single. I’ve focused on different things at different times of my life which is surely true for most of us to some extent.

I'm quite disillusioned with mine now, and think I've done a disservice to both my kids and my career by trying to do both at once. BUT I would never advise any woman to be without...my job isn't highly paid but I can support the dc on my own should I need to

After being a SAHM for 7 years and being thoroughly bored for the last 2, I went to college and I’m now in my final year at Uni (so 4 years study).

It’s a huge part of my identity. The lockdowns last year sent my already shite MH down the drain because I was, again, a SAHM, only with my degree to teach myself (STEM) and 3DC to “homeschool” as well as run the house.

Utterly miserable and I’ve only just started to recover.

My job is hugely important to me. It’s my passion and I couldn’t imagine doing anything else. I’ve reduced my working week to 4 days since having a second child but I honestly couldn’t reduce any more than that because I’d miss it too much.

I love working.